test position: Rookie-Arasan

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jdart
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test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by jdart » Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:25 am

from the blitz event today after CCT-16:

[D] 8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - -

bm Kf7. Re5 is wrong: many engines think it is a draw, at least at first, but it is not.

Stockfish 4 got the right idea here after about a minute on my quad.

--Jon

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beachknight
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Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by beachknight » Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:40 am

SF PA_GTB DD agrees:

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64 3cpu:

1...Re5 2.Rxe5 Kxe5 3.Ke3 Kf5 4.Kf3 Ke5 5.g4 h4 6.g5 Kf5 7.Kg2 Kxg5 8.Kh3 Kf5 9.Kxh4 g5+ 10.Kh3 Kf6 11.Kg4 Kg6 12.d6 Kf6 13.Kh5 Ke6 14.Kxg5 Kxd6 15.Kf6 Kd7 16.Kf7 Kd6 17.Ke8 Ke5 18.Kd8 Kd4 19.Kc7 Kc3 20.Kxb6 Kb4 21.Kc6 Kxb3 22.Kb5 Kc3 23.Kxc5 Kc2 24.Kb5 Kc3 25.Kxa5
+/- (0.73 --) Depth: 37/46 00:00:27 85318kN, tb=18
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Kf3 Rf6+ 5.Kg2 Rd6 6.Re2 Rf6 7.Re3 g5 8.Re5 Kg6 9.Re8 Kf5 10.Rh8 Kg4 11.Rg8 Rf7 12.Rg6 Rf8 13.Re6 Rf7 14.Rg6 Rf8 15.Re6 Rf7 16.Rg6
+/- (0.74) Depth: 38/63 00:01:33 297MN, tb=675
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 Rf6 5.g4 hxg4 6.Rxg4 Rf5 7.Rg3 Kf6 8.Re3 Re5 9.Rxe5 Kxe5 10.Kf2 g5 11.Kg3 Kf6 12.Kg4 Kg6 13.d6
+/- (0.82 --) Depth: 39/63 00:02:09 412MN, tb=1455
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Re7+ Kg6 9.Rc7 Kf5 10.Rh7 Kg6 11.Rh8 Rf7 12.Re8 Kf5 13.Kf3 h4 14.Rg8 hxg3 15.Kxg3 Rh7 16.Rf8+ Kg6 17.Rb8 Kf5 18.Rxb6 g4 19.Rb5 Rh3+ 20.Kf2 Kf4 21.Rb7 Rh2+ 22.Kf1 Rh1+ 23.Kg2 Rh3 24.Rf7+ Ke5 25.Rc7 Rxb3 26.Rxc5 Kf4 27.d6 Rb2+ 28.Kf1 Rb1+ 29.Ke2 g3 30.d7 g2 31.d8Q
+/= (0.56) Depth: 39/63 00:02:37 501MN, tb=1794
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6
+/= (0.64 --) Depth: 40/63 00:03:16 621MN, tb=2487
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Kd3 Rf1 9.Ke2 Rf7 10.Re5 Kg6 11.Re6+ Rf6 12.Rc6 Kf7 13.d6 Rf5 14.Rxb6 Ke6 15.Ra6 g4 16.Rxa5 Kxd6 17.Ra6+ Kd7 18.a5 Rf3 19.Rh6 Rxg3 20.a6 Rxb3 21.a7 Ra3 22.Rh8
+/- (0.71) Depth: 40/63 00:04:07 774MN, tb=4383
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Kd3 Rf2 9.Rb8 Rf6 10.Re8 Rf2 11.Rb8 Rf6 12.Re8
+/= (0.63 ++) Depth: 41/63 00:04:26 836MN, tb=4448
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Kd3 Rf1 9.Ke2 Rf6 10.Ke3 Rf1 11.Re7+ Kg6 12.Re6+ Kf5 13.Rxb6 Re1+ 14.Kf2 Rb1 15.Rb5 Rb2+ 16.Ke3 Ke5 17.Rb7 h4 18.Kf3 Kf5 19.gxh4 gxh4 20.Rf7+ Ke5 21.Re7+ Kf6 22.Rh7 Rxb3+ 23.Kf2
+/- (0.76) Depth: 41/63 00:07:47 1415MN, tb=32516
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Kd3 Rf1 9.Ke2 Rf6 10.Ke3 Rf1 11.Re7+ Kg6 12.Re6+ Kf5 13.Rxb6 Re1+ 14.Kf2 Rb1 15.Rb5 Rb2+ 16.Ke3 Ke5 17.Rb7 h4 18.Kf3 Kf5 19.gxh4 gxh4 20.Rf7+ Ke5 21.Re7+ Kf6 22.Rh7 Rxb3+
+/- (0.76) Depth: 42/63 00:08:07 1479MN, tb=32999
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)
hi, merhaba, hallo HT

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beachknight
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Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by beachknight » Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:43 am

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Kd3 Rf3+ 9.Ke2 Rf6 10.Ke3 Rf1 11.Re7+ Kg6 12.Re6+ Kf5 13.Rxb6 g4 14.Rh6 Rf3+ 15.Ke2 Rxb3 16.Rxh5+ Kf6 17.Rh6+ Ke5 18.Re6+ Kd4 19.d6 Rb2+ 20.Ke1 Rb7 21.Re7 Rb8 22.d7 Rd8 23.Rg7 Kxc4 24.Kd2 Kd5 25.Kd3 Kc6 26.Rxg4 Rxd7+ 27.Kc4
+/= (0.61 ++) Depth: 44/63 00:10:59 2020MN, tb=37857
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)
hi, merhaba, hallo HT

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beachknight
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Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by beachknight » Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:51 am

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Kd3 Rf1
+/= (0.62 ++) Depth: 46/70 00:19:16 3580MN, tb=61693
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Ke2 Kf7 9.Rh8 Kg6 10.Ke3 Rf7 11.Rb8 Re7+ 12.Kf3 Rf7+ 13.Kg2 Rf6 14.Rh8 Rf7 15.Re8 Rf6 16.Re5 Rd6 17.Re7 Kf5 18.Rf7+ Kg4 19.Rc7 Rf6 20.Rg7 Kf5 21.Kf3 Rf8 22.Re7 Rf6 23.Re8 g4+ 24.Ke3 Rh6 25.Rg8 Rh7 26.Rb8 h4 27.gxh4 Rxh4 28.Rxb6 Rh3+ 29.Ke2 Rh2+ 30.Ke3 Rh3+ 31.Ke2 Rh2+ 32.Ke3 Rh3+
+/= (0.61) Depth: 46/70 00:20:45 3865MN, tb=62954
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)
hi, merhaba, hallo HT

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beachknight
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Location: Antalya, Turkey
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Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by beachknight » Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:58 am

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Ke2 Kf7 9.Rh8 Kg6 10.Ke3 Rf7 11.Rb8 Re7+ 12.Kf3 Rf7+ 13.Kg2 Rf6 14.Rh8 Rf7 15.Re8 Rf6 16.Re5 Rd6 17.Re7 Kf5 18.Rh7 Kg4 19.Rc7 Rf6 20.Rg7 Kf5 21.Kf3 Rf8
+/= (0.61) Depth: 47/70 00:26:29 4920MN, tb=82305
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)
hi, merhaba, hallo HT

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beachknight
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Location: Antalya, Turkey
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Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by beachknight » Mon Jan 27, 2014 3:07 am

19: New game
8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish PA_GTB DD 64:

1...Kf7 2.Re6 Rf6 3.Re5 Rd6 4.Re4 g5 5.Ke3 Rf6 6.Re5 Kg6 7.Re8 Kg7 8.Ke2 Kf7 9.Rh8 Kg6 10.Ke3 Rf7 11.Rb8 Re7+ 12.Kf3 Rf7+ 13.Kg2 Rf6 14.Rh8 Rf7 15.Re8 Rf6 16.Re5 Rd6 17.Re7 Kf5 18.Rh7 Kg4 19.Rc7 Rf6 20.Rg7 Kf5 21.Kf3 Rf8 22.Re7 Rf6 23.Rg7 Rf8 24.Re7 Rf6 25.Rg7
+/= (0.61) Depth: 48/70 00:34:44 6485MN, tb=119271
(Chess Engines Testing, 27.01.2014)
hi, merhaba, hallo HT

Michel
Posts: 2040
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by Michel » Mon Jan 27, 2014 8:29 am

This is the key position after Re5. Mutual zugzwang!

[d]8/8/1p4p1/p1pP2k1/P1P4p/1P5K/8/8 b - - 0 1[/d]

zullil
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Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by zullil » Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:37 am

jdart wrote:from the blitz event today after CCT-16:

[D] 8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP1r1p/P1P5/1P2R1P1/4K3/8 b - -

bm Kf7. Re5 is wrong: many engines think it is a draw, at least at first, but it is not.

Stockfish 4 got the right idea here after about a minute on my quad.

--Jon
Latest Stockfish suggests that Kf7 draws:

Code: Select all

info depth 62 seldepth 91 score cp -12 nodes 537639176745 nps 25109854 time 21411481 multipv 1 pv f6f7 e3e6 f5f6 e6e5 f6d6 e5e4 g6g5 e2e3 d6f6 e4e5 f7g6 e5e8 g6g7 e3d3 f6f2 e8e6 f2f1 d3e2 f1f6 e6e8 g7f7 e8h8 f7g6 e2e3 f6f7 h8b8 f7e7 e3f3 e7f7 f3g2 f7f6 b8h8 f6f7 h8e8 g6f5 g2h3 f7f6 e8g8 f6h6 g8b8 h6d6 b8f8 f5g6 h3g2 d6f6 f8b8 g6f5

info depth 63 currmove f6f7 currmovenumber 1
info depth 63 currmove f5e5 currmovenumber 2
info depth 63 seldepth 91 score cp -12 nodes 658304168640 nps 25336583 time 25982357 multipv 1 pv f6f7 e3e6 f5f6 e6e5 f6d6 e5e4 g6g5 e2e3 d6f6 e4e5 f7g6 e5e8 g6g7 e3d3 f6f2 e8e6 f2f1 d3e2 f1f6 e6e8 g7f7 e8h8 f7g6 e2e3 f6f7 h8b8 f7e7 e3f3 e7f7 f3g2 f7f6 b8h8 f6f7 h8e8 g6f5 g2h3 f7f6 e8g8 f6h6 g8b8 h6d6 b8f8 f5g6 h3g2

info depth 64 currmove f6f7 currmovenumber 1
info depth 64 currmove f5e5 currmovenumber 2
info depth 64 seldepth 91 score cp -12 nodes 697200610476 nps 25346381 time 27506909 multipv 1 pv f6f7 e3e6 f5f6 e6e5 f6d6 e5e4 g6g5 e2e3 d6f6 e4e5 f7g6 e5e8 g6g7 e3d3 f6f2 e8e6 f2f1 d3e2 f1f6 e6e8 g7f7 e8h8 f7g6 e2e3 f6f7 h8b8 f7e7 e3f3 e7f7 f3g2 f7f6 b8h8 f6f7 h8e8 g6f5

Michel
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Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by Michel » Mon Jan 27, 2014 11:06 am

Yes it's probably a draw after Rf7. White can still force the rook exchange with Re6 Rf6 Rxf6 Kxf6 but now black can take the opposition in the pawn endgame.

[d]8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP3p/P1P5/1P4P1/4K3/8 w - - 0 4[/d]

If Kf2 then g5!

So white can no longer reach the key zugzwang position below necessary to win.

[d]8/8/1p4p1/p1pP2k1/P1P4p/1P5K/8/8 b - - 0 1[/d]

Vinvin
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Full name: Vincent Lejeune

Re: test position: Rookie-Arasan

Post by Vinvin » Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:23 pm

Michel wrote:Yes it's probably a draw after Rf7. White can still force the rook exchange with Re6 Rf6 Rxf6 Kxf6 but now black can take the opposition in the pawn endgame.

8/8/1p3kp1/p1pP3p/P1P5/1P4P1/4K3/8 w - - 0 4[/d]

If Kf2 then g5!

So white can no longer reach the key zugzwang position below necessary to win.
8/8/1p4p1/p1pP2k1/P1P4p/1P5K/8/8 b - - 0 1[/d]
Nice winning sequence with white to play :-)
When black king go the the 4th lines, it gets out the square of the pawn but force the win.
[pgn]
[Event "variation"]
[Site "-"]
[Date "2014.01.27"]
[Round "?"]
[White "W"]
[Black "B"]
[Result "*"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "8/8/1p4p1/p1pP2k1/P1P4p/1P5K/8/8 w - - 0 1"]

1. Kg2 Kf5 2. Kh2 Ke5 3. Kh3 g5 4. Kg4 Kf6 5. Kf3 Kf5 6. Kf2 g4 7. Kf1 h3
8. Kf2 h2 9. Kg2 g3 10. Kh1 Kf4 11. Kg2 Ke3 12. d6 h1=Q+ 13. Kxh1 Kf2 14.
d7 g2+ 15. Kh2 g1=Q+ *
[/pgn]

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