How to use null move in Arena?

[slobo]

How to use null move in Arena, in analyze mode?
Is it possible?

[Edmund]

Game / Insert Nullmove ( Crtl + Alt + N )

[hgm]

Is this a desirable feature? In WinBoard I implemented turn passing (by clicking on the clock of the side not to move) only in the Alien edition, for certain non-Chesslike variants (e.g. Go and Reversi needed this).

Perhaps I should transfer that patch to the normal edition, and switch it on in analysis mode...

[Edmund]

I personally use it quite often when analyzing a certain position. It gives me a nice picture of what threats to look out for.

It might even make for a more complex gui feature. You press a button and it will use the engine to do a multivariation search and then indicate threats (eval_root <= eval_leaf - margin) with arrows on the board.

[Michel]

Is this a desirable feature?

Yes I think so. I often use a fake null move (a move that does not change the position significantly) to see what the other side is threatening.

[slobo]

Game / Insert Nullmove ( Crtl + Alt + N )

Ok, but it does not work. It only makes that engine analize the same position for other side. Null move should suggest the next move for the same side, without considering the opponent´s move.

It seems Null Move has not been implemented correctly in Arena.

[Edmund]

Nullmove has nothing to do with the followup move.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Null_move

[hgm]

I don't understand what you mean at all. Doing a null move is by definition the same as giving the turn to the other side in the same position, right? I am a bit confused what you mean by 'same side' and 'opponent'. Say I would be in theopening position, and play a Null move (for white). What would you expect to see now? Something like "1... e7e5 2. e2e4 Nf6 3. Nc3"?

[slobo]

Nullmove has nothing to do with the followup move.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Null_move

"In game theory, a null move is a decision by a player to "pass" (that is, not to make a move) when it is their turn to move."

If White plays a move, Black decides not to play, and White plays again. This is a concept of Null Move.

As Michel Van den Bergh said: "I often use a fake null move (a move that does not change the position significantly) to see what the other side is threatening."
In a Chess Software you do it when you allows one side to make his second move, immediately after the first one, without leting the opponent to make his move.

[slobo]

I don't understand what you mean at all. Doing a null move is by definition the same as giving the turn to the other side in the same position, right? I am a bit confused what you mean by 'same side' and 'opponent'. Say I would be in theopening position, and play a Null move (for white). What would you expect to see now? Something like "1... e7e5 2. e2e4 Nf6 3. Nc3"?

For example, White plays a move. I don´t understend it; don´t know what does it mean; what the white´s intention is. In order to find out more about his plans, I would use analize mode and let him play again, because I want to descover possible consequences of his move.