Moderators: hgm, Rebel, chrisw
Milos wrote:So posts about Panda, Norton, McAfee, Kaspersky, etc. are not OT right?Steve B wrote:Several posts in this thread have been removed due to complaints and charter violations
if a post of yours is missing as a result of splitting the thread
we apolgize for the inconvience
members should refrain from making OT posts that have nothing to do with computer chess
Great job Steve, really great job...
Who is this Osipov character? Is he the author of Strelka? When he was first known we only heard of him second hand and then only through translation from Russian that was very hard to understand. His first name has had three different spellings; Yuri, Jury and Juri. When he appeared here for the first time his English was very rough. Then nothing for awhile. Then when the Ipp* controversy started up he rejoined with nearly perfect English. At first he was in opposition to Vas and now he is a Vas supporter. What gives with citing him as a source? Does anyone know for sure that he is whom he says he is?Albert Silver wrote:Osipov declared it a clear Ippolit derivative, albeit with a number of changes especially at the eval level, after RE-ing it. Since you say you don't *know*, what do you sincerely *believe*? I ask because I find these declarations of not knowing because the person doesn't have irrefutable proof to be the most insincere cop-out there is. It is an excuse to look away even though the person actually believes one thing, but hides behind the "don't know with irrefutable proof" declaration, which (no offense meant to you Uri) is pathetic.Uri Blass wrote:I do not believe that based on ideas from Ippolit,Crafty and stockfish he wrote a 3200 engine from scratch in a few months but we do not know when he started but only when he released the first version and these things may be different.Peter Skinner wrote:It is a clone. Do you honestly believe he took "ideas" from Ippolit, Crafty, Stockfish and wrote a 3200 engine from scratch in a few months?
Please tell me you aren't that blind to the fact of what Houdini is? If so, I have a hell of a deal on a bridge with a prime location in San Fransisco. Some would call it a "Golden" opportunity. Interested?
Peter
It is possible that he started some years ago to learn from crafty and from Glaurung and started to write his engine in 2006.
I do not claim that Houdini is not a derivative of Ippolit(I do not know) but you need a better argument to convince me that it is a derivative of Ippolit(I prefer the word derivative and not a clone when there is a clear strength improvement even if 99% of the code is the same).
Uri
Don't get me wrong, I have no doubt Houdart has put in a lot of work to achieve the improvements he did, which is another argument altogether, but I completely believe that he started with IPPO and that it is the foundation of 99% of its strength.
Code: Select all
[Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "Q4"]
[Date "2010.12.18"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Houdini_15_x64"]
[Black "Mike"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[BlackElo "2400"]
[ECO "B31"]
[Opening "Sicilian"]
[Time "14:17:17"]
[Variation "Rossolimo, 3...g6 4.O-O Bg7 5.Re1 Nf6"]
[TimeControl "40/7200:40/7200:40/7200"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "89"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "human"]
1. e4 {(e2e4 e7e6 d2d4 d7d5 e4xd5 e6xd5 Ng1f3 Ng8f6 Bf1b5+ c7c6 Bb5d3
Qd8e7+ Bc1e3 Nf6g4 Qd1e2 Ng4xe3 f2xe3 g7g6 Nb1c3 Bf8g7 OOO OO Kc1b1 Nb8d7
e3e4 Nd7f6 e4e5) +0.25/23 248} c5 2. Nf3 {(Ng1f3 Nb8c6 Nb1c3 e7e5 Bf1c4
Bf8e7 d2d3 d7d6 OO Ng8f6 Bc1g5 OO Bg5xf6 Be7xf6 Nc3d5 h7h6 h2h3 Bf6g5 c2c3
Bc8e6 Qd1c2 Ra8c8 Ra1d1 Bg5f4 Nd5xf4 e5xf4) +0.26/23 135} Nc6 3. Bb5
{(Bf1b5 e7e6 OO Ng8e7 d2d4 c5xd4 Nf3xd4 Qd8b6 Nd4xc6 b7xc6 Bb5e2 Ne7g6 g2g3
Bf8e7 Bc1e3 Qb6c7 a2a3 OO Nb1c3 Ra8b8 Ra1b1 d7d5) +0.22/22 202} g6 4. Nc3
{(Nb1c3 Bf8g7 OO Ng8f6 e4e5 Nf6g4 Bb5xc6 d7xc6 Qd1e2 OO h2h3 Ng4h6 Nc3e4
b7b6 c2c3 a7a5 d2d3 Bc8a6 c3c4 Qd8d7 g2g4 Ra8d8 Rf1d1 Ba6b7 b2b3 Qd7e6
Ra1b1) +0.22/23 136} Bg7 5. h3 {(h2h3 Nc6d4 OO a7a6 Bb5c4 e7e6 a2a4 Ng8e7
d2d3 OO Bc1g5 h7h6 Bg5h4 d7d6 Nf3xd4 c5xd4 Nc3e2 Bc8d7 Qd1d2 g6g5 Bh4g3
Qd8b6 a4a5 Qb6c5) +0.19/23 210} d6 6. O-O {(OO Bc8d7 d2d3 Ng8f6 Bc1e3 OO
Qd1d2 Qd8c7 Rf1e1 Rf8e8 Bb5c4 a7a6 a2a4 e7e6 Nc3e2 d6d5 e4xd5 Nf6xd5 Be3xc5
Bg7xb2 Ra1b1 Nc6e5 Rb1xb2 Ne5xf3+ g2xf3 Qc7xc5 Rb2xb7 Bd7xa4 Bc4xd5 e6xd5)
+0.23/24 134} e5 7. d3 {(d2d3 Ng8e7 Bb5c4 OO Bc1g5 h7h6 Bg5xe7 Nc6xe7 a2a4
Bc8e6 Rf1e1 a7a6 Qd1d2 Ne7c6 Nc3d5 Nc6e7 Nd5xe7+ Qd8xe7 a4a5 Be6d7 Bc4d5
Ra8b8 b2b3 Bd7c6 c2c3 Rf8e8) +0.34/24 186} Ne7 8. Bc4 {(Bb5c4 OO a2a3 a7a6
a3a4 Qd8c7 Bc1g5 Bc8e6 Bg5xe7 Qc7xe7 Nc3d5 Be6xd5 Bc4xd5 Qe7d7 c2c3 Nc6e7
Bd5b3 d6d5 Qd1e2 Ra8d8 Rf1d1 Qd7c7 a4a5 d5xe4 Qe2xe4 Ne7c6) +0.28/24 322}
O-O 9. a4 {(a2a4 h7h6 Nf3h2 Kg8h7 Bc1e3 a7a6 Be3d2 Bc8e6 Nh2g4 Be6xc4 d3xc4
f7f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Ng4e3 e5e4 Ne3d5 Nc6b4 Bd2e3 Ne7xd5 Nc3xd5 Nb4xd5 Qd1xd5)
+0.26/23 173} h6 10. Nh2 {(Nf3h2 Kg8h7 Rf1e1 Nc6d4 a4a5 Bc8e6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
a5a6 Ne7c6 Nc3e2 Nd4xe2+ Re1xe2 Nc6d4 Re2e1 Qd8b6 a6xb7 Qb6xb7 c2c3 Nd4b3
Ra1a3 Nb3xc1 Qd1xc1) +0.24/22 196} Kh7 11. Re1 {(Rf1e1 Bc8e6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Nc3b1 d6d5 Nb1d2 Qd8d6 c2c3 Ra8d8 Qd1e2 Nc6a5 Nh2f3 Ne7c6 Ra1a3 Rf8f7
Nd2b3) +0.23/21 316} f5 12. b3 {(b2b3 a7a6 Qd1d2 f5f4 Nc3e2 Qd8a5 Qd2d1
Qa5c7 Bc1b2 Nc6a5 Ne2c3 Na5xc4 d3xc4 Bc8e6 Nh2f3 Bg7f6 a4a5) +0.23/20 203}
f4 13. Bd2 {(Bc1d2 Ra8b8 Nc3d5 Bc8e6 Bd2c3 Be6f7 Nd5xe7 Qd8xe7 Nh2f3 Bg7f6
Bc3b2 Kh7g7 c2c3 a7a6 Nf3d2 Bf7xc4 d3xc4 b7b6) +0.16/23 189} Ng8 14. Nf3
{(Nh2f3 Ng8f6 Nc3d5 Bc8e6 Nd5b6 Be6xc4 Nb6xc4 d6d5 e4xd5 Nf6xd5 Re1e4 Rf8e8
Qd1f1 Nd5f6 Re4e2 e5e4 d3xe4 Nf6xe4 Ra1d1 Ne4xd2 Re2xd2 Nc6d4 Nf3xd4 c5xd4
c2c3 Qd8d5 f2f3 Re8e7 c3xd4) +0.24/24 370} g5 15. Nd5 {(Nc3d5 Ng8f6 c2c3
Nc6a5 Nd5xf6+ Qd8xf6 Bc4d5 Na5c6 a4a5 Nc6e7 Bd5c4 Bc8e6 Qd1c2 Kh7g8 a5a6
b7b6 Ra1d1 Be6xc4 d3xc4 Qf6e6 Bd2c1) +0.44/23 172} h5 16. Nh2 {(Nf3h2 Kh7h6
b3b4 c5xb4 Nd5xb4 Ng8f6 Ra1b1 Qd8c7 Nb4d5 Nf6xd5 Bc4xd5 Bg7f6 Rb1b2 Rf8e8
c2c3 Bc8e6 Qd1b3 Be6xd5 Qb3xd5 Ra8c8 Re1b1 b7b6 Nh2f3) +0.46/22 127} Kh6
17. b4 {(b3b4 c5xb4 Nd5xb4 Bc8d7 Ra1b1 Nc6xb4 Rb1xb4 Ra8b8 Qd1e2 a7a5 Rb4b2
Bd7xa4 Re1b1 Qd8c7 Nh2f3 b7b5 Bc4xb5 Ba4xb5 Rb2xb5 Rb8xb5 Rb1xb5 a5a4 c2c4
Rf8b8 Bd2a5 Qc7a7) +0.43/22 175} cxb4 18. Nxb4 {(Nd5xb4 Bc8d7 Nb4d5 Ng8f6
Nd5c3 Qd8e7 Qd1c1 Bd7e6 Bc4xe6 Qe7xe6 Ra1b1 Qe6d7 Qc1b2 Nc6d4 Nc3e2 Nd4xe2+
Re1xe2 Qd7xa4 Nh2f3 b7b6 h3h4 g5g4 Nf3g5 Ra8c8 c2c4 Qa4d7 Rb1a1 Kh6g6)
+0.42/22 149} Nxb4 19. Bxb4 {(Bd2xb4 Qd8c7 Qd1d2 Ng8e7 Bb4a3 Rf8f6 Ra1b1
Bc8e6 Qd2b4 Be6xc4 Qb4xb7 Qc7xb7 Rb1xb7 Bc4e6 Rb7xe7 Bg7f8 Re7b7 Rf6f7
Rb7xf7 Be6xf7 Nh2f3 Ra8c8 c2c4 Rc8b8 h3h4) +0.47/22 155} Nf6 20. d4 {(d3d4
Qd8c7 Bc4b3 Rf8d8 Nh2f3 g5g4 h3xg4 h5xg4 Nf3h4 Kh6h5 g2g3 Nf6h7 Kg1g2 f4f3+
Kg2f1 e5xd4 Qd1d3 Bg7e5 Bb4d2 Nh7g5 Bb3d5 Rd8e8 Ra1b1 Re8h8 Re1d1) +0.57/22
223} Qc7 21. Bb3 {(Bc4b3 Rf8d8 Nh2f3 g5g4 h3xg4 h5xg4 Nf3h4 Kh6h5 g2g3
Nf6h7 Kg1g2 f4f3+ Kg2f1 e5xd4 Qd1d3 Bg7e5 Bb4d2 Nh7g5 Bb3d5 Ra8b8 Ra1b1
Rd8h8) +0.54/23 699} Rd8 22. Nf3 {(Nh2f3 a7a5 Bb4a3 g5g4 h3xg4 h5xg4 Nf3h4
Kh6h5 g2g3 Bg7h6 Nh4f5 Bc8xf5 e4xf5 Bh6g5 Ra1b1 f4xg3 f2xg3 Qc7c3 Kg1g2
Bg5d2 Ba3c1 Qc3f3+ Qd1xf3 g4xf3+ Kg2xf3 e5e4+ Re1xe4 Nf6xe4 Kf3xe4)
+0.79/21 173} Nh7 23. a5 {(a4a5 Ra8b8 Ra1b1 Bg7f6 Bb3d5 Qc7g7 d4xe5 d6xe5
Rb1b3 g5g4 h3xg4 Bc8xg4 Qd1d3 h5h4 Kg1h1 Rb8c8 Bb4d2 Bg4xf3 Qd3xf3 Nh7g5
Qf3d3 Rc8c7 Re1b1 h4h3 g2xh3) +0.85/21 156} Bf6 24. Bd5 {(Bb3d5 Ra8b8 Ra1b1
Nh7f8 Rb1b3 Nf8g6 Rb3c3 Qc7d7 d4xe5 d6xe5 Rc3d3 Qd7c7 c2c3 g5g4 h3xg4 h5xg4
Nf3h2 Qc7d7 Qd1d2 Qd7g7 Bb4c5 b7b6 a5xb6 a7xb6 Re1b1 Ng6e7 Rb1xb6) +0.75/21
100} Rb8 25. Ra3 {(Ra1a3 Qc7g7 d4xe5 d6xe5 Ra3d3 g5g4 h3xg4 Bc8xg4 Qd1d2
Bg4xf3 Rd3xf3 Bf6e7 Bb4xe7 Qg7xe7 Rf3b3 Nh7f6 c2c4 Rd8d7 Qd2b2 Rb8c8 Re1b1
Rc8c5 Rb3h3 Kh6g7 Qb2c3) +0.59/21 400} g4 26. hxg4 {(h3xg4 Bc8xg4 Qd1d2
Qc7g7 Ra3d3 Bg4xf3 Rd3xf3 Nh7g5 Rf3b3 h5h4 Kg1h1 Qg7g6 d4xe5 d6xe5 Qd2d3
h4h3 g2xh3 Qg6h5 Re1g1 f4f3 Rg1g3) +0.84/22 243} hxg4 27. dxe5 {(d4xe5
d6xe5 Nf3h2 Qc7g7 Ra3b3 b7b6 Bb4a3 Kh6h5 Rb3h3+ Kh5g5 Rh3d3 Kg5h6 Ba3b4
b6xa5 Bb4xa5 Rd8f8 Rd3c3 Bf6d8 Rc3xc8 Rb8xc8 Nh2xg4+ Kh6g6 Ba5d2 Rf8e8 c2c4
Nh7f6 Ng4xf6 Bd8xf6 Qd1f3 Re8h8 Re1d1) +0.80/22 181} dxe5 28. Nh2 {(Nf3h2
Qc7g7 Ra3b3 b7b6 Bb4a3 Kh6h5 Rb3h3+ Kh5g5 Rh3c3 Kg5h5 Ba3b4 Kh5h6 a5xb6
a7xb6 Bb4a3 Qg7g6 Rc3c7 Rb8a8 Rc7xc8 Ra8xc8 Nh2xg4+ Kh6g7 Ba3b4 Nh7g5)
+0.80/21 78} Qg7 29. Rd3 {(Ra3d3 Qg7g6 Bb4c5 b7b6 Bc5b4 f4f3 Qd1d2+ Nh7g5
g2xf3 g4xf3 Rd3xf3 Kh6h7 Rf3g3 Qg6h6 a5xb6 a7xb6 Kg1g2 Bc8h3+ Kg2h1 Qh6h4
Qd2c3 Bh3d7 Bb4d6 Rb8c8 Qc3b2 Bd7c6) +0.84/20 97} Qg6 30. Bc5 {(Bb4c5 b7b6
a5xb6 a7xb6 Bc5b4 f4f3 Bd5c4 Rd8xd3 Qd1xd3 Nh7g5 Qd3d6 Ng5h3+ Kg1f1 f3xg2+
Kf1xg2 Nh3f4+ Kg2h1 Rb8a8 Qd6c6 Ra8b8 Bb4f8+ Kh6g5 Qc6c7 Rb8a8 Bf8e7 Kg5h5
Be7xf6 Qg6xf6 Bc4d5 Nf4xd5 e4xd5 Kh5g6 Kh1g2 b6b5) +0.59/19 146} b6 31.
axb6 {(a5xb6 a7xb6 Bc5b4 Qg6h5 Bd5c6 Bc8e6 Bc6d7 Rd8xd7 Rd3xd7 Nh7g5 Bb4e7
g4g3 f2xg3 f4xg3 Nh2f1 Qh5xd1 Re1xd1 Be6xd7 Be7xf6 Bd7g4 Rd1b1 Ng5xe4
Bf6xe5 Rb8b7 c2c3 Bg4f5 Rb1b5 Kh6g6 Nf1xg3 Bf5d7 Rb5b4 Ne4xg3 Be5xg3 Bd7e6
Bg3e5) +0.31/20 122} axb6 32. Ba3 {(Bc5a3 Qg6h5 Bd5c6 Rd8h8 Bc6d7 Bc8xd7
Rd3xd7 Rb8g8 Rd7d6 Rg8g6 Ba3b2 g4g3 f2xg3 Rg6xg3 Qd1xh5+ Kh6xh5 Re1e2 Rh8c8
Kg1f1 Rg3e3 c2c3 Bf6g5 Rd6xb6 Nh7f6 Rb6b4 Re3d3 Nh2f3 Bg5h4) -0.06/21 166}
Qh5 33. Bc4 {(Bd5c4 Rd8h8 Rd3d6 Kh6g6 Bc4e2 Nh7g5 Rd6xf6+ Kg6xf6 Qd1d6+
Kf6f7 Qd6c7+) -0.16/20 117} Rh8 34. Rd6 {(Rd3d6 Kh6g6 Qd1d5 Rb8b7 Qd5c6
Kg6g7 Re1b1 g4g3 f2xg3 f4xg3 Nh2f1 Nh7g5 Nf1xg3 Qh5h2+ Kg1f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3
Rb7f7 Bc4xf7 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Nh3g5+) -0.25/20 85} Kg6 35. Qd5
{(Qd1d5 Rb8b7 Qd5c6 Kg6g7 Re1b1 g4g3 f2xg3 f4xg3 Nh2f1 Nh7g5 Nf1xg3 Qh5h2+
Kg1f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Rb7f7 Bc4xf7 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Nh3g5+) -0.25/20
73} Rb7 36. Qc6 {(Qd5c6 Kg6g7 Re1b1 g4g3 f2xg3 f4xg3 Nh2f1 Nh7g5 Nf1xg3
Qh5h2+ Kg1f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Rb7f7 Bc4xf7 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Nh3g5+)
-0.44/19 61} Kg7 37. Rb1 {(Re1b1 g4g3 f2xg3 Nh7g5 Nh2f1 f4f3 Rd6xf6 f3xg2
Kg1xg2 Qh5h1+ Kg2f2 Ng5xe4+ Kf2e1 Ne4xf6 Ba3f8+ Kg7g6 Qc6xc8 Qh1e4+ Ke1d2
Rh8xf8 Qc8xf8 Qe4xc4 Qf8b4 Rb7d7+ Kd2e1 Qc4xc2 Nf1e3 Qc2h2 Qb4b2 Rd7d2
Qb2xd2 Qh2h1+ Ke1e2 Qh1xb1 Ne3c4 Qb1e4+ Nc4e3 b6b5 Qd2d6 Qe4d4 Qd6e6 b5b4
Ne3c4 Qd4g4+ Qe6xg4+ Nf6xg4 Ke2d3 Kg6f5) -1.01/17 54} g3 38. fxg3 {(f2xg3
Nh7g5 Nh2f1 f4f3 Rd6xf6 f3xg2 Kg1xg2 Qh5h1+ Kg2f2 Ng5xe4+ Kf2e1 Ne4xf6
Ba3f8+ Kg7g6 Qc6xc8 Qh1e4+ Bc4e2 Rb7f7 Rb1xb6 Rf7xf8 Qc8a6 Rh8h1 Ke1d2
Kg6g5 Qa6d3 Qe4xd3+ c2xd3 Rf8d8 Rb6b5 Rd8d5 Rb5xd5 Nf6xd5 Nf1e3 Nd5xe3
Kd2xe3 Rh1e1 Ke3f2 Re1b1 Be2f3 Rb1b3) -0.93/18 50} fxg3 39. Nf1 {(Nh2f1
Nh7g5 Nf1xg3 Qh5h2+ Kg1f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2 Ng5h3+) -0.24/15 0} Ng5
40. Nxg3 {(Nf1xg3 Qh5h2+ Kg1f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2 Ng5h3+) -0.24/14
1} Qh2+ 41. Kf2 {(Kg1f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2 Ng5h3+) -0.24/13 0} Nh3+
42. Kf3 {(Kf2f3 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3) -0.24/12} Ng5+ 43. Kf2 {(Kf3f2
Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2) -0.24/11} Nh3+ 44. Kf3 {(Kf2f3 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2
Ng5h3+ Kf2f3) -0.24/10} Ng5+ 45. Kf2 {(Kf3f2 Ng5h3+ Kf2f3 Nh3g5+ Kf3f2)
-0.24/9 3-fold repetition} 1/2-1/2
With all do respect Robert, you should ask moderation to do something about it. It's their job. The fact that they decided to ignore it, speaks a lot about them.Houdini wrote:Again, can I kindly invite you all to continue your "derivative" discussion outside this Houdini release thread?
Please stop polluting this thread with a rehash of arguments that have been repeated ad nauseam before, you make it very difficult for other people to find useful information about the release.
Thank you.
You know what doesn't impress me? Your self righteous attitude. Goes for some of the other cronies around here that commented on my comments telling you to give Robert some due. Now that hes told you he didn't use any crafy code ....where is the "I'm sorry Robert for accusing you without proof. I must of got out of the wrong side of bed" ...goes for Graham and Albert silver too. You guys are quick to mouth off and bad mouth and real slow with the apologies. Funny how that goes ...its all about what you want and demand with no apologies now that you have your answer with your stinking attitudes...but but Robert had best do this if hes a decent guy. Try being decent yourself first ...take a look in the mirror guys. The second you get your answer you immediately respond with the above post moving right along with how its ippo now which again would be none of your concern. Why most go to Open Chess forum now.Peter Skinner wrote:What I am saying it is a clone of Ippolit, nothing more, nothing less. Has it improved on the original source. Sure. Am I saying people can't use it? Obviously no, as that is your choice, just as it is mine to not use it or any of the other derivatives in that family of engines.Robert Flesher wrote: If it is a clone, and to this we have seen NO evidence but only conjecture. The idea of Houdini < Rybka is clearly "Argumentum ad Novitatem" It is likely that he did exactly what VAS did. Looked at code (Vas ,used Fruit, Robert / Ippo*) saw the ideas, and made them better. If it's ok for Vas, it should be fine for Robert. If it is only a clone why is it so much stronger ?
From a customer point of view, ( I paided good money for Rybka 2, 3, 4), Robert provides a stonger, better analysis tool, far better endgame player, and regular updates. All for free! If tommorrow he was to sell the next version, I'd buy it.
Lastly, Houdini appears to be at very least 50 ELO stronger than Rybka 4.0. Give credit where credit is due! As envy is the pursuit of fools, and you do not strike my as such.
Nor am I envious of what he has accomplished. Being on the Crafty team has taught me that even 1-5 elo gains are impressive, because the hard work involved and the insane amount of testing that goes into each of those small incremental increases feels awesome when they are verified improvements.
Taking someone's code, improving on it slightly when you already have one of the strongest source projects to start as a base doesn't impress me. Write something from scratch that beats the #1 program by 50 elo and I will be impressed.
My initial question was to see the source based on Robert Houdart's claim that he used "ideas" from Crafty. He states there is no actual code, and I have nothing to refute that with as there is no source to look at. So I have to take his word on that until one day it might be released.
In my opinion it is a clone, and I'm entitled to that opinion just like you are yours.
Peter
It's a shame they don't stay there and pollute that forum with their crap instead of this one.BTO7 wrote:Why most go to Open Chess forum now.
BT
Graham Banks wrote:It's a shame they don't stay there and pollute that forum with their crap instead of this one.BTO7 wrote:Why most go to Open Chess forum now.
BT
Hi Michael !Michael Sherwin wrote: Who is this Osipov character? Is he the author of Strelka? When he was first known we only heard of him second hand and then only through translation from Russian that was very hard to understand. His first name has had three different spellings; Yuri, Jury and Juri. When he appeared here for the first time his English was very rough. Then nothing for awhile. Then when the Ipp* controversy started up he rejoined with nearly perfect English. At first he was in opposition to Vas and now he is a Vas supporter. What gives with citing him as a source? Does anyone know for sure that he is whom he says he is?
S