Adam Hair wrote:
Amateur thinker? Well, at least you used the term "thinker" in the description.
I would like to point out that your statements have not been limited to cautions against lynch mob mentality.
At any rate, I will reiterate my statement. There has not been a neutral assessment of all the evidence presented, so I have tried to provide that with my report.
As for the rest of your post, I hope you will allow me to wait until I return home this evening. This phone I am using at the moment impedes my ability to answer you properly (it is much easier to read posts than to reply).
Adam
We have here a play with words. All what I said and meant amateur thinkers for those who couldnt have understood my point, was always that we had a yearlong hate campaign, that was the argument standing on the explained in dubio pro reo which was permanently violated by Bob Hyatt.
Apart from the wording I used as a foreigner my position was neither pro nor anti Rybka because I'm just an observer but no CC expert. So all I expressed was the _neutral_ statement that this hate campaign was against everything of the IN DUBIO PRO REO. Trivially it's not following a bias if I support such a basc rule or law. Do you understand me?
So, since I expressed always this basic requirement of the truth you were wrong with the assumption that we only had biased messages. Sorry if I have to insist, but I know that you are open for such unrefutable statements. My insisting on the bases doesnt become false if I add some aggressive undertone. Normally those who didnt even hear of that requirement, normally shouldnt even be worth for a reply, perhaps this would be better. But you normally should be able to understand the relevance of the iron rule.
Now I will try to read your paper. Perhaps you could find something neutral too.
-Popper and Lakatos are good but I'm stuck on Leibowitz
geots wrote: - but they should have listened to Conkie at the start. This is exactly what he predicted.
That's quite interesting, what did Christopher say ?
And there is Rolf, he predicted right from the beginning, that this case if continued it would split the CC community into parts.
Conkie can correct me if necessary, but he said it was not "un-original" enough to prove anything. If my memory failed me- no doubt I will be corrected.
Adam Hair wrote:
Amateur thinker? Well, at least you used the term "thinker" in the description.
I would like to point out that your statements have not been limited to cautions against lynch mob mentality.
At any rate, I will reiterate my statement. There has not been a neutral assessment of all the evidence presented, so I have tried to provide that with my report.
As for the rest of your post, I hope you will allow me to wait until I return home this evening. This phone I am using at the moment impedes my ability to answer you properly (it is much easier to read posts than to reply).
Adam
We have here a play with words. All what I said and meant amateur thinkers for those who couldnt have understood my point, was always that we had a yearlong hate campaign, that was the argument standing on the explained in dubio pro reo which was permanently violated by Bob Hyatt.
Apart from the wording I used as a foreigner my position was neither pro nor anti Rybka because I'm just an observer but no CC expert. So all I expressed was the _neutral_ statement that this hate campaign was against everything of the IN DUBIO PRO REO. Trivially it's not following a bias if I support such a basc rule or law. Do you understand me?
So, since I expressed always this basic requirement of the truth you were wrong with the assumption that we only had biased messages. Sorry if I have to insist, but I know that you are open for such unrefutable statements. My insisting on the bases doesnt become false if I add some aggressive undertone. Normally those who didnt even hear of that requirement, normally shouldnt even be worth for a reply, perhaps this would be better. But you normally should be able to understand the relevance of the iron rule.
Now I will try to read your paper. Perhaps you could find something neutral too.
Rolfy....
What a pleasant surprise....
So Vasik cut off your tether and dropped you here to defend him and bite the villains yet again
_No one can hit as hard as life.But it ain’t about how hard you can hit.It’s about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward.How much you can take and keep moving forward….
Steve B wrote:You make valid points of course but i still think the forum is what keeps this in the news with Chessbase refutations as late as a few days ago..months after the ICGA decision
i guess if this happened to a commercial program like Shredder or Junior(both without forums).. then we would see if there would be such a rift...So late in the day
i guessing there wouldn't be
Regards
Steve
I think it's not related having a forum but all to Rybka's extreme dominance and then suddenly dethroned, not on the chess board but driven by politics. Lots of juicy dramatic elements, a story you only see once in a lifetime.
Politics? This is NOT about "politics". It is about bad personal behavior of a single person.
LucenaTheLucid wrote:Amazing work Adam. I believe it is critical for the laymen in this and other forum to remain neutral.
Perhaps you underrate the common sense of the layman. Juries in criminal cases, where the burden of proof is the very demanding “beyond reasonable doubt” and the consequence of their deliberations can be literally a matter of life or death consist of laymen and their work is deemed broadly satisfactory. Like the democratic system, the layman based jury system may be the “least worst” available.
Juries may not understand technical details but they appear to be capable of judging the reliability of expert witnesses and the quality of the evidence that they bring to court.
Juries composed of lay people are capable of detecting lies. For example there is something wrong when an aide to the accused announces that he discussed with the accused whether or not to hand over evidence that the accused claimed had already been destroyed.
Juries are also capable of factoring into their calculations examples of unnatural and suspicious behaviour. They are able to draw valid conclusions from instances where a defendant has evidence that will exonerate him if he is innocent and refuses, to release it, without good reason.
Juries are quite capable of factoring into their decision making process the knowledge that a man who has been shown to have previously committed a crime of the type of which he is currently accused continues to lie about his involvement in the previous crime.
Steve B wrote:
after all..who wants to be a day to day posting member of a forum where the engine has fallen into disgrace?
..so they keep the issue alive ..day after day and now several months after the decision ..they send a non-engine programmer and moderator to go defend it on Playchess..(perhaps in anticipation of the Rybka 5 release)...
IMHO Regards
Steve
Your perception of the members keeping this alive without provocation is not accurate. Dr. Hyatt's never posted until the ICGA started its investigation, And since as made an astounding 4660 posts repetitively stating the ICGA's position. Think about! It takes on the average it 3 years to post that many comments.
Steve B wrote:
after all..who wants to be a day to day posting member of a forum where the engine has fallen into disgrace?
..so they keep the issue alive ..day after day and now several months after the decision ..they send a non-engine programmer and moderator to go defend it on Playchess..(perhaps in anticipation of the Rybka 5 release)...
IMHO Regards
Steve
Your perception of the members keeping this alive without provocation is not accurate. Dr. Hyatt's never posted until the ICGA started its investigation, And since as made an astounding 4660 posts repetitively stating the ICGA's position. Think about! It takes on the average it 3 years to post that many comments.
sid
are you serious
how many posts did jeroen make in 20 days? 500 plus . now add up ALL he made in same time period as that you state Bob made 4660
read this without dragons breath mist covering your eyes
re: ChessBase finaly speaks of Rykba banning (using biased Rybka forum moderator)
Angels_77 just now
when desperately trying to use statistics to besmirch dr hyatts name this so called expert Søren Riis fails to disclose dr hyatts posts were in response to others posts by the die hard rose colored spectacle wearing ( vested interets ones )
ie
Ed Schroder
- Chris Whittington
- Alan Sassler
- Derrière Pensée
-sidserious
- Jeroen
- Nelson Hernandez
example of this ...
Jeroen has posted 500 mostly Rybka/ICGA-related messages in the last 20 days
OMG 500 posts in last 20 days !!! How many in same time frame as this hider of truths Søren Riis uses to fabricate deceit for rybka and chessbase as regards dr hyatts posts whilst the case dragged on for months on end Question
how many when the other sycophants
- Ed Schroder
- Chris Whittington
- Alan Sassler
- Derrière Pensée
-sidserious
- Nelson Hernandez
posts are included Question
pray tell us all.... IF you DARE Søren Riis Question Arrow
natasha wrote:
how many when the other sycophants
- Ed Schroder
- Chris Whittington
- Alan Sassler
- Derrière Pensée
-sidserious
- Nelson Hernandez
posts are included Question
pray tell us all.... IF you DARE Søren Riis Question Arrow
It is also interesting to note that Bob has started very few threads and just answered those started by others. Ed has started several threads about the same thing as have many others.
Steve B wrote:
after all..who wants to be a day to day posting member of a forum where the engine has fallen into disgrace?
..so they keep the issue alive ..day after day and now several months after the decision ..they send a non-engine programmer and moderator to go defend it on Playchess..(perhaps in anticipation of the Rybka 5 release)...
IMHO Regards
Steve
Your perception of the members keeping this alive without provocation is not accurate. Dr. Hyatt's never posted until the ICGA started its investigation, And since as made an astounding 4660 posts repetitively stating the ICGA's position. Think about! It takes on the average it 3 years to post that many comments.
sid
are you serious
how many posts did jeroen make in 20 days? 500 plus . now add up ALL he made in same time period as that you state Bob made 4660
read this without dragons breath mist covering your eyes
re: ChessBase finaly speaks of Rykba banning (using biased Rybka forum moderator)
Angels_77 just now
when desperately trying to use statistics to besmirch dr hyatts name this so called expert Søren Riis fails to disclose dr hyatts posts were in response to others posts by the die hard rose colored spectacle wearing ( vested interets ones )
ie
Ed Schroder
- Chris Whittington
- Alan Sassler
- Derrière Pensée
-sidserious
- Jeroen
- Nelson Hernandez
example of this ...
Jeroen has posted 500 mostly Rybka/ICGA-related messages in the last 20 days
OMG 500 posts in last 20 days !!! How many in same time frame as this hider of truths Søren Riis uses to fabricate deceit for rybka and chessbase as regards dr hyatts posts whilst the case dragged on for months on end Question
how many when the other sycophants
- Ed Schroder
- Chris Whittington
- Alan Sassler
- Derrière Pensée
-sidserious
- Nelson Hernandez
posts are included Question
pray tell us all.... IF you DARE Søren Riis Question Arrow
natasha wrote:there are still millions who preach fanatically that the world and species were created in 7 days , despite overwhelming lack of evidence and common sence
Are you familiar with programming, especially with chess programming? And just in case you aren't, do you think that it is up to non-programmers to judge how "overwhelming" such evidence really is?
natasha wrote:whilst rybka has such cretins as Bill Strong , chris dick whittington and more plus puppets like poor ed and the band wagon jumpers this will continue untill they are pushing up daisy's
Why those insults? Why not just stating your different opinion? Note, this is a thread started by someone who tried to come up with something substantially neutral (even if you don't believe it, as you wrote), so if there is any place where personal insults are most misplaced then I think it is here.
Sven
Please don't feed the troll(s). It will at max last a few days until IT
shoots itself in the brain and most CCC readers already know it
by now.
Just look at the hyperventilating number of posts and the increasing
hatred, arrogance and absurdness of IT...
Moderation seems to have a new pet, no?
