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AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better
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Norman Schmidt



Joined: 29 May 2008
Posts: 1750

PostPost subject: Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better    Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:26 pm Reply to topic Reply with quote

Michael Sherwin wrote:
They can say or omit anything. One article definitely stated that a database of human games were loaded. I don't know what article is correct. I just know from years of experience with that type of learning that the moves in the games by AlphaZero against Stockfish has the same type and feel. Take what I said with a grain of salt but take what is said in those articles with a grain of salt as well.

Edit: Think about it in these terms. It took 4 hours for AlphaZero to amass all human knowledge about the game of chess. At one minute per move maybe 4 games of self play could have been accomplished. However, if 6 million games were loaded in and analysed then 4 hours is about the time it would take. Self play would take years to get to that level. 'Their' story does not add up!


No human games were loaded. Learning was accomplished thru millions of self-play games
The monte carlo search algorithm simply chose the move in each position with the highest win probability.

Code:
Mini-batches 700k 700k 700k
Training Time 9h 12h 34h
Training Games 44 million 24 million 21 million
Thinking Time 800 sims 800 sims 800 sims
40 ms 80 ms 200 ms


Table S3: Selected statistics of AlphaZero training in Chess, Shogi and Go

They used 5,000 first-generation TPUs to generate self-play games.
and 64 second-generation TPUs to train the neural networks.

They ended up with 44 million training games.
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Subject Author Date/Time
AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:45 am
      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Richard Delorme Thu Dec 07, 2017 12:16 pm
            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Thu Dec 07, 2017 12:29 pm
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Norman Schmidt Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:26 pm
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Norman Schmidt Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:34 pm
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better John Hartmann Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:40 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Norman Schmidt Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:00 pm
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:58 pm
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Milos Stanisavljevic Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:50 pm
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Norman Schmidt Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:27 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Milos Stanisavljevic Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:42 pm
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Norman Schmidt Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:57 pm
                                                Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Milos Stanisavljevic Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:07 pm
                                                      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Jacob Wilkins Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:42 pm
                                                            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Milos Stanisavljevic Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:47 pm
                                                                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Jacob Wilkins Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:52 pm
                                                                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Milos Stanisavljevic Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:03 pm
                                                                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Jacob Wilkins Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:10 pm
      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Steve Maughan Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:43 pm
            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:22 pm
      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Jon Dart Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:12 pm
            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:58 pm
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Fri Dec 08, 2017 12:15 am
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Fri Dec 08, 2017 7:18 am
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Werner Schüle Fri Dec 08, 2017 12:48 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Fri Dec 08, 2017 10:44 pm
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:25 pm
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:40 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:07 pm
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:29 pm
                                                Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:04 am
                                                      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:25 am
                                                            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Ian Osgood Sat Dec 09, 2017 4:03 pm
      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Fri Dec 08, 2017 10:34 pm
            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Fri Dec 08, 2017 10:57 pm
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:50 am
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:12 pm
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Sun Dec 10, 2017 2:32 pm
      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Daniel Shawul Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:47 pm
            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:23 am
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:54 am
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Erin Dame Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:43 am
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sat Dec 09, 2017 4:56 am
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Erin Dame Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:39 am
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:35 am
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Erin Dame Sat Dec 09, 2017 10:07 am
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better John Rebert Sat Dec 09, 2017 11:15 am
                                                Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Sat Dec 09, 2017 11:49 am
                                                Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:44 pm
                                                      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Erin Dame Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:52 pm
                                                            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:36 pm
                                                                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Erin Dame Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:40 pm
                                                                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better John Rebert Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:05 pm
                                                                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Robin Messemer Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:37 pm
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Erin Dame Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:38 pm
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Sat Dec 09, 2017 11:39 am
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better John Rebert Sat Dec 09, 2017 11:46 am
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:02 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better John Rebert Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:14 pm
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:59 pm
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:49 pm
      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Aloisio Ponti Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:36 pm
      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Pang Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:24 pm
            Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Sun Dec 10, 2017 11:15 pm
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Carl Langan Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:13 am
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:24 pm
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Ronald de Man Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:22 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:09 pm
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:52 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Uri Blass Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:14 pm
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Uri Blass Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:29 pm
                                          Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Tue Dec 12, 2017 5:59 pm
                                                Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Ronald de Man Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:47 pm
                                                      Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Wed Dec 13, 2017 8:45 am
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Ulysses P. Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:03 pm
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rasmus Althoff Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:21 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Ulysses P. Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:48 pm
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Mon Dec 11, 2017 2:58 am
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Mon Dec 11, 2017 3:33 pm
                        Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:39 am
                              Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Michael Sherwin Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:15 pm
                                    Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better Rodolfo Leoni Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:29 pm
                  Re: AlphaGo Zero And AlphaZero, RomiChess done better szabo, robert Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:11 pm
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