Sloppy 0.1.1 released

[Christopher Conkie]

I am sure that for the values of these tables there are not very much sensible choices so sooner or later there will be identical tables in a lot of chess programs if the authors don't want to make them play badly intentionally.

I hope so Gabor. The door is open. Much of Sloppy is ok. Why he would just do all that work and then copy the toga psqt is beyond me.

He should change them as you say.

Actually, the tables probably aren't optimal (for Sloppy). I'm using them because I didn't have time to tune them, and because they're a lot better than nothing. I already rewrote the king-attack eval, not to make Sloppy more original, but stronger.

And why would I do all this work and then copy Fruit's/Toga's eval tables? I'll quote myself (http://wbforum.vpittlik.org/viewtopic.php?t=6852):

It's a Xboard/Winboard chess engine, and also my first release-worthy C application. The goal was to really learn C programming, so I thought a chess engine would be a good challenge.

The #1 priority was to write bug-free, easy-to-read and easy-to-improve code and use sane data structures and algorithms. So I just took a look at the Fruit 2.1 evaluation function and pretty much rewrote a simplified bitboard version of it. When I get the time I'll start focusing on the evaluation.

The reason for this is that Sloppy was a programming challenge, not a chess challenge. The evaluation function is a somewhat simple thing programming-vise, but it requires a lot of testing and chess-knowledge. So to get a release out before I die of old age, I decided to use Fruit's weights.

If it so simple....the eval i mean....that should be easy to make original and it should not take too long.

In our view the two things that define a chess program are its eval and its search. Giving people the same thing might seem easy but it gets quite boring.

We already have lots of Fruits.

Please change the eval.

[ilari]

Seems to be common sense now to start with something fruity, pour in some toga, mix it up with some own idea to not be too strong in the beginning and finally present it as something genuine.

Yeah, that would be wrong. But that's not what I've done. If all I wanted was to sneak a Fruit/Toga clone into the top 30, I definitely wouldn't have made my engine open source.

The funny thing is: even when the author himself says that it is clone & patchwork this doesn't change anything in the almost general worship.
Greets, Thomas

Wow. Where are my loyal worshipers, why haven't I met them yet? Anyway, my goals are not what you think they are.

[ilari]

In our view the two things that define a chess program are its eval and its search.

Who do you mean by "our"? Seems to me that there are quite a few differing views here. And why is it that the most unoriginal parts define the chess engine? Pretty much all engines these days use minimax search with alpha-beta pruning, late move reductions, history tables, killer heuristics, hash table, check and recapture extensions, quiescence search, null move pruning, etc. As for the eval, there's material, king safety, pawn structure, mobility, outposts, draw eval etc. All very similar.

[Christopher Conkie]

In our view the two things that define a chess program are its eval and its search.

Who do you mean by "our"? Seems to me that there are quite a few differing views here. And why is it that the most unoriginal parts define the chess engine? Pretty much all engines these days use minimax search with alpha-beta pruning, late move reductions, history tables, killer heuristics, hash table, check and recapture extensions, quiescence search, null move pruning, etc. As for the eval, there's material, king safety, pawn structure, mobility, outposts, draw eval etc. All very similar.

Not forgetting exactly the same piece square tables as Toga......

[Thomas Mayer]

Hi,

Seems to be common sense now to start with something fruity, pour in some toga, mix it up with some own idea to not be too strong in the beginning and finally present it as something genuine.

Yeah, that would be wrong. But that's not what I've done. If all I wanted was to sneak a Fruit/Toga clone into the top 30, I definitely wouldn't have made my engine open source.

The funny thing is: even when the author himself says that it is clone & patchwork this doesn't change anything in the almost general worship.
Greets, Thomas

Wow. Where are my loyal worshipers, why haven't I met them yet? Anyway, my goals are not what you think they are.

well, I haven't had only you in mind, so not everything was related to you in particular. Anyway I'm not happy with all this fruity stuff we saw lately and the general worship about it. Thats what I did want to express... Sorry if you feel attacked, that wasn't my intention... well, maybe just a little bit... It's more about the worshipers

Greets, Thomas

[GenoM]

Hi Chris
Sorry to bother you, just want to ask something:
is there clones between commercial engines or clones breed just between free engines?
And how many commercial clones you caught (if there are any, of course)?

Regards,
Geno

[ilari]

is there clones between commercial engines or clones breed just between free engines?

Closed source engines have been cloned as well. It's hard, but not impossible to decompile them. Those programs are of course illegal because they violate the copyright of the original program.

Then there are closed source clones/forks of open source engines, which also are mostly illegal because there's a breach of contract (e.g. the GPL).

[ilari]

well, I haven't had only you in mind, so not everything was related to you in particular. Anyway I'm not happy with all this fruity stuff we saw lately and the general worship about it. Thats what I did want to express... Sorry if you feel attacked, that wasn't my intention... well, maybe just a little bit... It's more about the worshipers

Greets, Thomas

Okay. In defense of the "worshipers" I have to say that they have had no trouble recognizing what's good and original in my program. Most of the positive feedback I've gotten has been about clarity of the code, data structures, and the overall design, not playing strength or the eval.

[Alexander Schmidt]

There are quite a few clones of commercial Rybka out there but you know that already......

Patriot was a commercial clone of Toga. Made by a Russian.........

Belarussian... But that doesn't matter

The "author" didnt even manage to change something in the engine, he spent all of his (little) power in changing the output...

And then we got Fafis, it was more like a original work, but it was based on Crafty.

And who knows which other commercial engines got some Fruity speedup, I can only guess...

For example look at this, the output of a commercial engine, I will not tell which one

Code: Select all

2275625<1&#58;info depth 3
2275627<1&#58;info depth 3 score cp 7 time 8 nodes 235 nps 30080 pv b1c3
2275634<1&#58;info depth 3 time 15 nodes 328 nps 22391
2275650<1&#58;info depth 4
2275652<1&#58;info depth 4 score cp 3 time 23 nodes 491 nps 21860 pv b1c3
2275656<1&#58;info depth 4 time 28 nodes 826 nps 30208
2275658<1&#58;info depth 5
2275677<1&#58;info depth 5 score cp 8 time 45 nodes 1117 nps 25417 pv b1c3 b8c6
2275680<1&#58;info depth 5 time 51 nodes 1352 nps 27146
2275683<1&#58;info depth 6
2275703<1&#58;info depth 6 score cp 3 time 69 nodes 1913 nps 28390 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3
2275746<1&#58;info depth 6 time 112 nodes 4005 nps 36617
2275748<1&#58;info depth 7
2275784<1&#58;info depth 7 score cp 5 time 160 nodes 6216 nps 39782 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6
2275837<1&#58;info depth 7 time 216 nodes 9565 nps 45345
2275839<1&#58;info depth 8
2275926<1&#58;info depth 8 score cp 7 time 298 nodes 14615 nps 50220 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6 d2d4
2276015<1&#58;info depth 8 time 380 nodes 19009 nps 51224
2276017<1&#58;info depth 9
2276586<1&#58;info depth 9 score cp 5 time 961 nodes 47418 nps 50526 pv b1c3 g8f6 d2d4 d7d5 c1f4 c8f5
2276769<1&#58;info depth 9 time 1150 nodes 57842 nps 51504
2276771<1&#58;info depth 10
3621603<1&#58;info depth 10 score cp 3 time 2085 nodes 93647 nps 45992 pv b1c3 g8f6 d2d4 d7d5 g1f3 b8c6 d1d3
3621618<1&#58;info currmove b1a3 currmovenumber 2
3621651<1&#58;info currmove d2d3 currmovenumber 3
3621691<1&#58;info currmove d2d4 currmovenumber 4
3621791<1&#58;info currmove b2b3 currmovenumber 5
3621820<1&#58;info currmove a2a3 currmovenumber 6
3621844<1&#58;info currmove a2a4 currmovenumber 7
3621875<1&#58;info currmove b2b4 currmovenumber 8
3621972<1&#58;info currmove c2c4 currmovenumber 9
3621995<1&#58;info currmove c2c3 currmovenumber 10
3622009<1&#58;info currmove e2e4 currmovenumber 11
3622075<1&#58;info currmove e2e3 currmovenumber 12
3622131<1&#58;info currmove f2f4 currmovenumber 13
3622146<1&#58;info currmove f2f3 currmovenumber 14
3622150<1&#58;info currmove g2g4 currmovenumber 15
3622195<1&#58;info currmove g2g3 currmovenumber 16
3622227<1&#58;info currmove h2h4 currmovenumber 17
3622259<1&#58;info currmove h2h3 currmovenumber 18
3622291<1&#58;info currmove g1f3 currmovenumber 19
3622296<1&#58;info currmove g1h3 currmovenumber 20
3622326<1&#58;info depth 10 time 2817 nodes 128456 nps 46694
3622335<1&#58;info depth 11

And compared to Fruit:

Code: Select all

2237122<1&#58;info depth 3
2237124<1&#58;info depth 3 seldepth 3 score cp 54 time 8 nodes 148 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3
2237128<1&#58;info depth 3 seldepth 3 time 9 nodes 186 nps 0
2237130<1&#58;info depth 4
2237133<1&#58;info depth 4 seldepth 6 score cp 0 time 10 nodes 300 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6
2237136<1&#58;info depth 4 seldepth 6 time 13 nodes 976 nps 0
2237151<1&#58;info depth 5
2237157<1&#58;info depth 5 seldepth 9 score cp 48 time 52 nodes 1729 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6 d2d4
2237163<1&#58;info depth 5 seldepth 9 time 54 nodes 1933 nps 0
2237165<1&#58;info depth 6
2237167<1&#58;info depth 6 seldepth 12 score cp 0 time 59 nodes 3331 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6 d2d4 d7d5
2237189<1&#58;info depth 6 seldepth 12 time 94 nodes 9447 nps 0
2237191<1&#58;info depth 7
2237226<1&#58;info depth 7 seldepth 14 score cp 42 time 119 nodes 15332 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6 d2d4 d7d5 c1f4
2237231<1&#58;info depth 7 seldepth 14 time 127 nodes 16243 nps 0
2237233<1&#58;info depth 8
2237296<1&#58;info depth 8 seldepth 17 score cp 0 time 190 nodes 35078 pv b1c3 g8f6 g1f3 b8c6 d2d4 d7d5 c1f4 c8f5
2237419<1&#58;info depth 8 seldepth 20 time 313 nodes 72286 nps 0
2237421<1&#58;info depth 9
2237580<1&#58;info depth 9 seldepth 20 score cp 15 time 479 nodes 125215 pv b1c3 g8f6 g1f3 b8c6 d2d4 d7d5 d1d3 c6b4 d3b5 b4c6
2237667<1&#58;info depth 9 seldepth 21 time 562 nodes 151298 nps 0
2237669<1&#58;info depth 10
4837771<1&#58;info time 1017 nodes 310000 nps 304818 cpuload 973
4837784<1&#58;info hashfull 14
4837845<1&#58;info depth 10 seldepth 22 score cp 12 time 1087 nodes 330356 pv b1c3 d7d5 d2d4 c8f5 g1f3 g8f6 f3h4 f5g4 h2h3 g4d7
4837851<1&#58;info currmove g1f3 currmovenumber 2
4838032<1&#58;info currmove g1f3 currmovenumber 2
4838156<1&#58;info depth 10 seldepth 22 score cp 15 time 1391 nodes 427686 pv g1f3 b8c6 d2d4 d7d5 b1c3 g8f6 d1d3 g7g6 c1f4 c8f5
4838166<1&#58;info currmove d2d4 currmovenumber 3
4838210<1&#58;info currmove e2e4 currmovenumber 4
4838266<1&#58;info currmove d2d3 currmovenumber 5
4838276<1&#58;info currmove e2e3 currmovenumber 6
4838295<1&#58;info currmove b1a3 currmovenumber 7
4838314<1&#58;info currmove g1h3 currmovenumber 8
4838317<1&#58;info currmove b2b3 currmovenumber 9
4838336<1&#58;info currmove b2b4 currmovenumber 10
4838356<1&#58;info currmove g2g3 currmovenumber 11
4838374<1&#58;info currmove g2g4 currmovenumber 12
4838377<1&#58;info currmove a2a4 currmovenumber 13
4838396<1&#58;info currmove h2h4 currmovenumber 14
4838399<1&#58;info currmove c2c4 currmovenumber 15
4838401<1&#58;info currmove f2f4 currmovenumber 16
4838420<1&#58;info currmove c2c3 currmovenumber 17
4838423<1&#58;info currmove a2a3 currmovenumber 18
4838431<1&#58;info currmove h2h3 currmovenumber 19
4838446<1&#58;info currmove f2f3 currmovenumber 20
4838449<1&#58;info depth 10 seldepth 24 time 1692 nodes 504717 nps 298296
4838451<1&#58;info depth 11

You think its different? Well, different is the version of the commercial engine before the one above, it was weaker by hundrets of ELO points:

Code: Select all

13859<1&#58;info depth 1 seldepth 1
13859<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1a3
13890<1&#58;info depth 1 time 60 score cp 0 lowerbound nodes 1 nps 16 pv b1a3
13890<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1a3
13890<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove b1c3
13890<1&#58;info depth 1 time 70 score cp 16 lowerbound nodes 3 nps 42 pv b1c3
13890<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
13906<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove b1a3
13906<1&#58;info currmovenumber 3 currmove g1f3
13906<1&#58;info currmovenumber 4 currmove g1h3
13906<1&#58;info currmovenumber 5 currmove a2a4
13906<1&#58;info currmovenumber 6 currmove b2b4
13906<1&#58;info currmovenumber 7 currmove c2c4
13906<1&#58;info currmovenumber 8 currmove d2d4
13922<1&#58;info currmovenumber 9 currmove e2e4
13922<1&#58;info currmovenumber 10 currmove f2f4
13922<1&#58;info currmovenumber 11 currmove g2g4
13922<1&#58;info currmovenumber 12 currmove h2h4
13922<1&#58;info currmovenumber 13 currmove a2a3
13922<1&#58;info currmovenumber 14 currmove b2b3
13922<1&#58;info currmovenumber 15 currmove c2c3
13937<1&#58;info currmovenumber 16 currmove d2d3
13937<1&#58;info currmovenumber 17 currmove e2e3
13937<1&#58;info currmovenumber 18 currmove f2f3
13937<1&#58;info currmovenumber 19 currmove g2g3
13953<1&#58;info currmovenumber 20 currmove h2h3
13953<1&#58;info nodes 23
13953<1&#58;info depth 2 seldepth 2
13953<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
13953<1&#58;info depth 2 time 90 score cp 16 lowerbound nodes 72 nps 800 pv b1c3
13953<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
13968<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove b1a3
13968<1&#58;info currmovenumber 3 currmove g1f3
13968<1&#58;info currmovenumber 4 currmove d2d4
13968<1&#58;info currmovenumber 5 currmove e2e4
13968<1&#58;info currmovenumber 6 currmove g1h3
13968<1&#58;info currmovenumber 7 currmove c2c4
13984<1&#58;info currmovenumber 8 currmove f2f4
13984<1&#58;info currmovenumber 9 currmove a2a3
13984<1&#58;info currmovenumber 10 currmove c2c3
13984<1&#58;info currmovenumber 11 currmove d2d3
13984<1&#58;info currmovenumber 12 currmove e2e3
13984<1&#58;info currmovenumber 13 currmove f2f3
14000<1&#58;info currmovenumber 14 currmove h2h3
14000<1&#58;info currmovenumber 15 currmove b2b3
14000<1&#58;info currmovenumber 16 currmove h2h4
14000<1&#58;info currmovenumber 17 currmove g2g3
14000<1&#58;info currmovenumber 18 currmove a2a4
14015<1&#58;info currmovenumber 19 currmove g2g4
14015<1&#58;info currmovenumber 20 currmove b2b4
14015<1&#58;info nodes 112
14015<1&#58;info depth 3 seldepth 3
14015<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14031<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove g1f3
14031<1&#58;info currmovenumber 3 currmove d2d4
14031<1&#58;info currmovenumber 4 currmove e2e4
14031<1&#58;info currmovenumber 5 currmove b1a3
14031<1&#58;info currmovenumber 6 currmove g1h3
14047<1&#58;info currmovenumber 7 currmove c2c4
14047<1&#58;info currmovenumber 8 currmove f2f4
14047<1&#58;info currmovenumber 9 currmove a2a3
14047<1&#58;info currmovenumber 10 currmove c2c3
14062<1&#58;info currmovenumber 11 currmove d2d3
14062<1&#58;info currmovenumber 12 currmove e2e3
14062<1&#58;info currmovenumber 13 currmove f2f3
14062<1&#58;info currmovenumber 14 currmove h2h3
14062<1&#58;info currmovenumber 15 currmove b2b3
14078<1&#58;info currmovenumber 16 currmove h2h4
14078<1&#58;info currmovenumber 17 currmove g2g3
14078<1&#58;info currmovenumber 18 currmove a2a4
14078<1&#58;info currmovenumber 19 currmove g2g4
14093<1&#58;info currmovenumber 20 currmove b2b4
14093<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14093<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove g1f3
14093<1&#58;info currmovenumber 3 currmove d2d4
14093<1&#58;info currmovenumber 4 currmove e2e4
14109<1&#58;info currmovenumber 5 currmove b1a3
14109<1&#58;info currmovenumber 6 currmove g1h3
14109<1&#58;info currmovenumber 7 currmove c2c4
14109<1&#58;info currmovenumber 8 currmove f2f4
14125<1&#58;info currmovenumber 9 currmove a2a3
14125<1&#58;info currmovenumber 10 currmove c2c3
14125<1&#58;info currmovenumber 11 currmove d2d3
14125<1&#58;info currmovenumber 12 currmove e2e3
14125<1&#58;info currmovenumber 13 currmove f2f3
14140<1&#58;info currmovenumber 14 currmove h2h3
14140<1&#58;info currmovenumber 15 currmove b2b3
14140<1&#58;info currmovenumber 16 currmove h2h4
14140<1&#58;info currmovenumber 17 currmove g2g3
14140<1&#58;info currmovenumber 18 currmove a2a4
14140<1&#58;info currmovenumber 19 currmove g2g4
14156<1&#58;info currmovenumber 20 currmove b2b4
14156<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14156<1&#58;info depth 3 time 120 score cp 0 lowerbound nodes 500 nps 4166 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6
14156<1&#58;info nodes 500
14156<1&#58;info depth 4 seldepth 4
14172<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14172<1&#58;info depth 4 time 120 score cp 0 lowerbound nodes 541 nps 4508 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6
14172<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14172<1&#58;info depth 4 time 120 score cp 8 lowerbound nodes 682 nps 5683 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6 d2d4
14172<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14187<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove d2d4
14187<1&#58;info currmovenumber 3 currmove e2e4
14187<1&#58;info currmovenumber 4 currmove g1f3
14187<1&#58;info currmovenumber 5 currmove b1a3
14187<1&#58;info currmovenumber 6 currmove g1h3
14187<1&#58;info currmovenumber 7 currmove c2c4
14203<1&#58;info currmovenumber 8 currmove f2f4
14203<1&#58;info currmovenumber 9 currmove a2a3
14203<1&#58;info currmovenumber 10 currmove c2c3
14203<1&#58;info currmovenumber 11 currmove d2d3
14203<1&#58;info currmovenumber 12 currmove e2e3
14203<1&#58;info currmovenumber 13 currmove f2f3
14218<1&#58;info currmovenumber 14 currmove h2h3
14218<1&#58;info currmovenumber 15 currmove b2b3
14218<1&#58;info currmovenumber 16 currmove h2h4
14218<1&#58;info currmovenumber 17 currmove g2g3
14218<1&#58;info currmovenumber 18 currmove a2a4
14218<1&#58;info currmovenumber 19 currmove g2g4
14234<1&#58;info currmovenumber 20 currmove b2b4
14234<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14234<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove d2d4
14234<1&#58;info currmovenumber 3 currmove e2e4
14250<1&#58;info currmovenumber 4 currmove g1f3
14250<1&#58;info currmovenumber 5 currmove b1a3
14250<1&#58;info currmovenumber 6 currmove g1h3
14250<1&#58;info currmovenumber 7 currmove c2c4
14250<1&#58;info currmovenumber 8 currmove f2f4
14265<1&#58;info currmovenumber 9 currmove a2a3
14265<1&#58;info currmovenumber 10 currmove c2c3
14265<1&#58;info currmovenumber 11 currmove d2d3
14265<1&#58;info currmovenumber 12 currmove e2e3
14265<1&#58;info currmovenumber 13 currmove f2f3
14265<1&#58;info currmovenumber 14 currmove h2h3
14281<1&#58;info currmovenumber 15 currmove b2b3
14281<1&#58;info currmovenumber 16 currmove h2h4
14281<1&#58;info currmovenumber 17 currmove g2g3
14281<1&#58;info currmovenumber 18 currmove a2a4
14281<1&#58;info currmovenumber 19 currmove g2g4
14297<1&#58;info currmovenumber 20 currmove b2b4
14297<1&#58;info nodes 925
14297<1&#58;info depth 5 seldepth 5
14297<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14312<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove g1f3
14312<1&#58;info currmovenumber 3 currmove d2d4
14312<1&#58;info currmovenumber 4 currmove e2e4
14312<1&#58;info currmovenumber 5 currmove b1a3
14328<1&#58;info currmovenumber 6 currmove g1h3
14328<1&#58;info currmovenumber 7 currmove c2c4
14328<1&#58;info currmovenumber 8 currmove f2f4
14328<1&#58;info currmovenumber 9 currmove a2a3
14343<1&#58;info currmovenumber 10 currmove c2c3
14343<1&#58;info currmovenumber 11 currmove d2d3
14343<1&#58;info currmovenumber 12 currmove e2e3
14359<1&#58;info currmovenumber 13 currmove f2f3
14359<1&#58;info currmovenumber 14 currmove h2h3
14359<1&#58;info currmovenumber 15 currmove b2b3
14359<1&#58;info currmovenumber 16 currmove h2h4
14375<1&#58;info currmovenumber 17 currmove g2g3
14375<1&#58;info currmovenumber 18 currmove a2a4
14375<1&#58;info currmovenumber 19 currmove g2g4
14375<1&#58;info currmovenumber 20 currmove b2b4
14390<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14390<1&#58;info depth 5 time 150 score cp 0 lowerbound nodes 2930 nps 19533 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6 d2d4 c6b4
14390<1&#58;info nodes 2930
14390<1&#58;info depth 6 seldepth 6
14406<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14406<1&#58;info depth 6 time 150 score cp 0 lowerbound nodes 3706 nps 24706 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6 d2d4 c6b4
14406<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14422<1&#58;info depth 6 time 150 score cp 8 lowerbound nodes 4482 nps 29880 pv b1c3 b8c6 g1f3 g8f6 d2d4 c6b4 c3b5
14422<1&#58;info currmovenumber 1 currmove b1c3
14422<1&#58;info currmovenumber 2 currmove d2d4
14437<1&#58;info currmovenumber 3 currmove g1f3
14437<1&#58;info currmovenumber 4 currmove e2e4
14437<1&#58;info currmovenumber 5 currmove e2e3
14437<1&#58;info currmovenumber 6 currmove d2d3
14453<1&#58;info currmovenumber 7 currmove b1a3
14453<1&#58;info currmovenumber 8 currmove c2c4
14453<1&#58;info currmovenumber 9 currmove g1h3
14453<1&#58;info currmovenumber 10 currmove f2f4
14468<1&#58;info currmovenumber 11 currmove c2c3
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So, what do you think is more likely, that this engine is a clone of its predecessor or of Fruit?

Thats one of the reasons I cut down my activities around computerchess.

But I have no problem with Sloppy and its honest author, everybody can decide wether he wants to use Sloppy or not.

Best,
Alex

[Christopher Conkie]

Thats one of the reasons I cut down my activities around computerchess.

One reason....

But I have no problem with Sloppy and its honest author, everybody can decide wether he wants to use Sloppy or not.

Best,
Alex

True...I agree. It is in full sight and that he hides nothing. Why he needs the Fruit/Toga eval is the part I dont get? If he wanted to enter serious competition that would need to be changed. Let's hope he does that sooner rather than later.

I'm like you Alex, if i want to play with fruit, i'll play with fruit.

About the output you showed, we all agree here that we know what that is.

It's krazy stuff.



Regards

Khristopher