Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

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swami
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:21 am

Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by swami » Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:36 pm

Do you wanna know my plans or wanna suggest some more ideas for the test suite, especially strategic that you don't see in below list? Please feel free to suggest something.

So far, I have these enlisted, and some work in progress: I hope I don't run outta ideas.
  • Pawn structure:
    This is the work in progress. Attacking the opponents pawn to make it isolated, trading pieces to make it doubled. etc

    Queens and rooks to the 7th
    Placing the queen and Rook on the 7th or the 2nd rank to pressurize the opposing side.

    Massing near the king for the attack
    Arranging useful pieces that are necessary for king side attack launch.

    Pawn storms
    Or pawn chains, pawns wedge, pawn nail.

    Destroying the castled king’s defenses
    Like creating weak squares in opponents king side pawn cover.

    Limiting the mobility of pieces.
    Fixing up pawns to limit the mobility of pieces.

    Recapturing
    Which pieces to use to recapture. cxd5 or exd5 or Nxd5 etc etc

    Avoiding En-passant/ doing en-passant.
    Do enpassant only if you can weaken opponent's pawn structure, else not.

    Blockading:
    Bloackade the passer pawns with one of your pieces.

    Overprotection/Overworked Pieces:
    protect the certain pieces further, especially the ones that control important squares/centre.

    Sacrificing a pawn for better activity
    This happens in Benko gambit, but hafta find them in middle games.

    Square Vacancy:
    Occupying the vacant squares on enemies camp in order to create more pressure in surrounding areas (What's shortest term for it? pressurizing perhaps?)

    Tempos:
    Giving tempos either with a pawn or with pieces.

    Simplification:
    Simplification simply means to simplify the position by exchanging pieces when you're materially superior or positionally superior. Engines could find simplification easily, but I'd want to look for difficult simplification puzzles.
Any more ideas are welcome! Along with diagram, showcasing engine's analysis as an example. etc :)

krazyken

Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by krazyken » Thu Jun 04, 2009 12:48 am

building and maintaining fortresses.

Zugzwangs.

Development, finding good opening moves when you don't have a book.

Trapped pieces.

Dann Corbit
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Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by Dann Corbit » Thu Jun 04, 2009 1:04 am

krazyken wrote:building and maintaining fortresses.

Zugzwangs.

Development, finding good opening moves when you don't have a book.

Trapped pieces.
There are two kinds of trapped pieces. There is opponent deathtrap (as caused by poisoned chessman):
[D]3k4/ppp2bn1/8/8/8/8/PPP2BN1/3K4 w - -
[D]3k4/Bpp2bn1/8/8/8/8/PPP3N1/3K4 b - -
[D]3k4/B1p2bn1/1p6/8/8/8/PPP3N1/3K4 w - -

And there is also where you cage yourself:
[D]r7/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/R3P1B1/2PP4/3K2NR w - -
[D]r7/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/3RP1B1/2PP4/3K2NR b - -
[D]8/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/r2RP1B1/2PP4/3K2NR w - -
[D]8/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/r1PRP1B1/3P4/3K2NR b - -

swami
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Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by swami » Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:17 am

Dann Corbit wrote: And there is also where you cage yourself:
[D]r7/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/R3P1B1/2PP4/3K2NR w - -
[D]r7/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/3RP1B1/2PP4/3K2NR b - -
[D]8/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/r2RP1B1/2PP4/3K2NR w - -
[D]8/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/r1PRP1B1/3P4/3K2NR b - -
That looks funny. I didn't know that engines would actually do this :)

perhaps they get trapped in fortresses and make senseless moves? Games with so many fixed pawns and fortresses are hard to find.

swami
Posts: 6546
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:21 am

Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by swami » Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:20 am

krazyken wrote:building and maintaining fortresses.

Zugzwangs.

Development, finding good opening moves when you don't have a book.

Trapped pieces.
Development is Ok. I actually considered this, I'd try to find if there are good opening moves with significant + score difference in evaluation between the 1st and 2nd best moves. There's another one similar to development, It's called "Piece Activity", but that happens in late middle games, activating cramped pieces. Opening books wouldn't play role here.

Aleks Peshkov
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Location: Russia

Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by Aleks Peshkov » Thu Jun 04, 2009 11:48 am

I suggest King Activity: when it is right time to use king as active piece.
Plus when do not castle, but hold king at the center.

swami
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Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by swami » Thu Jun 04, 2009 12:12 pm

Aleks Peshkov wrote:I suggest King Activity: when it is right time to use king as active piece.
Plus when do not castle, but hold king at the center.
Pretty good idea! I'll add this to the list. This is not hard to find in games either.

Thank you.

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michiguel
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Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by michiguel » Thu Jun 04, 2009 2:34 pm

swami wrote:Do you wanna know my plans or wanna suggest some more ideas for the test suite, especially strategic that you don't see in below list? Please feel free to suggest something.

So far, I have these enlisted, and some work in progress: I hope I don't run outta ideas.
  • Pawn structure:
    This is the work in progress. Attacking the opponents pawn to make it isolated, trading pieces to make it doubled. etc

    Queens and rooks to the 7th
    Placing the queen and Rook on the 7th or the 2nd rank to pressurize the opposing side.

    Massing near the king for the attack
    Arranging useful pieces that are necessary for king side attack launch.

    Pawn storms
    Or pawn chains, pawns wedge, pawn nail.

    Destroying the castled king’s defenses
    Like creating weak squares in opponents king side pawn cover.

    Limiting the mobility of pieces.
    Fixing up pawns to limit the mobility of pieces.

    Recapturing
    Which pieces to use to recapture. cxd5 or exd5 or Nxd5 etc etc

    Avoiding En-passant/ doing en-passant.
    Do enpassant only if you can weaken opponent's pawn structure, else not.

    Blockading:
    Bloackade the passer pawns with one of your pieces.

    Overprotection/Overworked Pieces:
    protect the certain pieces further, especially the ones that control important squares/centre.

    Sacrificing a pawn for better activity
    This happens in Benko gambit, but hafta find them in middle games.

    Square Vacancy:
    Occupying the vacant squares on enemies camp in order to create more pressure in surrounding areas (What's shortest term for it? pressurizing perhaps?)

    Tempos:
    Giving tempos either with a pawn or with pieces.

    Simplification:
    Simplification simply means to simplify the position by exchanging pieces when you're materially superior or positionally superior. Engines could find simplification easily, but I'd want to look for difficult simplification puzzles.
Any more ideas are welcome! Along with diagram, showcasing engine's analysis as an example. etc :)
Exchange sacrifice por positional reasons. In other words, no tactical win of material in the near horizon. Scanning Petrosian games may be a good start :-)

Miguel

Dann Corbit
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Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by Dann Corbit » Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:50 pm

swami wrote:
Dann Corbit wrote: And there is also where you cage yourself:
[D]r7/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/R3P1B1/2PP4/3K2NR w - -
[D]r7/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/3RP1B1/2PP4/3K2NR b - -
[D]8/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/r2RP1B1/2PP4/3K2NR w - -
[D]8/1b6/8/3n4/1knPr2N/r1PRP1B1/3P4/3K2NR b - -
That looks funny. I didn't know that engines would actually do this :)

perhaps they get trapped in fortresses and make senseless moves? Games with so many fixed pawns and fortresses are hard to find.
I saw a very high end engine do this once (put its own rook in a cage).
Yes, it looked funny to me too.

swami
Posts: 6546
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:21 am

Re: Any More Strategical Ideas for a Test Suite?

Post by swami » Fri Jun 05, 2009 5:20 am

michiguel wrote:Exchange sacrifice por positional reasons. In other words, no tactical win of material in the near horizon. Scanning Petrosian games may be a good start :-)

Miguel
Yes, That's the one that someone else also suggested it.

So far, from the inputs I've gathered I'm adding these to the above list:

King Activity and King Safety:
When it's the right time to use king as the active piece. When not to casle, when to place the king in the corner.

Development and Piece Activity:
Activating the cramped pieces, and developing the pieces and posting them in good squares.

Positional Exchange Sacrifice
Giving up materially superior piece for positional reasons especially when there is no tactics or combinations involved.

Bishop vs Knight
When to offer the Bishop for the trade with the knight and vice versa.

Sidestepping
and not exchanging up pieces especially when you're materially or positionally weak. Or you want to put up fight even if the position is about equal. Or you just want that piece for the later stage in the game and don't want to offer it up for an exchange because it's that good.

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