The King's Indian Defence again.

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Ajedrecista
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Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:04 pm
Location: Madrid, Spain.

The King's Indian Defence again.

Post by Ajedrecista »

Hello!

The King's Indian Defence is known to give problems to chess engines. I picked up the position from post #11 of this ImmortalChess thread and played Bd2-g5, Bg7-h6; BxB.

Analysis by Spark 1.0 w32 (using two cores) in an Intel Pentium D930 (3 GHz), with 512 MB of hash, running under Arena 2.0.1 GUI:

[d]r1bq1rk1/ppp5/3p1nnB/P1PPp2p/1P2P3/1QNN1Pp1/4B1P1/R4RK1 b - - 0 2
FEN: r1bq1rk1/ppp5/3p1nnB/P1PPp2p/1P2P3/1QNN1Pp1/4B1P1/R4RK1 b - - 0 2

Spark-1.0-win32-mp:
1 00:00 39 0 -6,47 d6xc5 Bh6xf8 Qd8xf8 Nd3xc5
1 00:00 87 0 -5,93 h5h4 Bh6xf8 Qd8xf8 c5xd6 c7xd6
1 00:00 107 0 -5,83 a7a6 Bh6xf8 Qd8xf8 c5xd6 c7xd6
1 00:00 222 0 -5,71 Bc8d7 Bh6xf8 Qd8xf8
1 00:00 247 0 -4,79 Rf8f7
2/1 00:00 380 0 -5,00 Rf8f7 f3f4
3/2 00:00 1.238 0 -4,95 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8e8
4/3 00:00 4.489 0 -5,03 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8f8 f3f4 e5xf4 Nd3xf4
5/4 00:00 5.530 0 -5,03 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8f8 f3f4 e5xf4 Nd3xf4
6/7 00:00 8.366 0 -5,03 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8f8 f3f4 e5xf4 Nd3xf4
7/11- 00:00 32.171 0 -5,28 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8f8 f3f4 e5xf4 Nd3xf4
7/13+ 00:00 56.749 520.633 -4,78 Nf6h7 c5xd6
7/13+ 00:00 59.763 548.284 -4,53 Nf6h7 Bh6f4
7/13+ 00:00 68.776 550.208 -3,53 Nf6h7 Bh6c1
7/13 00:00 92.286 591.576 -3,28 Nf6h7 Bh6e3 Qd8h4 Rf1c1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Be3g1 Ng6h4 Nd3e1 Bc8h3
8/13+ 00:00 95.320 611.025 -3,03 Nf6h7 Bh6e3
8/13 00:00 103.945 604.331 -2,90 Nf6h7 Nd3f2 g3xf2+ Rf1xf2 Rf8f7 a5a6 b7xa6 Be2xa6 Bc8xa6 Ra1xa6
9/13+ 00:00 120.177 639.239 -2,65 Nf6h7 Nd3f2
9/13+ 00:00 126.164 671.085 -2,40 Nf6h7 Nd3f2
9/16 00:00 187.820 668.398 -1,68 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Kf1e2 Qh1xg2+ Ke2e3 Rf8f7 Bd1e2 h5h4 Rb1g1
10/18 00:00 241.057 700.747 -1,77 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Kf1e2 Qh1xg2+ Ke2e3 Rf8f7 Bd1e2 Bc8h3 Rb1g1 Qg2h2
11/22 00:00 361.973 747.878 -1,75 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Kf1e2 Qh1xg2+ Ke2e3 Rf8f7 Bd1e2 Bc8h3 Rb1g1 Qg2h2 c5xd6 c7xd6
12/25 00:01 1.212.083 760.403 -1,72 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Ng6h4 Bh6xf8 Nh4xg2 Kf1e2 Nh7xf8 Ke2d2 Ng2h4+ Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Kd2e3
13/28- 00:05 3.980.408 779.097 -1,97 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Ng6h4 Bh6xf8 Nh4xg2 Kf1e2 Nh7xf8 Ke2d2 Ng2h4+ Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Kd2e3
13/32 00:09 6.909.834 759.823 -2,11 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Kf1e2 Qh1xg2+ Ke2e3 Rf8f6 Bd1e2 h5h4 Rc1g1 Qg2h2 Rg1h1 Qh2g2 c5xd6 c7xd6
14/32+ 00:10 8.504.604 785.427 -1,86 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
14/32+ 00:12 9.953.509 769.323 -1,61 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
14/32 00:17 13.635.999 761.532 -1,26 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 g2xh3 g3g2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Ke1d1 g2g1Q+ Be3xg1 Nf3xg1
15/32 00:22 17.818.084 776.793 -1,22 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 g2xh3 g3g2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Ke1d1 g2g1Q+ Be3xg1 Qh2xg1+ Kd1c2 Nf3d4+ Kc2b2
16/34+ 00:32 25.635.065 793.728 -0,97 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
16/34 00:38 30.689.405 789.113 -0,79 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 g2xh3 g3g2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Ke1d1 g2g1Q+ Be3xg1 Nf3xg1 c5xd6 Ng1xe2 Nc3xe2 c7xd6
17/39+ 01:02 50.173.376 801.773 -0,54 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
17/39+ 01:14 58.518.829 790.794 -0,29 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
17/39 01:39 78.745.490 789.056 -0,02 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 Bh6e3 h3xg2 Bd1e2 Ng6h4 Ke1d2 Nh4xf3+ Kd2c2 Nf3d4+ Be3xd4 e5xd4 c5xd6 Rf8f1 Qb3b1 d4xc3 Rc1xf1 g2xf1Q Qb1xf1 c7xd6 Kc2xc3
18/39 02:59 141.915.748 791.719 +0,05 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 g2xh3 g3g2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Be3f2 g2g1Q+ Bf2xg1 Qh2xg1+ Ke1d2 Qg1g2+ Kd2c1 Nh4xf3 Ra1a2 Qg2g5+ Kc1b2 Qg5d2+ Qb3c2 Bc8xh3 Bd1xf3 Qd2xc2+ Kb2xc2 Rf8xf3
19/44 04:07 197.382.516 796.350 +0,23 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 Bd1e2 h3xg2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Ke1d2 Nh4xf3+ Kd2c2 Nf3d4+ Be3xd4 e5xd4 c5xd6 d4xc3 d6xc7 g2g1R d5d6+ Rf8f7 Rb1xg1 Qh2xe2+ Kc2xc3
20/46+ 07:12 336.983.832 778.957 +0,48 Nf6h7 Rf1b1
20/46+ 08:42 400.425.903 766.250 +0,73 Nf6h7 Rf1b1
20/51 12:54 600.402.907 775.558 +0,83 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 Bd1e2 h3xg2 Bh6e3 Nh7g5 Ke1d2 Ng5xf3+ Kd2c2 Nf3d4+ Be3xd4 e5xd4 c5xd6 c7xd6 Rb1g1 d4xc3 Qb3xc3 Bc8d7 Kc2b2
20/51 15:00 707.386.569 785.766 +0,83 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 Bd1e2 h3xg2 Bh6e3 Nh7g5 Ke1d2 Ng5xf3+ Kd2c2 Nf3d4+ Be3xd4 e5xd4 c5xd6 c7xd6 Rb1g1 d4xc3 Qb3xc3 Bc8d7 Kc2b2
I stopped the analysis after fifteen minutes.

Black is a bishop down and Spark analyzes the position as a not lose for black! I guess that powerful hardware and good chess engines (Zappa, SF, Critter, Houdini, Komodo...) will agree with Spark, but anyway the control of d8-h4 diagonal by black queen is rather good! Please post more analysis, even analysis by Spark. You can also try the original position:

[d]r1bq1rk1/ppp3b1/3p1nn1/P1PPp2p/1P2P3/1QNN1Pp1/3BB1P1/R4RK1 w - - 0 1

Regards from Spain.

Ajedrecista.
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bob
Posts: 20943
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:30 pm
Location: Birmingham, AL

Re: The King's Indian Defence again.

Post by bob »

Ajedrecista wrote:Hello!

The King's Indian Defence is known to give problems to chess engines. I picked up the position from post #11 of this ImmortalChess thread and played Bd2-g5, Bg7-h6; BxB.

Analysis by Spark 1.0 w32 (using two cores) in an Intel Pentium D930 (3 GHz), with 512 MB of hash, running under Arena 2.0.1 GUI:

[d]r1bq1rk1/ppp5/3p1nnB/P1PPp2p/1P2P3/1QNN1Pp1/4B1P1/R4RK1 b - - 0 2
FEN: r1bq1rk1/ppp5/3p1nnB/P1PPp2p/1P2P3/1QNN1Pp1/4B1P1/R4RK1 b - - 0 2

Spark-1.0-win32-mp:
1 00:00 39 0 -6,47 d6xc5 Bh6xf8 Qd8xf8 Nd3xc5
1 00:00 87 0 -5,93 h5h4 Bh6xf8 Qd8xf8 c5xd6 c7xd6
1 00:00 107 0 -5,83 a7a6 Bh6xf8 Qd8xf8 c5xd6 c7xd6
1 00:00 222 0 -5,71 Bc8d7 Bh6xf8 Qd8xf8
1 00:00 247 0 -4,79 Rf8f7
2/1 00:00 380 0 -5,00 Rf8f7 f3f4
3/2 00:00 1.238 0 -4,95 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8e8
4/3 00:00 4.489 0 -5,03 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8f8 f3f4 e5xf4 Nd3xf4
5/4 00:00 5.530 0 -5,03 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8f8 f3f4 e5xf4 Nd3xf4
6/7 00:00 8.366 0 -5,03 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8f8 f3f4 e5xf4 Nd3xf4
7/11- 00:00 32.171 0 -5,28 Rf8f7 Bh6g5 Qd8f8 f3f4 e5xf4 Nd3xf4
7/13+ 00:00 56.749 520.633 -4,78 Nf6h7 c5xd6
7/13+ 00:00 59.763 548.284 -4,53 Nf6h7 Bh6f4
7/13+ 00:00 68.776 550.208 -3,53 Nf6h7 Bh6c1
7/13 00:00 92.286 591.576 -3,28 Nf6h7 Bh6e3 Qd8h4 Rf1c1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Be3g1 Ng6h4 Nd3e1 Bc8h3
8/13+ 00:00 95.320 611.025 -3,03 Nf6h7 Bh6e3
8/13 00:00 103.945 604.331 -2,90 Nf6h7 Nd3f2 g3xf2+ Rf1xf2 Rf8f7 a5a6 b7xa6 Be2xa6 Bc8xa6 Ra1xa6
9/13+ 00:00 120.177 639.239 -2,65 Nf6h7 Nd3f2
9/13+ 00:00 126.164 671.085 -2,40 Nf6h7 Nd3f2
9/16 00:00 187.820 668.398 -1,68 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Kf1e2 Qh1xg2+ Ke2e3 Rf8f7 Bd1e2 h5h4 Rb1g1
10/18 00:00 241.057 700.747 -1,77 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Kf1e2 Qh1xg2+ Ke2e3 Rf8f7 Bd1e2 Bc8h3 Rb1g1 Qg2h2
11/22 00:00 361.973 747.878 -1,75 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Kf1e2 Qh1xg2+ Ke2e3 Rf8f7 Bd1e2 Bc8h3 Rb1g1 Qg2h2 c5xd6 c7xd6
12/25 00:01 1.212.083 760.403 -1,72 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Ng6h4 Bh6xf8 Nh4xg2 Kf1e2 Nh7xf8 Ke2d2 Ng2h4+ Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Kd2e3
13/28- 00:05 3.980.408 779.097 -1,97 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Ng6h4 Bh6xf8 Nh4xg2 Kf1e2 Nh7xf8 Ke2d2 Ng2h4+ Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Kd2e3
13/32 00:09 6.909.834 759.823 -2,11 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 Qh2h1+ Kf1e2 Qh1xg2+ Ke2e3 Rf8f6 Bd1e2 h5h4 Rc1g1 Qg2h2 Rg1h1 Qh2g2 c5xd6 c7xd6
14/32+ 00:10 8.504.604 785.427 -1,86 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
14/32+ 00:12 9.953.509 769.323 -1,61 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
14/32 00:17 13.635.999 761.532 -1,26 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 g2xh3 g3g2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Ke1d1 g2g1Q+ Be3xg1 Nf3xg1
15/32 00:22 17.818.084 776.793 -1,22 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 g2xh3 g3g2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Ke1d1 g2g1Q+ Be3xg1 Qh2xg1+ Kd1c2 Nf3d4+ Kc2b2
16/34+ 00:32 25.635.065 793.728 -0,97 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
16/34 00:38 30.689.405 789.113 -0,79 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 g2xh3 g3g2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Bd1e2 Nh4xf3+ Ke1d1 g2g1Q+ Be3xg1 Nf3xg1 c5xd6 Ng1xe2 Nc3xe2 c7xd6
17/39+ 01:02 50.173.376 801.773 -0,54 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
17/39+ 01:14 58.518.829 790.794 -0,29 Nf6h7 Rf1c1
17/39 01:39 78.745.490 789.056 -0,02 Nf6h7 Rf1c1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 Bh6e3 h3xg2 Bd1e2 Ng6h4 Ke1d2 Nh4xf3+ Kd2c2 Nf3d4+ Be3xd4 e5xd4 c5xd6 Rf8f1 Qb3b1 d4xc3 Rc1xf1 g2xf1Q Qb1xf1 c7xd6 Kc2xc3
18/39 02:59 141.915.748 791.719 +0,05 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 g2xh3 g3g2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Be3f2 g2g1Q+ Bf2xg1 Qh2xg1+ Ke1d2 Qg1g2+ Kd2c1 Nh4xf3 Ra1a2 Qg2g5+ Kc1b2 Qg5d2+ Qb3c2 Bc8xh3 Bd1xf3 Qd2xc2+ Kb2xc2 Rf8xf3
19/44 04:07 197.382.516 796.350 +0,23 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 Bd1e2 h3xg2 Bh6e3 Ng6h4 Ke1d2 Nh4xf3+ Kd2c2 Nf3d4+ Be3xd4 e5xd4 c5xd6 d4xc3 d6xc7 g2g1R d5d6+ Rf8f7 Rb1xg1 Qh2xe2+ Kc2xc3
20/46+ 07:12 336.983.832 778.957 +0,48 Nf6h7 Rf1b1
20/46+ 08:42 400.425.903 766.250 +0,73 Nf6h7 Rf1b1
20/51 12:54 600.402.907 775.558 +0,83 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 Bd1e2 h3xg2 Bh6e3 Nh7g5 Ke1d2 Ng5xf3+ Kd2c2 Nf3d4+ Be3xd4 e5xd4 c5xd6 c7xd6 Rb1g1 d4xc3 Qb3xc3 Bc8d7 Kc2b2
20/51 15:00 707.386.569 785.766 +0,83 Nf6h7 Rf1b1 Qd8h4 Be2d1 Qh4h2+ Kg1f1 h5h4 Kf1e1 h4h3 Bd1e2 h3xg2 Bh6e3 Nh7g5 Ke1d2 Ng5xf3+ Kd2c2 Nf3d4+ Be3xd4 e5xd4 c5xd6 c7xd6 Rb1g1 d4xc3 Qb3xc3 Bc8d7 Kc2b2
I stopped the analysis after fifteen minutes.

Black is a bishop down and Spark analyzes the position as a not lose for black! I guess that powerful hardware and good chess engines (Zappa, SF, Critter, Houdini, Komodo...) will agree with Spark, but anyway the control of d8-h4 diagonal by black queen is rather good! Please post more analysis, even analysis by Spark. You can also try the original position:

[d]r1bq1rk1/ppp3b1/3p1nn1/P1PPp2p/1P2P3/1QNN1Pp1/3BB1P1/R4RK1 w - - 0 1

Regards from Spain.

Ajedrecista.
This does not seem tactically difficult. Crafty prefers Nh7 from the very beginning. It took 54 seconds for the eval to swing in black's favor, and after a deep search, it is more in black's favor:

Code: Select all

               14     0.37   2.05   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Qxg2+ 6. Ke1 Nf4
                                    7. Bxf4 Rxf4 8. cxd6 Qh1+ 9. Kd2 g2
                                    10. Be2
               14->   0.50   2.05   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Qxg2+ 6. Ke1 Nf4
                                    7. Bxf4 Rxf4 8. cxd6 Qh1+ 9. Kd2 g2
                                    10. Be2 (s=4)
               15     0.55     --   1. ... Nh7! (<+1.89)                  
               15     0.61   1.77   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Qxg2+ 6. Ke3 Rf7
                                    7. cxd6 cxd6 8. Nb5 Rf6 9. Rc7 h4 10.
                                    Qc4 (s=3)
               15->   0.67   1.77   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Qxg2+ 6. Ke3 Rf7
                                    7. cxd6 cxd6 8. Nb5 Rf6 9. Rc7 h4 10.
                                    Qc4
               16     0.80   1.63   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Qxg2+ 6. Ke1 Nf4
                                    7. Bxf4 exf4 8. cxd6 Qg1+ 9. Kd2 Qe3+
                                    10. Kc2 g2 11. Ne2 cxd6 12. Ndxf4 g1=Q
                                    13. Nxg1 Qxf4
               16->   1.14   1.63   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Qxg2+ 6. Ke1 Nf4
                                    7. Bxf4 exf4 8. cxd6 Qg1+ 9. Kd2 Qe3+
                                    10. Kc2 g2 11. Ne2 cxd6 12. Ndxf4 g1=Q
                                    13. Nxg1 Qxf4 (s=2)
               17     1.30   1.63   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Qxg2+ 6. Ke1 Nf4
                                    7. Bxf4 exf4 8. cxd6 Qg1+ 9. Kd2 Qe3+
                                    10. Kc2 g2 11. Ne2 cxd6 12. Ndxf4 g1=Q
                                    13. Nxg1 Qxf4
               17->   1.53   1.63   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Qxg2+ 6. Ke1 Nf4
                                    7. Bxf4 exf4 8. cxd6 Qg1+ 9. Kd2 Qe3+
                                    10. Kc2 g2 11. Ne2 cxd6 12. Ndxf4 g1=Q
                                    13. Nxg1 Qxf4 (s=3)
               18     1.67     ++   1. ... Nh7? (>+1.79)                  
               18     1.75     ++   1. ... Nh7? (>+1.95)                  
               18     2.25   2.12   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Rf6 6. Ne1 Nh4 7.
                                    Be3 Nxg2 8. Nxg2 Qxg2+ 9. Kd3 dxc5
                                    10. bxc5 h4 11. d6+ Be6 12. Qxb7 (s=2)
               18->   8.96   2.12   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Rf6 6. Ne1 Nh4 7.
                                    Be3 Nxg2 8. Nxg2 Qxg2+ 9. Kd3 dxc5
                                    10. bxc5 h4 11. d6+ Be6 12. Qxb7 (s=9)
               19     9.43     ++   1. ... Nh7? (>+2.28)                  
               19    10.23   2.37   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Rf6 6. Ne1 Nh4 7.
                                    Be3 Nxg2 8. Nxg2 Qxg2+ 9. Kd3 h4 10.
                                    Ra2 Qh1 11. cxd6 Rxd6 12. Kc2 (s=8)
               19->  26.67   2.37   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 Qh1+ 5. Ke2 Rf6 6. Ne1 Nh4 7.
                                    Be3 Nxg2 8. Nxg2 Qxg2+ 9. Kd3 h4 10.
                                    Ra2 Qh1 11. cxd6 Rxd6 12. Kc2 (s=8)
               20    29.31     --   1. ... Nh7! (<+2.21)                  
               20    30.53     --   1. ... Nh7! (<+2.05)                  
               20    34.68     --   1. ... Nh7! (<+1.73)                  
               20    38.96     --   1. ... Nh7! (<+1.09)                  
               20    44.65   0.40   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Ke1 h3 6. cxd6 hxg2 7.
                                    Be3 g1=Q+ 8. Bxg1 Qxg1+ 9. Kd2 Qh2+
                                    10. Be2 Qh6+ 11. Kc2 cxd6 12. Rh1 Nh4
                                    13. Rag1 g2 (s=7)
               20->  48.66   0.40   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Ke1 h3 6. cxd6 hxg2 7.
                                    Be3 g1=Q+ 8. Bxg1 Qxg1+ 9. Kd2 Qh2+
                                    10. Be2 Qh6+ 11. Kc2 cxd6 12. Rh1 Nh4
                                    13. Rag1 g2
               21    50.31     --   1. ... Nh7! (<+0.24)                  
               21    51.62     --   1. ... Nh7! (<+0.08)                  
               21    54.07  -0.18   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 Qh2 9. Ke3 g1=Q+ 10.
                                    Rxg1 Qxg1+ 11. Kd2 Qh2+ 12. Ne2 g2
                                    13. Ng1 Kxf8 14. Ra1
               21->   1:03  -0.18   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 Qh2 9. Ke3 g1=Q+ 10.
                                    Rxg1 Qxg1+ 11. Kd2 Qh2+ 12. Ne2 g2
                                    13. Ng1 Kxf8 14. Ra1 (s=2)
               22     1:07     --   1. ... Nh7! (<-0.34)                  
               22     1:10  -0.35   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 Qh2 9. Ke3 g1=Q+ 10.
                                    Rxg1 Qxg1+ 11. Kd2 Qh2+ 12. Ne2 g2
                                    13. Ng1 Kxf8 14. cxd6 cxd6
               22->   1:20  -0.35   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 Qh2 9. Ke3 g1=Q+ 10.
                                    Rxg1 Qxg1+ 11. Kd2 Qh2+ 12. Ne2 g2
                                    13. Ng1 Kxf8 14. cxd6 cxd6 (s=5)
               23     1:27  -0.44   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 Qh2 9. Ke3 g1=Q+ 10.
                                    Rxg1 Qxg1+ 11. Kd2 Qh2+ 12. Ne2 g2
                                    13. Ra1 Kxf8 14. Rg1 Ng5 15. Nf2 (s=4)
               23->   2:18  -0.44   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 Qh2 9. Ke3 g1=Q+ 10.
                                    Rxg1 Qxg1+ 11. Kd2 Qh2+ 12. Ne2 g2
                                    13. Ra1 Kxf8 14. Rg1 Ng5 15. Nf2 (s=5)
               24     2:45     --   1. ... Nh7! (<-0.60)                  
               24     2:54     --   1. ... Nh7! (<-0.76)                  
               24     3:06  -0.85   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 hxg2+ 7.
                                    Rxg2 Qh1+ 8. Ke2 Qxg2+ 9. Ke3 Nhxf8
                                    10. cxd6 cxd6 11. Nb5 Qg1+ 12. Kd2
                                    g2 13. Be2 Qh1 14. Nc7 Rb8 15. Qd1
                                    (s=4)
               24->   3:41  -0.85   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfb1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 hxg2+ 7.
                                    Rxg2 Qh1+ 8. Ke2 Qxg2+ 9. Ke3 Nhxf8
                                    10. cxd6 cxd6 11. Nb5 Qg1+ 12. Kd2
                                    g2 13. Be2 Qh1 14. Nc7 Rb8 15. Qd1
                                    (s=5)
               25     3:49     ++   1. ... Nh7? (>-0.69)                  
               25     4:44  -0.88   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 g1=N+ 9. Rxg1 Qxg1
                                    10. Qb1 Qh2+ 11. Ke3 Kxf8 12. Ra1 Ng5
                                    13. cxd6 cxd6 14. Nb5 Nf4 15. Nxf4
                                    Qf2+ 16. Kd3 exf4 (s=4)
               25->   5:39  -0.88   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 g1=N+ 9. Rxg1 Qxg1
                                    10. Qb1 Qh2+ 11. Ke3 Kxf8 12. Ra1 Ng5
                                    13. cxd6 cxd6 14. Nb5 Nf4 15. Nxf4
                                    Qf2+ 16. Kd3 exf4
               26     6:39     --   1. ... Nh7! (<-1.04)                  
               26     7:49  -1.19   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 g1=N+ 9. Rxg1 Qxg1
                                    10. Bh6 Qh2+ 11. Kd1 Qxh6 12. Ne1 Nf4
                                    13. cxd6 g2 14. Nxg2 Qh1+ 15. Ne1 Ng2
                                    16. Kc1 Qxe1+ 17. Bd1
               26->   9:44  -1.19   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 g1=N+ 9. Rxg1 Qxg1
                                    10. Bh6 Qh2+ 11. Kd1 Qxh6 12. Ne1 Nf4
                                    13. cxd6 g2 14. Nxg2 Qh1+ 15. Ne1 Ng2
                                    16. Kc1 Qxe1+ 17. Bd1 (s=2)
               27    13:45  -1.22   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 g1=N+ 9. Rxg1 Qxg1
                                    10. Kd2 Qh2+ 11. Ne2 Kxf8 12. Nc1 g2
                                    13. Qe3 Nf6 14. Ng1 Ke7 15. Nd3 Bd7
                                    16. Bb3 Nf4 17. Nxf4 exf4 18. cxd6+
                                    cxd6
               27->  17:54  -1.22   1. ... Nh7 2. Rfc1 Qh4 3. Bd1 Qh2+
                                    4. Kf1 h4 5. Bxf8 h3 6. Ra2 Qh1+ 7.
                                    Ke2 hxg2 8. Bc2 g1=N+ 9. Rxg1 Qxg1
                                    10. Kd2 Qh2+ 11. Ne2 Kxf8 12. Nc1 g2
                                    13. Qe3 Nf6 14. Ng1 Ke7 15. Nd3 Bd7
                                    16. Bb3 Nf4 17. Nxf4 exf4 18. cxd6+
                                    cxd6
at which point I terminated the thing.
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MikeGL
Posts: 1010
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:49 pm

Re: The King's Indian Defence again.

Post by MikeGL »

[d]r1bq1rk1/ppp3b1/3p1nn1/P1PPp2p/1P2P3/1QNN1Pp1/3BB1P1/R4RK1 w - - 0 1


nice position.
Does this mean 1.Bg5 is an avoid move because of 1 ... Bh6 winning for
black?

If 1. Bg5 is an avoid move, then 1.Be1 will probably hold for white on this
this typical K.I.D. position, because 1 ... h5 will block the entry of
black Q into whites K-side.
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User avatar
Graham Banks
Posts: 44340
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:52 am
Location: Auckland, NZ

Re: The King's Indian Defence again.

Post by Graham Banks »

Ajedrecista wrote:Hello!

The King's Indian Defence is known to give problems to chess engines.....
Not nearly as much as the Sicilian Pelikan (Sveshnikov) does. :wink:
gbanksnz at gmail.com
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ZirconiumX
Posts: 1353
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:14 am
Full name: Hannah Ravensloft

Re: The King's Indian Defence again.

Post by ZirconiumX »

Stockfish 2.3.1 JA, 16 threads on Joshua Shriver's Core 2 Duo, 512MB Hash

...Ne8 also accomplishes the same task of opening the d8-h4 diagonal - although I'm not sure where the knight goes after this...

Score : -6.10
Depth : 27/1
Time : 00:03:46
Nodes : 346374971
N/sec : 1526777
1... Ne8 2. Be1 Qh4 3. Bxg3 Qxg3 4. Rf2 Bh6 5. Nd1 Nf4 6. Nxf4 Bxf4 7. Kf1 h4 8. Ke1 h3 9. gxh3 Bxh3 10. Bf1 Qg1 11. Ke2 Bg3 12. Qe3 Bxf2 13. Nxf2 Bxf1 14. Rxf1 Qg2 15. Rc1 Rf7 16. Ra1 Rf4 17. Ra3 Nf6 18. Kd1

Matthew:out
tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito
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carldaman
Posts: 2285
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2012 2:13 am

Re: The King's Indian Defence again.

Post by carldaman »

MikeGL wrote:[d]r1bq1rk1/ppp3b1/3p1nn1/P1PPp2p/1P2P3/1QNN1Pp1/3BB1P1/R4RK1 w - - 0 1


nice position.
Does this mean 1.Bg5 is an avoid move because of 1 ... Bh6 winning for
black?

If 1. Bg5 is an avoid move, then 1.Be1 will probably hold for white on this
this typical K.I.D. position, because 1 ... h5 will block the entry of
black Q into whites K-side.
At a glance, after Be1 then h4 by Black could be followed up by Nh5, h3 and eventually Qh4 -- yes? no? :)

CL
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