Houdini 1.5 is released

[Graham Banks]

Where is the source?

If you took ideas (and likely code) from Crafty, Stockfish, and the Ippolit family of engines, you have to publish the code.

Crafty's license states that any modification of the code _must_ be released and the copyright notice be left intact.

I would like to see just how much of Crafty is in the program.

Peter

Really doesn't seem any of your business...maybe just worry about yourself and do your own thing while others do theirs

Peter is part of the Crafty team.

[kranium]

yes,
also (distantly) related to Yakov Petrovich Golyadkin (my understanding is 3rd cousin, once removed)

apparently the Skiииer family emigrated from Ukraine at the turn of the century during the horrible fish/vodka famine of 1901...
developed great expertise at taking the Crafty source code and compiling it, an excellent and authoritative website!

reminds me of Jim Ablett...valuable member of the
Scorpio, Stockfish, Chess One, Obender, Ifrit, Red Queen, Protector, Magnum, Kurt, Beaches, SlowChess, GNUchess, Freyr, Thor's Hammer, Amundsen, Sungorus, Fimbulwinter, Cassandre, Myrddin, Guichess, AliBaba, Exchess, Jester, GK, TSCP, Pepito, Joanna, KMTchess, etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc. team!
(man he's on every team known to mankind!)

you can find the official Crafty Team site here:
http://www.webkikr.com/

[Peter Skinner]

Really doesn't seem any of your business...maybe just worry about yourself and do your own thing while others do theirs

I would have to say that it is my business. From the Crafty source, main.c:

Code: Select all

/* last modified 11/05/10 */
/*
 *******************************************************************************
 *                                                                             *
 *  Crafty, copyright 1996-2010 by Robert M. Hyatt, Ph.D., Associate Professor *
 *  of Computer and Information Sciences, University of Alabama at Birmingham. *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Crafty is a team project consisting of the following members.  These are   *
 *  the people involved in the continuing development of this program, there   *
 *  are no particular members responsible for any specific aspect of Crafty.   *
 *                                                                             *
 *     Michael Byrne, Pen Argyle, PA.                                          *
 *     Robert Hyatt, University of Alabama at Birmingham.                      *
 *     Tracy Riegle, Hershey, PA.                                              *
 *     Peter Skinner, Edmonton, AB  Canada.                                    *
 *     Ted Langreck                       .                                    *
 *                                                                             *
 *  All rights reserved.  No part of this program may be reproduced in any     *
 *  form or by any means, for other than your personal use, without the        *
 *  express written permission of the authors.  This program may not be used   *
 *  in whole, nor in part, to enter any computer chess competition without     *
 *  written permission from the authors.  Such permission will include the     *
 *  requirement that the program be entered under the name "Crafty" so that    *
 *  the program's ancestry will be known.                                      *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Copies of the source must contain the original copyright notice intact.    *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Any changes made to this software must also be made public to comply with  *
 *  the original intent of this software distribution project.  These          *
 *  restrictions apply whether the distribution is being done for free or as   *
 *  part or all of a commercial product.  The authors retain sole ownership    *
 *  and copyright on this program except for 'personal use' explained below.   *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Personal use includes any use you make of the program yourself, either by  *
 *  playing games with it yourself, or allowing others to play it on your      *
 *  machine,  and requires that if others use the program, it must be clearly  *
 *  identified as "Crafty" to anyone playing it (on a chess server as one      *
 *  example).  Personal use does not allow anyone to enter this into a chess   *
 *  tournament where other program authors are invited to participate.  IE you *
 *  can do your own local tournament, with Crafty + other programs, since this *
 *  is for your personal enjoyment.  But you may not enter Crafty into an      *
 *  event where it will be in competition with other programs/programmers      *
 *  without permission as stated previously.                                   *
 *                                                                             *

So maybe you should worry about your business and not mine.

Peter

[Peter Skinner]

yes,
also (distantly) related to Yakov Petrovich Golyadkin (my understanding is 3rd cousin, once removed)

apparently the Skiииer family emigrated from Ukraine at turn of the century...
developed great expertise at taking the Crafty source code and compiling it, an excellent and authoritative website!

reminds me of Jim Ablett...valuable member of the
Scorpio, Stockfish, Chess One, Obender, Ifrit, Red Queen, Protector, Magnum, Kurt, Beaches, SlowChess, GNUchess, Freyr, Thor's Hammer, Amundsen, Sungorus, Fimbulwinter, Cassandre, Myrddin, Guichess, AliBaba, etc., etc. etc.
team!

you can find the official Crafty Team site here:
http://www.webkikr.com/

If you think all I do is compile Crafty, then you are sadly mistaken.

Peter

[BTO7]

Really doesn't seem any of your business...maybe just worry about yourself and do your own thing while others do theirs

I would have to say that it is my business. From the Crafty source, main.c:

Code: Select all

/* last modified 11/05/10 */
/*
 *******************************************************************************
 *                                                                             *
 *  Crafty, copyright 1996-2010 by Robert M. Hyatt, Ph.D., Associate Professor *
 *  of Computer and Information Sciences, University of Alabama at Birmingham. *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Crafty is a team project consisting of the following members.  These are   *
 *  the people involved in the continuing development of this program, there   *
 *  are no particular members responsible for any specific aspect of Crafty.   *
 *                                                                             *
 *     Michael Byrne, Pen Argyle, PA.                                          *
 *     Robert Hyatt, University of Alabama at Birmingham.                      *
 *     Tracy Riegle, Hershey, PA.                                              *
 *     Peter Skinner, Edmonton, AB  Canada.                                    *
 *     Ted Langreck                       .                                    *
 *                                                                             *
 *  All rights reserved.  No part of this program may be reproduced in any     *
 *  form or by any means, for other than your personal use, without the        *
 *  express written permission of the authors.  This program may not be used   *
 *  in whole, nor in part, to enter any computer chess competition without     *
 *  written permission from the authors.  Such permission will include the     *
 *  requirement that the program be entered under the name "Crafty" so that    *
 *  the program's ancestry will be known.                                      *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Copies of the source must contain the original copyright notice intact.    *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Any changes made to this software must also be made public to comply with  *
 *  the original intent of this software distribution project.  These          *
 *  restrictions apply whether the distribution is being done for free or as   *
 *  part or all of a commercial product.  The authors retain sole ownership    *
 *  and copyright on this program except for 'personal use' explained below.   *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Personal use includes any use you make of the program yourself, either by  *
 *  playing games with it yourself, or allowing others to play it on your      *
 *  machine,  and requires that if others use the program, it must be clearly  *
 *  identified as "Crafty" to anyone playing it (on a chess server as one      *
 *  example).  Personal use does not allow anyone to enter this into a chess   *
 *  tournament where other program authors are invited to participate.  IE you *
 *  can do your own local tournament, with Crafty + other programs, since this *
 *  is for your personal enjoyment.  But you may not enter Crafty into an      *
 *  event where it will be in competition with other programs/programmers      *
 *  without permission as stated previously.                                   *
 *                                                                             *

So maybe you should worry about your business and not mine.

Peter

No still not your business. First off Robert said he took "ideas" not code....its you ASSUMING he MIGHT have. Robert does not strike me as the kind of guy that needs to steal anything. Maybe you should trying reading up above before ACCUSING of foul play such as "daniel71 wrote:
Hi Robert,
Did you get permission to use the Nalimov endgame tablebases? I have seen Eugene Nalimov give permission here on talk chess years ago for another engine author to use the tablebases on his program maybe he is no longer active in chess. My question to everybody is at what point does the Nalimov endgame tablebases become public domain that either because the author either is never available for permission or the age of the content or the author is dead. Mr. Nalimov doesn't charge for the endgame tablebases so could you add the Nalimov tablebase support as an undocumented feature? Maybe Kirill Kryukov can find Mr. Nalimov , he has ran several Nalimov endgame boards and projects in the past, otherwise maybe Stefan Meyer-Kaylen (Shredder) might offer some help he is always very nice and helpful when I contact him it's a longshot but worth asking him. Thanks for your hard work. Daniel Very Happy

I didn't manage to get in contact with Eugene Nalimov and consequently did not include the Nalimov probing code in the Houdini 1.5 release.
Any assistance in this matter would be appreciated, for me it's just a matter of compiling Houdini with the appropriate compilation switches."

Seems to me Robert knows what and when he needs to ASK and thus is the post points OUT for you if your blind he left that out on account of not being able to contact him...thus goes back to me saying seems like a honest guy. Seems your book is guilty until proven innocent and WHEN and IF its any of your business Robert will let you know. Until then, lay off the attacks and your paranoid self. Maybe you should have sent this message in private so seems to me your the one with a problem. So again unless you have PROOF of him using your code you need to lay off and be quiet because all i can see is you only have speculation ....hardly evidence of any wrong doing. Keep your tone in check until then and keep on topic.

Thanks
BT

[kranium]

yes,
also (distantly) related to Yakov Petrovich Golyadkin (my understanding is 3rd cousin, once removed)

apparently the Skiииer family emigrated from Ukraine at turn of the century...
developed great expertise at taking the Crafty source code and compiling it, an excellent and authoritative website!

reminds me of Jim Ablett...valuable member of the
Scorpio, Stockfish, Chess One, Obender, Ifrit, Red Queen, Protector, Magnum, Kurt, Beaches, SlowChess, GNUchess, Freyr, Thor's Hammer, Amundsen, Sungorus, Fimbulwinter, Cassandre, Myrddin, Guichess, AliBaba, etc., etc. etc.
team!

you can find the official Crafty Team site here:
http://www.webkikr.com/

If you think all I do is compile Crafty, then you are sadly mistaken.

Peter

you program it?
i.e. part of the programming team?

wait i got it...beta tester/compiler/policer extraordinaire!!

weird, you're not mentioned in the credits...
or the website, or the executable, i've looked everywhere

well, Bob's getting older as are we all...maybe he just forgot?

please give me some more time...i'm sure i'll find mention of you somewhere...
get back to you in a day or two!

[Peter Skinner]

you program it?
i.e. part of the programming team?

wait i got it...beta tester/compiler/policer extraordinaire!!

We all have roles on the team. If they were not significant roles, do you think we would be listed on the team? Jim Albett compiles Crafty, but do you see him on the team listing?

When was the last time you actually created something _original_, and not just trying to pass off someone's work as your own, let alone sell it? What exactly is your role in Houdini other than being a mouth piece for the "Ippolit movement"?

Sadly I am not quite up to your level.

The license for Crafty is what it is. Robert Houdart states he took ideas from Crafty and others, and I would like to see just how much _actual_ code is there.

It is quite obvious that he took the Ippolit code, improved it somewhat, and is being hailed as some new realm of computer chess. Do you actually think any Tournament Director on the planet will allow him to enter with it? Not a chance.

Do you think that any Tournament Director will allow _any_ of the Ippolit clones to enter any major tournament? Not a chance.

You are a fool with a mouth. That is all.

[EroSennin]

...

Nobody gives a fuck. Just my two cents.

[Albert Silver]

Really doesn't seem any of your business...maybe just worry about yourself and do your own thing while others do theirs

I would have to say that it is my business. From the Crafty source, main.c:

Code: Select all

/* last modified 11/05/10 */
/*
 *******************************************************************************
 *                                                                             *
 *  Crafty, copyright 1996-2010 by Robert M. Hyatt, Ph.D., Associate Professor *
 *  of Computer and Information Sciences, University of Alabama at Birmingham. *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Crafty is a team project consisting of the following members.  These are   *
 *  the people involved in the continuing development of this program, there   *
 *  are no particular members responsible for any specific aspect of Crafty.   *
 *                                                                             *
 *     Michael Byrne, Pen Argyle, PA.                                          *
 *     Robert Hyatt, University of Alabama at Birmingham.                      *
 *     Tracy Riegle, Hershey, PA.                                              *
 *     Peter Skinner, Edmonton, AB  Canada.                                    *
 *     Ted Langreck                       .                                    *
 *                                                                             *
 *  All rights reserved.  No part of this program may be reproduced in any     *
 *  form or by any means, for other than your personal use, without the        *
 *  express written permission of the authors.  This program may not be used   *
 *  in whole, nor in part, to enter any computer chess competition without     *
 *  written permission from the authors.  Such permission will include the     *
 *  requirement that the program be entered under the name "Crafty" so that    *
 *  the program's ancestry will be known.                                      *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Copies of the source must contain the original copyright notice intact.    *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Any changes made to this software must also be made public to comply with  *
 *  the original intent of this software distribution project.  These          *
 *  restrictions apply whether the distribution is being done for free or as   *
 *  part or all of a commercial product.  The authors retain sole ownership    *
 *  and copyright on this program except for 'personal use' explained below.   *
 *                                                                             *
 *  Personal use includes any use you make of the program yourself, either by  *
 *  playing games with it yourself, or allowing others to play it on your      *
 *  machine,  and requires that if others use the program, it must be clearly  *
 *  identified as "Crafty" to anyone playing it (on a chess server as one      *
 *  example).  Personal use does not allow anyone to enter this into a chess   *
 *  tournament where other program authors are invited to participate.  IE you *
 *  can do your own local tournament, with Crafty + other programs, since this *
 *  is for your personal enjoyment.  But you may not enter Crafty into an      *
 *  event where it will be in competition with other programs/programmers      *
 *  without permission as stated previously.                                   *
 *                                                                             *

So maybe you should worry about your business and not mine.

Peter

No still not your business.
BT

Odd, that you cannot read. The text he quotes shows precisely why it is his business.

[Peter Skinner]

weird, you're not mentioned in the credits...
or the website, or the executable, i've looked everywhere

well, Bob's getting older as are we all...maybe he just forgot?

please give me some more time...i'm sure i'll find mention of you somewhere...
get back to you in a day or two!

No need to look for days. Look at the top of main.c in the Crafty source.

Or just look above your original post, I already posted it for simple people like yourself.