Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

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Zach Wegner
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by Zach Wegner » Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:25 pm

Rebel wrote:
Zach Wegner wrote:
Rebel wrote:Did you a favor and updated the page, I don't think you will like it. But you forced me. The thing you have to learn is to take responsibility for what you said in the past but is not convenient today.

http://www.top-5000.nl/pst.htm
When did Bob change his name to ICGA Bob?
Nowhere on that page.
I'm talking about this:
So far for setting the record straight with ICGA Robert Hyatt because he intentionally or unintentionally has persuaded the innocent readers of Rybka forum to believe with statements as listed above Vasik copied the DATA of Fruit and thus PST's are equal. While ICGA Hyatt now vehemently is denying he did that, a few more of his quotes:



Hyatt - The evidence is _not_ based on "conjecture". It is based on specific analysis of Rybka and Crafty or Rybka and Fruit. There is no "interpretation" required. Have you actually _read_ Zach's and Mark's report? People keep saying "show me side by side comparisons." First page of Zach's report has _exactly_ that. Two columns. The comparison goes on for pages and pages. Side by side. Piece by piece...
Hyatt - No, there was no code copying. however, there was "Data Copying" which is exactly the same thing in the given context. Not allowable.

Either ICGA Robert Hyatt is deliberately lying to his innocent readers or (at the time) he had not understood the issue itself as the ICGA never made the claim DATA was copied but CODE, the PST initialization code to be precisely. We may offer ICGA Robert Hyatt the benefit of the doubt here, what we certainly DO NOT accept is that he now is trying to lie his way out by denying his own statements, hence this page update.

When the false information was addressed to him here at Rybka forum ICGA Hyatt quickly altered his speech a few days later because the forum members felt cheated. However no apology from ICGA Robert Hyatt for spreading misinformation.
Six times you called him "ICGA Robert Hyatt" or "ICGA Hyatt". I was asking because I found this beyond bizarre, more than I felt could be explained by your non-native English speaker status. I am still very confused here...

As for your completely unrelated other point, I never promised a single thing to you. I'm certainly not going to put in that much work to please you, you don't even listen to me when I talk to you (or maybe you don't understand?). You can put up webpages saying I'm not replying to your emails, but you really should know why I'm not responding.

You were the one that put my name on your page attacking Bob. I had absolutely nothing to do with that dispute, and I kindly asked you to take my name off, as I'm trying not to waste my time in this debate any more (and I had not even said anything publicly for probably a couple months). I even offered to talk about your pages if you would do so. But you refused to even acknowledge the request, instead going off onto many other tangents.

So make as many web pages attacking me as you like, but the fact remains: I refuse to take part in discussions with you until you are ready to have a normal, adult conversation. And for me, that starts with taking down phrases like "In typical unscientific Zach Wegner style" from your site. Sorry if that's too much to ask...

bob
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by bob » Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:49 pm

JuLieN wrote:
bob wrote:
Rebel wrote:
bob wrote:
Zach Wegner wrote:
Rebel wrote:Did you a favor and updated the page, I don't think you will like it. But you forced me. The thing you have to learn is to take responsibility for what you said in the past but is not convenient today.

http://www.top-5000.nl/pst.htm
When did Bob change his name to ICGA Bob?
Consider the source. Then ignore the content. You will be better off.
Bob, I would do the same for you.

Chris too.
I have been ignoring Chris for years so I don't need THAT advice. :)
If I'm not mistaken, I think that what Ed meant is that what he does for Vas he would do for you, too, and so you shouldn't take his arguments any personal. :?:
I know. :)

But I would not want him, or anyone else, to intentionally twist facts to defend me against anything.

bob
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by bob » Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:53 pm

Zach Wegner wrote:
Rebel wrote:
Zach Wegner wrote:
Rebel wrote:Did you a favor and updated the page, I don't think you will like it. But you forced me. The thing you have to learn is to take responsibility for what you said in the past but is not convenient today.

http://www.top-5000.nl/pst.htm
When did Bob change his name to ICGA Bob?
Nowhere on that page.
I'm talking about this:
So far for setting the record straight with ICGA Robert Hyatt because he intentionally or unintentionally has persuaded the innocent readers of Rybka forum to believe with statements as listed above Vasik copied the DATA of Fruit and thus PST's are equal. While ICGA Hyatt now vehemently is denying he did that, a few more of his quotes:



Hyatt - The evidence is _not_ based on "conjecture". It is based on specific analysis of Rybka and Crafty or Rybka and Fruit. There is no "interpretation" required. Have you actually _read_ Zach's and Mark's report? People keep saying "show me side by side comparisons." First page of Zach's report has _exactly_ that. Two columns. The comparison goes on for pages and pages. Side by side. Piece by piece...
Hyatt - No, there was no code copying. however, there was "Data Copying" which is exactly the same thing in the given context. Not allowable.

Either ICGA Robert Hyatt is deliberately lying to his innocent readers or (at the time) he had not understood the issue itself as the ICGA never made the claim DATA was copied but CODE, the PST initialization code to be precisely. We may offer ICGA Robert Hyatt the benefit of the doubt here, what we certainly DO NOT accept is that he now is trying to lie his way out by denying his own statements, hence this page update.

When the false information was addressed to him here at Rybka forum ICGA Hyatt quickly altered his speech a few days later because the forum members felt cheated. However no apology from ICGA Robert Hyatt for spreading misinformation.
Six times you called him "ICGA Robert Hyatt" or "ICGA Hyatt". I was asking because I found this beyond bizarre, more than I felt could be explained by your non-native English speaker status. I am still very confused here...

As for your completely unrelated other point, I never promised a single thing to you. I'm certainly not going to put in that much work to please you, you don't even listen to me when I talk to you (or maybe you don't understand?). You can put up webpages saying I'm not replying to your emails, but you really should know why I'm not responding.

You were the one that put my name on your page attacking Bob. I had absolutely nothing to do with that dispute, and I kindly asked you to take my name off, as I'm trying not to waste my time in this debate any more (and I had not even said anything publicly for probably a couple months). I even offered to talk about your pages if you would do so. But you refused to even acknowledge the request, instead going off onto many other tangents.

So make as many web pages attacking me as you like, but the fact remains: I refuse to take part in discussions with you until you are ready to have a normal, adult conversation. And for me, that starts with taking down phrases like "In typical unscientific Zach Wegner style" from your site. Sorry if that's too much to ask...
Wow. You have more fortitude that I do, because apparently you read everything there. I would compare this to sticking a big paddle in a large tank, and stirring. And thinking "holy crap, this really is crap, and it stinks, and damned if I am going to stir any further because the smell only gets worse."

I started at the front and quit quickly after seeing what this "web revelation" was all about.

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Rebel
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by Rebel » Sun Jan 08, 2012 9:25 pm

Zach Wegner wrote:
Rebel wrote:
Zach Wegner wrote:
Rebel wrote:Did you a favor and updated the page, I don't think you will like it. But you forced me. The thing you have to learn is to take responsibility for what you said in the past but is not convenient today.

http://www.top-5000.nl/pst.htm
When did Bob change his name to ICGA Bob?
Nowhere on that page.
I'm talking about this:
So far for setting the record straight with ICGA Robert Hyatt because he intentionally or unintentionally has persuaded the innocent readers of Rybka forum to believe with statements as listed above Vasik copied the DATA of Fruit and thus PST's are equal. While ICGA Hyatt now vehemently is denying he did that, a few more of his quotes:



Hyatt - The evidence is _not_ based on "conjecture". It is based on specific analysis of Rybka and Crafty or Rybka and Fruit. There is no "interpretation" required. Have you actually _read_ Zach's and Mark's report? People keep saying "show me side by side comparisons." First page of Zach's report has _exactly_ that. Two columns. The comparison goes on for pages and pages. Side by side. Piece by piece...
Hyatt - No, there was no code copying. however, there was "Data Copying" which is exactly the same thing in the given context. Not allowable.

Either ICGA Robert Hyatt is deliberately lying to his innocent readers or (at the time) he had not understood the issue itself as the ICGA never made the claim DATA was copied but CODE, the PST initialization code to be precisely. We may offer ICGA Robert Hyatt the benefit of the doubt here, what we certainly DO NOT accept is that he now is trying to lie his way out by denying his own statements, hence this page update.

When the false information was addressed to him here at Rybka forum ICGA Hyatt quickly altered his speech a few days later because the forum members felt cheated. However no apology from ICGA Robert Hyatt for spreading misinformation.
Six times you called him "ICGA Robert Hyatt" or "ICGA Hyatt". I was asking because I found this beyond bizarre, more than I felt could be explained by your non-native English speaker status. I am still very confused here...

As for your completely unrelated other point, I never promised a single thing to you. I'm certainly not going to put in that much work to please you, you don't even listen to me when I talk to you (or maybe you don't understand?). You can put up webpages saying I'm not replying to your emails, but you really should know why I'm not responding.

You were the one that put my name on your page attacking Bob. I had absolutely nothing to do with that dispute, and I kindly asked you to take my name off, as I'm trying not to waste my time in this debate any more (and I had not even said anything publicly for probably a couple months). I even offered to talk about your pages if you would do so. But you refused to even acknowledge the request, instead going off onto many other tangents.

So make as many web pages attacking me as you like, but the fact remains: I refuse to take part in discussions with you until you are ready to have a normal, adult conversation. And for me, that starts with taking down phrases like "In typical unscientific Zach Wegner style" from your site. Sorry if that's too much to ask...
Zach,

You many years ago declared full war on Vas, soiled his name and you, of all, complains?

Apparently you don't have understood some rules in life yet.

1. Every action causes a reaction of the same magnitude.

2. Declare war without getting hurt yourself is an utopia.

I am sorry for you that you feel you are a target now, but you hunted Vas yourself for years until he got sick and tired of the accusations and as a hurt animal started to live as a hermit.

If you don't understand that you are missing a few crucial EQ genes.

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Zach Wegner
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by Zach Wegner » Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:07 pm

Rebel wrote:
Zach Wegner wrote:
Rebel wrote:
Zach Wegner wrote:
Rebel wrote:Did you a favor and updated the page, I don't think you will like it. But you forced me. The thing you have to learn is to take responsibility for what you said in the past but is not convenient today.

http://www.top-5000.nl/pst.htm
When did Bob change his name to ICGA Bob?
Nowhere on that page.
I'm talking about this:
So far for setting the record straight with ICGA Robert Hyatt because he intentionally or unintentionally has persuaded the innocent readers of Rybka forum to believe with statements as listed above Vasik copied the DATA of Fruit and thus PST's are equal. While ICGA Hyatt now vehemently is denying he did that, a few more of his quotes:



Hyatt - The evidence is _not_ based on "conjecture". It is based on specific analysis of Rybka and Crafty or Rybka and Fruit. There is no "interpretation" required. Have you actually _read_ Zach's and Mark's report? People keep saying "show me side by side comparisons." First page of Zach's report has _exactly_ that. Two columns. The comparison goes on for pages and pages. Side by side. Piece by piece...
Hyatt - No, there was no code copying. however, there was "Data Copying" which is exactly the same thing in the given context. Not allowable.

Either ICGA Robert Hyatt is deliberately lying to his innocent readers or (at the time) he had not understood the issue itself as the ICGA never made the claim DATA was copied but CODE, the PST initialization code to be precisely. We may offer ICGA Robert Hyatt the benefit of the doubt here, what we certainly DO NOT accept is that he now is trying to lie his way out by denying his own statements, hence this page update.

When the false information was addressed to him here at Rybka forum ICGA Hyatt quickly altered his speech a few days later because the forum members felt cheated. However no apology from ICGA Robert Hyatt for spreading misinformation.
Six times you called him "ICGA Robert Hyatt" or "ICGA Hyatt". I was asking because I found this beyond bizarre, more than I felt could be explained by your non-native English speaker status. I am still very confused here...

As for your completely unrelated other point, I never promised a single thing to you. I'm certainly not going to put in that much work to please you, you don't even listen to me when I talk to you (or maybe you don't understand?). You can put up webpages saying I'm not replying to your emails, but you really should know why I'm not responding.

You were the one that put my name on your page attacking Bob. I had absolutely nothing to do with that dispute, and I kindly asked you to take my name off, as I'm trying not to waste my time in this debate any more (and I had not even said anything publicly for probably a couple months). I even offered to talk about your pages if you would do so. But you refused to even acknowledge the request, instead going off onto many other tangents.

So make as many web pages attacking me as you like, but the fact remains: I refuse to take part in discussions with you until you are ready to have a normal, adult conversation. And for me, that starts with taking down phrases like "In typical unscientific Zach Wegner style" from your site. Sorry if that's too much to ask...
Zach,

You many years ago declared full war on Vas, soiled his name and you, of all, complains?

Apparently you don't have understood some rules in life yet.

1. Every action causes a reaction of the same magnitude.

2. Declare war without getting hurt yourself is an utopia.

I am sorry for you that you feel you are a target now, but you hunted Vas yourself for years until he got sick and tired of the accusations and as a hurt animal started to live as a hermit.

If you don't understand that you are missing a few crucial EQ genes.
I never declared war on Vas. Every time we have talked it has been, at the very least, professional, and almost always friendly. Did I ever insult him personally? (No.) Did I ever malign his character or judge his person in any way? (No.) In fact, I specifically avoided mentioning this issue (or that of Pradu's magic bitboard code) at all to the ICGA when I was in Japan. Does that sound like someone who has declared war?

I don't feel I'm a target. It's just that you're putting up web pages publicly stating misleading things about me without any provocation. So I feel somewhat compelled to publicly set the record straight: the reason I have not responded to your emails is because you refuse to have a respectable conversation like a mature adult.

Perhaps you should take an example from my talks with Vas in the Rybka forum today? I am perfectly willing to have conversations with people that have shown me the most minimal amount of respect I would expect as a human. You have utterly failed in that regard.

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Rebel
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by Rebel » Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:43 pm

Zach Wegner wrote: I never declared war on Vas.
What ???

You still don't see your own role in the whole process ?
Every time we have talked it has been, at the very least, professional, and almost always friendly. Did I ever insult him personally?
That's not what this is about, being friendly and such. What you did was attacking someone, his work, his person, his integrity, his livelihood. And that is NEVER and act of friendliness, you were out to expose him.

Just stop the nonsense OK ?

Zach, I like you, read enough of you that you are a good person at heart. I will remove that text that upset you, the parody on the ICGA process has served its purpose after all.

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slobo
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by slobo » Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:55 pm

Rebel wrote:
Zach,

You many years ago declared full war on Vas, soiled his name and you, of all, complains?

Apparently you don't have understood some rules in life yet.

1. Every action causes a reaction of the same magnitude.

2. Declare war without getting hurt yourself is an utopia.

I am sorry for you that you feel you are a target now, but you hunted Vas yourself for years until he got sick and tired of the accusations and as a hurt animal started to live as a hermit.

If you don't understand that you are missing a few crucial EQ genes.
Gosh, Ed,

It seems you are an expert conserning "rules in life"!
But there are thing I dont´t understand: if Zach did declare war to Vas, what do you have to do with it?

Are you Vasic´s lawer ? Perhaps his mercenary ? Or something else ?

Thanks for your atention.

SL
"Well, I´m just a soul whose intentions are good,
Oh Lord, please don´t let me be misunderstood."

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Rolf
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by Rolf » Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:59 pm

Rebel wrote:Zach,

You many years ago declared full war on Vas, soiled his name and you, of all, complains?

Apparently you don't have understood some rules in life yet.

1. Every action causes a reaction of the same magnitude.

2. Declare war without getting hurt yourself is an utopia.

I am sorry for you that you feel you are a target now
Ed, you made my day. Also I wanted to tell you of the great respect I want to show you for your strong actions in this ugly war of the ICGA.

I dont know if you read yet the new development on rybkaforum where Vas has thanked you in the first rank and Chris with some important other fighters against the ICGA evil.

Expectedly Harvey paid a short tribute there, then also Bob appeared again and Zach too, also Keith (!).

I hope that the main insulters will be judicially investigated with all their past activities during the last 6 years.

We will see what future gives.
-Popper and Lakatos are good but I'm stuck on Leibowitz

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JuLieN
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by JuLieN » Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:01 pm

Image
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Terry McCracken
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Re: Ed Schröder retires from ICGA.

Post by Terry McCracken » Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:16 pm

JuLieN wrote:Image
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Terry McCracken

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