World Chess Computer Champion?

[sicilianquake87]

I personally feel the results from Martin’s excellent TCEC tournament are more meaningful than the very time limited WCCC. It would simply be too expensive to organize and run an in-person tournament that lasts months. TCEC lets more programs compete and for a much larger number of games to get closer to an accurate winner.

Mark

Leagues last months. World Championships and Olympic games etc tend to last a couple of weeks.

Because there is a selection before (nationals et similia).

[Gerd Isenberg]

I am not sure how this has evolved. That at chess program can self proclaim itself with World Championship Status.

http://komodochess.com/

From the Komodo site.

"2013 World Chess Engine Champion!"

What is strange about the Komodo claim and as far as I know. TCEC has never claimed itself with any kind of World Computer Chess Champion Status.

We have a WCCC history and a 2013 World Computer Champion and it is not Komodo.

http://icga.uvt.nl/wp-uploads/conferenc ... 202013.pdf

From ICGA
Final
standing 2013:

1. and World Champion Software Hiarcs.

Under Komodo's logic of claiming World Championship Status. Houdini 4 could also claim itself to be the World Computer Chess Engine Champion, because like TCEC. CCRL also is a rating list and performs tournaments to rate chess programs. And Right now Houdini 4 is the best chess engine on the CCRL list. And CCRL plays more programs and plays far more games then TCEC.

I would ask that people visit the web site and read what is there. Some comments:

The title of this thread is misleading. We make no claim that Komodo has won the World Computer Chess Championship. And that is not on our website. The title talks about chess engines, not the WCCC.

The title on the web site is immediately followed with an explanation as to what the title means:

“2013 World Chess Engine Champion!
Don, we won! We won! Komodo outright won the TCEC tournament ahead of the world's strongest programs, including: Houdini, Stockfish and Rybka.”

Leaving out the second part is misleading. It clearly explains the title and what Komodo accomplished.

I personally feel the results from Martin’s excellent TCEC tournament are more meaningful than the very time limited WCCC. It would simply be too expensive to organize and run an in-person tournament that lasts months. TCEC lets more programs compete and for a much larger number of games to get closer to an accurate winner.

However, to prevent any confusion, we will adjust the title to reflect TCEC. We also need to post results of CCT which Komodo also won.

Mark

Thanks, Mark.

And don't forget CCT15!

Gerd

[michiguel]

For the record, he tried, and obviously, Martin did not allow it.

So the actual Heron 'author' was rather stupid about it, and found out befre it began. Now suppose he would be slightly more clever, and submit Twinfish? Suppose he was already a known author, of a much weaker engine. Suppose he even was a real programmer rather than someone that knew how to operate a hex editor, and actually made some improvement to it...

What is so special now about TCEC that would make that this could never happen?

Nothing, it is always possible that some cheater will try something. I just pointed a fact about a specific case.

Miguel

[michiguel]

For the record, he tried, and obviously, Martin did not allow it.

So the actual Heron 'author' was rather stupid about it, and found out befre it began. Now suppose he would be slightly more clever, and submit Twinfish? Suppose he was already a known author, of a much weaker engine. Suppose he even was a real programmer rather than someone that knew how to operate a hex editor, and actually made some improvement to it...

What is so special now about TCEC that would make that this could never happen?

Whatever it is, ICGA is failing to attract players. A while ago, it started to fail to attract quantity, now it is quality.

But did it occur to you that this failure to attract participants is exactly because it is a World Championship?

It was not a problem in the past, so clearly things changed. Whatever the cause was, if ICGA was not the culprit, at least it failed to react and do something about it.

Miguel

Somewhat over a year ago Peter Skinner tried to organize an 'On-Line Computer-Chess World Championship', with rules that were assumed to repair what was wrong with the ICGA rules. (More games to eliminate the influence of luck, more lenient policy towards derivatives, no expensive travel.) There was exactly one entrant...

Some think that their commercial interests are better served by not participating and then denying that the event had any validity, because of their absence, rather than run the risk to be defeated.

[sicilianquake87]

It was not a problem in the past, so clearly things changed. Whatever the cause was, if ICGA was not the culprit, at least it failed to react and do something about it.

It created a precedent and anybody judges or takes decision considering this.

[Harvey Williamson]

I personally feel the results from Martin’s excellent TCEC tournament are more meaningful than the very time limited WCCC. It would simply be too expensive to organize and run an in-person tournament that lasts months. TCEC lets more programs compete and for a much larger number of games to get closer to an accurate winner.

Mark

Leagues last months. World Championships and Olympic games etc tend to last a couple of weeks.

Because there is a selection before (nationals et similia).

Yes those of us that enter the WC do not have to go through that process. It would be great to see Komodo at the next WC.

[hgm]

Are you so willing to put your money and your time on the line to go in some distant place around the world, inside a venue, playing chess using an engine that is most likely going to be disqualified after months/years of work

I was there. I went to Pamplone. I flew half-way around the World to Kanazawa and to Yokohama to be there. I was never disqualified. Almost no one was ever disqualified. Why are you considering this 'most likely'? Only cheaters would be disqualified. Do you have a history of cheating?

[sicilianquake87]

Are you so willing to put your money and your time on the line to go in some distant place around the world, inside a venue, playing chess using an engine that is most likely going to be disqualified after months/years of work

I was there. I went to Pamplone. I flew half-way around the World to Kanazawa and to Yokohama to be there. I was never disqualified. Almost no one was ever disqualified. Why are you considering this 'most likely'? Only cheaters would be disqualified. Do you have a history of cheating?

Why it should be about me? I can't even make a "hello world"!
It is about all the people whose code is controversial. Would you bet your money that they will survive through a ICGA inspection or a compliant? If yes, I admit I admire your optimism.

[Gerd Isenberg]

However, to prevent any confusion, we will adjust the title to reflect TCEC. We also need to post results of CCT which Komodo also won.

Mark

Thanks, Mark.

And don't forget CCT15!

Gerd

Still World Champion? I see, I misunderstood your adjustment.

2013 TCEC World Chess Engine Champion!
2013 World Computer Chess Engine Champion!
and #1 Rating with broken link, where the current link shows #3.

It's not OK for my taste, but its your business. Good luck.

[mjlef]

However, to prevent any confusion, we will adjust the title to reflect TCEC. We also need to post results of CCT which Komodo also won.

Mark

Thanks, Mark.

And don't forget CCT15!

Gerd

Still World Champion? I see, I misunderstood your adjustment.

2013 TCEC World Chess Engine Champion!
2013 World Computer Chess Engine Champion!
and #1 Rating with broken link, where the current link shows #3.

It's not OK for my taste, but its your business. Good luck.

How would you word it? It was a global championship which Komodo won. But 2013 TCEC Global Chess Engine Champion seems more confusing than accurate.