Nightrider chess

Discussion of anything and everything relating to chess playing software and machines.

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hgm
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by hgm »

Jim Ablett wrote:When playing variant fairy this command is sent only to black engine at start of game >

Code: Select all

setboard oheqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/OHEQKBNR w KQkq - 0 1
Both Dabbaba and LimeNR choke on this, so I just disabled setboard using feature command (setboard=0) when variant fairy is used.

Jim.
OK, perhaps this is something that I'd better change in WB, as it is not suppsed to happen. :shock: WB has an internal flag 'startingFromSetupPosition' that tells it if it should send a setboard to the engine at the beginning of the game, and print a FEN tag in the pgn. This file is set when you paste a FEN into WinBoard, or load a PGN with FEN tag, or use the 'edit position' menu. But it should be cleared when starting in the default setup of the selected variant. And the FEN you describe is the default setup I defined for variant fairy.

This opening position was never really thought through, though. There is no known variant that uses this actual position, I just made it so it displays a few exotic pieces as soon as you select it. Perhaps it would be friendlier to engines that do not implement all fairy pieces to use an empty board, or a board with only 2 Kings on it as initial position, or even a normal FIDE opening. (But that might lead to problems for dedicated fairy engines that do not implement some of the othodox pieces.)

I am a bit surprised it works when you give feature setboard=0, bacause in that case WB should simply switch to using the edit command to send the position (and use unknown piece indicators there). But perhaps the edit command and all piece placements are all ignored without damage.

[edit] OK, I see that I erroneously set this setup flag when starting a new game in variant fairy. This still dates frrom when I first started modifying WB, before I really knew the logic of most of it. I will fix it.
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hgm
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by hgm »

The alpha.tst that is on my website now should not send any spurious FENs anymore to the engines in variant fairy. So you can enable the setboard commands again!
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Jim Ablett
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by Jim Ablett »

hgm wrote:The alpha.tst that is on my website now should not send any spurious FENs anymore to the engines in variant fairy. So you can enable the setboard commands again!
Thanks Harm. Fast work!

Jim.
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by hgm »

Jim Ablett wrote:Updates to the Nightrider engines now available:

FaileNR 1.4.6 JA by Adrien Regimbald
Changed Faile to use variant fairy and set knights
to use 'h' instead of 'n' piece representation internally.
http://www.zshare.net/download/1458805132b1b1bd/

LimeNR v62.1 JA by Richard Allbert
1. Changed LimeNR to use variant fairy and set knights
to use 'h' instead of 'n' piece representation internally.
2. Fixed starting as black problem by disabling 'setboard'
http://www.zshare.net/download/14587963b025139d/

I also fixed Dabbaba, but I'm waiting for a new src update
from Jens (he's started working on it again himself :) ).

Jim.
So what is the status of Dabbaba currently? Are we still waiting for an update, or is the version on your downloads page playable.

I played a match between LimeNR and FaileNR under the bigfixed WinBoard_F under the conditions I envisaged (i.e. compatible with Fairy-Max: variant fairy, starting from a FEN containing H to indicate a Nightrider), and it worked without problems now. (It ended 11-9 in favor of LimeNR.)

The versions I have (FaileNR 1.46_ja and LimeNR 62.1_ja) still ignore the setboard/edit commands, though: If I try to run from another initial position, e.g. with Nightriders and Bishops swapped, they just move the Bishops as Nightriders and vice versa. I am not sure if I will need the setboard feature; with so few engines it might be necessary to run multiple games between them, and I am not sure if the involved engines are deterministic or randomize their play. If they are deterministic, multiple games only make sense if I can start them from different opening positions.

Is there, under the corrected WinBoard_F, still need to disable the setboard?
JensBNielsen

Re: Nightrider chess

Post by JensBNielsen »

I will travel from Norway to Denmark all day.

I have sent an improved version of dabbaba.ini to Jim - it is much better than version 1.13.

There is a problem with the timedisposition.
If you want to start a tournament, Dabbaba could be set to x seconds pr move. As dabbaba plays faster than it is set, the time pr move should be set to fx 16 seconds if it should play at 10 seconds pr move.
It is because dabbaba won't start a new iteration, if there is not enough time to complete it. And therefore plays faster than it is set.

Jens
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Jim Ablett
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by Jim Ablett »

Latest versions with setboard=1 & knight representation H.

Dabbaba 1.14:
http://www.zshare.net/download/148003509e8959d4/

LimeNR 61.1:
http://www.zshare.net/download/14709948bbba2916/

Both work ok with new Winboard-F now.

One problem with Faile. It comes with no setboard or edit commands.

Jim.
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hgm
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by hgm »

OK.

Perhaps I should use the trick then to force the first two moves from a pgn, and select some random Pawn moves, in order to force different openings.
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Jim Ablett
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by Jim Ablett »

LimeNR Update:

LimeNR 62.2 by Richard Allbert.

(This is version of Lime that only plays variant 'Nightrider)

Fixed check detection bug which occurred in certain positions.

http://www.zshare.net/download/149167270eb32886/

Jim.
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by Richard Allbert »

Jim Ablett wrote:LimeNR Update:

LimeNR 62.2 by Richard Allbert.

(This is version of Lime that only plays variant 'Nightrider)

Fixed check detection bug which occurred in certain positions.

http://www.zshare.net/download/149167270eb32886/

Jim.
Hi,

Just caught up with this thread (I am slowly but surely getting round to a new release) Believe it or ot, I'm not finding it easy to improve Lime by a mere 50 points.... :oops:

Thank you very much for using Lime - is there anything I can do to help with the variant?

Richard
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Jim Ablett
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Re: Nightrider chess

Post by Jim Ablett »

Richard Allbert wrote:
Jim Ablett wrote:LimeNR Update:

LimeNR 62.2 by Richard Allbert.

(This is version of Lime that only plays variant 'Nightrider)

Fixed check detection bug which occurred in certain positions.

http://www.zshare.net/download/149167270eb32886/

Jim.
Hi,

Just caught up with this thread (I am slowly but surely getting round to a new release) Believe it or ot, I'm not finding it easy to improve Lime by a mere 50 points.... :oops:

Thank you very much for using Lime - is there anything I can do to help with the variant?

Richard
Hi Richard,

The bugs I found were entirely due to me missing a few things out in the conversion to Nightrider. I chose to Lime because the source is clearly
written and easy to understand (for an idiot like me) and strong enough to give Joker a run for it's money. It seems to be playing stable now.
I've played about a hundred test games with no problems. Feel free to look over the src (included with download on my homepage) for any errors.
Nice to hear you're still working on Lime.

regards,
Jim.