Strelka -- Open source

[Aleks Peshkov]

Strelka is not open source yet, so it is useless to discuss it source code identity.

Open source release of Belka/Strelka is only rumors from unofficial source.

[Alexander Schmidt]

What your opinion: Strelka is clone Rybka 1.0 beta?

No doubt:

http://talkchess.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 91&t=14925

Happy new year too

Alex

[GenoM]

What your opinion: Strelka is clone Rybka 1.0 beta?

No doubt:

http://talkchess.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 91&t=14925

Happy new year too

Alex

It'd be very interresting what would you say after Strelka becaming open-source and all will see that it's rewritten Fruit... Would you finish logical chain then or will stay silent?
Happy New Year!

[Alexander Schmidt]

It'd be very interresting what would you say after Strelka becaming open-source and all will see that it's rewritten Fruit... Would you finish logical chain then or will stay silent?

Just read my messages before complaining...

http://talkchess.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 76&t=18620

Alex

[GenoM]

It'd be very interresting what would you say after Strelka becaming open-source and all will see that it's rewritten Fruit... Would you finish logical chain then or will stay silent?

Just read my messages before complaining...

http://talkchess.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 76&t=18620

Alex

Thanks, I re-read it but I'm still missing evidence that Strelka have parts of Rybka code.

[Alexander Schmidt]

Thanks, I re-read it but I'm still missing evidence that Strelka have parts of Rybka code.

Then re-read this message:

http://talkchess.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 91&t=18620

same score in all KvK positions is evidence, that there is taken a huge part of evaluation. Not just ideas, but exact the same values. BTW same behaviour in other endgame positions, KBvK if I remember right and others.

Alex

[Orlov]

Thanks, I re-read it but I'm still missing evidence that Strelka have parts of Rybka code.

Then re-read this message:

http://talkchess.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 91&t=18620

same score in all KvK positions is evidence, that there is taken a huge part of evaluation. Not just ideas, but exact the same values. BTW same behaviour in other endgame positions, KBvK if I remember right and others.

Alex

Alex!
I think toga (early versions) will work approximately also.
You try toga or fruit on these positions?

[hristo]

However, disassembly with the intent to obtain intellectual property, to which you have no entitlement, is more than likely illegal.

I doubt this, as most license agreements do explicitly mention decompilation or disassembling as something that is forbidden. And why would they do that if that is already automatically the case?

Indeed there is such a clause in many EULA.
The main reason for that is "lawyering", IMO, for they try to protect a product from many different angles -- the intent of the decompilation clauses is often more then just stealing IP, but also includes bypassing or augmenting software features (for instance disable registration).

The act of decompilation is, in itself, not illegal, however what you do with the output can make it so. For instance there is nothing illegal if you decompile the code and then print the output and make wallpaper out of it, or ASCII art.

If there was a direct equivalence between the right to decompile and the right to steal the IP then one should consider debuggers and also that there are people who can read machine executable code.

I don't think that the right to decompile, use a debugger, or a hex editor translates into a right to obtain the IP contained in the code.

The decompilation clause is just another tool in the lawyers hands to protect the software from many different infringements, but it is not the primary (or even secondary) tool for protecting IP -- copyright, patents, etc. are the primary tools.

Finally,
it is also possible to obtain software without actually agreeing to the EULA and hence one can do things that were otherwise explicitly forbidden in the EULA, but that would still not allow one to steal the IP -- and if you go to court you would probably lose simply because IP is protected outside the EULA.

Regards,
Hristo

[Uri Blass]

What your opinion: Strelka is clone Rybka 1.0 beta?

No doubt:

http://talkchess.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 91&t=14925

Happy new year too

Alex

It'd be very interresting what would you say after Strelka becaming open-source and all will see that it's rewritten Fruit... Would you finish logical chain then or will stay silent?
Happy New Year!

All will see?

I saw strelka's code and I do not see that it is rewritten fruit.
If it is released then you will need to explain also how you got the conclusion that it is rewritten fruit to convince programmers about it.

The fact that there is similiarity in evaluation components does not mean that it is rewritten fruit.
Ideas are free to use and using fruit's evaluation rules with different weights in a different structure that is clearly not copy and past from fruit is clearly allowed.

Uri

[slobo]

It seems Bright is a little stronger than Belka.
And what to say now? That Bright is a clone of a newer Rybka´s version ?

[Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "XP"]
[Date "2007.12.31"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Belka 1.8.13"]
[Black "Bright 0.2c"]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "D38"]
[Opening "QGD"]
[Time "19:12:05"]
[Variation "Ragozin, 5.Qa4+ Nc6 6.cxd5 exd5 7.Bg5"]
[TimeControl "300+3"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "140"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "human"]

1. c4 Nf6 2. d4 e6 3. Nf3 d5 4. Nc3 Bb4 5. cxd5 exd5 6. Qa4 Nc6 7. Ne5 Bd7
8. Nxc6 Bxc3 9. bxc3 Bxc6 10. Qc2 O-O 11. e3 Qd7 12. Be2 Bb5 13. O-O Bxe2
14. Qxe2 Qc6 15. Bb2 Ne4 16. Qd3 Rfe8 17. f3 Nd6 18. Rae1 a5 19. Qc2 Re6
20. Bc1 Rae8 21. Re2 Qc4 22. Ree1 g6 23. Kf2 Kg7 24. Bd2 Qc6 25. Re2 Nc4
26. Rh1 Qd6 27. Qd3 b5 28. h4 h5 29. f4 Re4 30. Bc1 c6 31. Rh3 Qe6 32. Qd1
Qf5 33. Qc2 a4 34. Qd1 Kh8 35. Qc2 Kh7 36. Qd1 Kg7 37. Qc2 Qg4 38. Qd1 R4e6
39. Bd2 Nd6 40. Kf1 Nf5 41. Qe1 a3 42. Qf2 Nd6 43. Qe1 Ne4 44. Bc1 Ra8 45.
Rc2 Qf5 46. Qd1 Ree8 47. Bd2 Qg4 48. Qc1 Ng3 49. Kf2 Nf5 50. Qh1 Nd6 51.
Qc1 Re4 52. Qh1 Rae8 53. Qf1 Nf5 54. Bc1 Nxh4 55. Bxa3 Rxe3 56. Rxe3 Qxf4
57. Rf3 Nxf3 58. gxf3 Qh4 59. Kg2 Re1 60. Qf2 Qh1 61. Kg3 g5 62. Rc1 Rxc1
63. Bxc1 Qxc1 64. Qh2 h4 65. Kg4 Qe3 66. Qe5 Qxe5 67. dxe5 c5 68. f4 d4 69.
cxd4 cxd4 70. fxg5 h3 {0-1 User Adjudication} 0-1