Rental Rybka what do Others think?

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bigo

Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by bigo » Wed Dec 30, 2009 7:37 am

I think this rental Rybka scheme is pure crap. I will no longer buy or support Rybka, especially now that the free stockfish is out. I am no longer in the words of Dr. Deeb a rybka fan boy, I feel betrayed by the Rybka team. The ideal that I have to have n internet connection to use the best rybka and actually have to rent time for astronomical prices, that broke the camels back for me I'm done. :evil:

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M ANSARI
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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by M ANSARI » Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:03 am

Although I understand your frustration I think it is best to see how this plays out first. I also am not too impressed with the idea of having to rent an engine and would much prefer having it on my own computers. I am quite sure R4 is still on and that it will be the strongest engine available. But of course the latest innovations that Vas will come up with will remain in the remote version. You can't really blame the guy for trying to secure his code, and at the moment that seems that it is the only way for him to do that.

I am hoping that the rental Rybka will be something more on the lines of a Rybka on some sort of hardware card. So one node would actually be around 100 cores. That would make a lot more sense that having low clocked servers trying to compete with hardware I can easily trump at home. I think I could live with that if R4 that I can buy is still the strongest engine out there.

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michiguel
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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by michiguel » Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:24 am

M ANSARI wrote:Although I understand your frustration I think it is best to see how this plays out first. I also am not too impressed with the idea of having to rent an engine and would much prefer having it on my own computers. I am quite sure R4 is still on and that it will be the strongest engine available. But of course the latest innovations that Vas will come up with will remain in the remote version. You can't really blame the guy for trying to secure his code, and at the moment that seems that it is the only way for him to do that.

I am hoping that the rental Rybka will be something more on the lines of a Rybka on some sort of hardware card. So one node would actually be around 100 cores. That would make a lot more sense that having low clocked servers trying to compete with hardware I can easily trump at home. I think I could live with that if R4 that I can buy is still the strongest engine out there.
C. Theron said once that the future is in phones (that is why he did not want to invest any effort on SMP versions). Many insisted that there was a future in SMP (what we see today). This rental rybka will combine both. You may be able to access Rybka running on a good hardware from your phone. Hard to say, but I am not willing to bet against this idea...

Miguel

playjunior
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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by playjunior » Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:17 am

michiguel wrote:
M ANSARI wrote:Although I understand your frustration I think it is best to see how this plays out first. I also am not too impressed with the idea of having to rent an engine and would much prefer having it on my own computers. I am quite sure R4 is still on and that it will be the strongest engine available. But of course the latest innovations that Vas will come up with will remain in the remote version. You can't really blame the guy for trying to secure his code, and at the moment that seems that it is the only way for him to do that.

I am hoping that the rental Rybka will be something more on the lines of a Rybka on some sort of hardware card. So one node would actually be around 100 cores. That would make a lot more sense that having low clocked servers trying to compete with hardware I can easily trump at home. I think I could live with that if R4 that I can buy is still the strongest engine out there.
C. Theron said once that the future is in phones (that is why he did not want to invest any effort on SMP versions). Many insisted that there was a future in SMP (what we see today). This rental rybka will combine both. You may be able to access Rybka running on a good hardware from your phone. Hard to say, but I am not willing to bet against this idea...

Miguel
Just crossed my mind, doesn't this make cheating in amateur competitions considerably easier?

Kurt Utzinger
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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by Kurt Utzinger » Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:34 am

bigo wrote:I think this rental Rybka scheme is pure crap. I will no longer buy or support Rybka, especially now that the free stockfish is out. I am no longer in the words of Dr. Deeb a rybka fan boy, I feel betrayed by the Rybka team. The ideal that I have to have n internet connection to use the best rybka and actually have to rent time for astronomical prices, that broke the camels back for me I'm done. :evil:
I do not [yet] feel betrayed by the Rybka team. I paid for what I have got. But if a rental Rybka comes out - stronger than Rybka 4 - I would neither buy Rybka 4 nor pay for a rental Rybka.
Kurt

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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by Dr.Ex » Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:45 am

playjunior wrote:Just crossed my mind, doesn't this make cheating in amateur competitions considerably easier?
Nope, arbiters today are well aware of the cheating possibility. It was easier to cheat in the good old days.
You can hardly cheat directly at the board unless you have an accomplice.
Usually you are not allowed to leave the tournament area. If you have to go to the toilet more than once during a game you will already come under suspicion. Especially if you suddenly play several 100 points above your usual level.
Besides, if you go to the toilet while it's your move then it is already highly suspicious.
If your opponent does that you should inform the arbiter at once.
This has a good side effect: Your complain might distract your opponent. :)
I _always_ make my move first, the matter is hardly so urgent that it can not be delayed for a while.

Dayffd
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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by Dayffd » Wed Dec 30, 2009 2:52 pm

I will buy chess engines if the the price does not become too high and the engine is worth it in my estimation. Rybka is pretty much at that limit now. Rental? No, absolutely not. For my purposes it would make no sense at all.
David S.

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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by Trahald » Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:17 pm

I would not rent an engine under any circumstances, but I will have no problem with buying Rybka 4 when it is released if it is the strongest 'standalone' program available at the time.

Personally I could not care less if there is a stronger remote version, and I certainly don't feel betrayed by Vas.

I would guess that it is quite likely that the developers of Stockfish for example already have a version that is maybe a few elo points stronger than 1.6, to me this would be equivalent to the remote version of Rybka, the only difference being that people now have the opportunity to access it rather than remaining private.

Also it seems to me that it allows Vas to experiment with new ideas, and identify bugs earlier than might otherwise be possible. Therefore I could potentially see this leading to stronger and more stable future releases than might otherwise be the case.
Russell Murray

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Dr.Wael Deeb
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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by Dr.Wael Deeb » Wed Dec 30, 2009 5:55 pm

bigo wrote:I think this rental Rybka scheme is pure crap. I will no longer buy or support Rybka, especially now that the free stockfish is out. I am no longer in the words of Dr. Deeb a rybka fan boy, I feel betrayed by the Rybka team. The ideal that I have to have n internet connection to use the best rybka and actually have to rent time for astronomical prices, that broke the camels back for me I'm done. :evil:
Great....I discharged you from this shamful list :D
Now seriously I totaly agree with your point of view and there will come a time when this rental system of Vasik will colapse over his head and cause additional damage to his already ruined reputation....mark my words for that....
Dr.D
_No one can hit as hard as life.But it ain’t about how hard you can hit.It’s about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward.How much you can take and keep moving forward….

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Graham Banks
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Re: Rental Rybka what do Others think?

Post by Graham Banks » Wed Dec 30, 2009 5:57 pm

I wouldn't bother paying for the rental system.
gbanksnz at gmail.com

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