A Question for Our Sponsor..IPPO Links OK or Not??

[Graham Banks]

Why won't any of these people put their names to what they claim?

perhaps because they know that anyone on "that side" of the discussion is subject to massive attacks??? --by a select few???

From what I've see both here and in the new forum, most of the vicious and unsavoury posts actually come from some who support the questionable engines.

[bob]

Why won't any of these people put their names to what they claim?

perhaps because they know that anyone on "that side" of the discussion is subject to massive attacks??? --by a select few???

From what I've see both here and in the new forum, most of the vicious and unsavoury posts actually come from some who support the questionable engines.

There's plenty of that on both sides. But anyone that says "clone" will get flamed due to no evidence. Anyone that says "not clone" will get flamed for saying "not clone." There is not enough evidence to make a decision with any high degree of certainty. Best solution is to not make a decision at all until the situation resolves a bit.

[bob]

the fact that virtually every aspect of R1 is directly from Fruit gives a very clear picture.

Funny thing is that Ryan (Fruit) tells me that these claims are grossly exaggerated, but nobody seems prepared to listen to what he has had to say or believe it.

Because many of us have a functional set of eyes, and a functional brain, and we can look at the programs and compare them. If I have a baseball bat and a fork laying on the table, I don't need your opinion as to which is which, any more than I need anyone else's. In fact, you can plead from now on that that baseball bat is really a soup spoon, and you can get others to support your claim, but it won't make it true. The old "seeing is believing" fits here.

[Milos]

Without seeing what was actually done, I do not think we can say which process was more or would be more difficult.

I would say that is a just pure rationalization. The ones with proper knowledge can say with quite a bit of certainty without seeing the actual sources just by comparing binaries.
The other will of course wait for their own experts' opinion indefinitely and continue to rationalize.

[Robert Flesher]

Why won't any of these people put their names to what they claim?

perhaps because they know that anyone on "that side" of the discussion is subject to massive attacks??? --by a select few???

From what I've see both here and in the new forum, most of the vicious and unsavoury posts actually come from some who support the questionable engines.

Graham, it seems you think there is some duality at work here. Perhaps I can agree with this, but not in the way you paint the picture. Alot of us do not support anyone or any engine (as you would suggest), we search for the truth and do not condemn an engine without proof (which has been done here). There is a difference, although I suspect some cannot see this.

In the current situation it comes down to what is fair and just, the evidence against Rybka (Btw, I purchased Rybka <--- unbiased love for computer chess) is the same as that against Ipp and family. So why is it ok for Vas to use Fruit, and lie about it, then when others do it to Rybka it becomes a crime? Bullshit! double standard!

[swami]

the fact that virtually every aspect of R1 is directly from Fruit gives a very clear picture.

Funny thing is that Ryan (Fruit) tells me that these claims are grossly exaggerated, but nobody seems prepared to listen to what he has had to say or believe it.

Fruit is "Open-Source". Isn't it? I do respect Ryan but why do you make it sound as if Ryan's opinion is worth more than opinion of several other programmers?

Zach (that studied Fruit), Christophe Theron (that studied Fruit), Bob (that studied Fruit) and other programmers (who studied Fruit) have done extensive research and made a lot of stuff available in the webpage.

[Graham Banks]

the fact that virtually every aspect of R1 is directly from Fruit gives a very clear picture.

Funny thing is that Ryan (Fruit) tells me that these claims are grossly exaggerated, but nobody seems prepared to listen to what he has had to say or believe it.

Fruit is "Open-Source". Isn't it? I do respect Ryan but why do you make it sound as if Ryan's opinion is worth more than opinion of several other programmers?

Zach (that studied Fruit), Christophe Theron (that studied Fruit), Bob (that studied Fruit) and other programmers (who studied Fruit) have done extensive research and made a lot of stuff available in the webpage.

Can you please provide the link so that I can pass it on to Ryan. Considering that he's been the Fruit author since Fabien handed over the reins, his opinion should surely be taken into account.

Cheers,
Graham.

[swami]

the fact that virtually every aspect of R1 is directly from Fruit gives a very clear picture.

Funny thing is that Ryan (Fruit) tells me that these claims are grossly exaggerated, but nobody seems prepared to listen to what he has had to say or believe it.

Fruit is "Open-Source". Isn't it? I do respect Ryan but why do you make it sound as if Ryan's opinion is worth more than opinion of several other programmers?

Zach (that studied Fruit), Christophe Theron (that studied Fruit), Bob (that studied Fruit) and other programmers (who studied Fruit) have done extensive research and made a lot of stuff available in the webpage.

Can you please provide the link so that I can pass it on to Ryan. Considering that he's been the Fruit author since Fabien handed over the reins, his opinion should surely be taken into account.

Cheers,
Graham.

You mean Zach's webpage link? I have no idea where it is posted in. I hope somebody can post it. In the meantime I'll do a search....

[Graham Banks]

Can you please provide the link so that I can pass it on to Ryan. Considering that he's been the Fruit author since Fabien handed over the reins, his opinion should surely be taken into account.

Cheers,
Graham.

You mean Zach's webpage link? I have no idea where it is posted in. I hope somebody can post it. In the meantime I'll do a search....

Yes, hopefully somebody can post a link. That would be great.
I'll point him to the following thread in the meantime:
http://www.talkchess.com/forum/viewtopi ... highlight=

Cheers,
Graham.

[Mincho Georgiev]

https://webspace.utexas.edu/zzw57/rtc/eval/eval.html