"64 Bits ONLY...."

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bob
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by bob » Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:26 am

fern wrote:Bob:
I drive a 1999 car because it runs very well, so I cannot imagine a reason to expend money to get a new one. You are of my age, you should understand me...

Fern
I do. I drive a 10 year old Ford Ranger pickup that looks new, runs like new, and doesn't have a car payment attached. :)

However, I don't know if I could find a 32 bit PC if I looked. I MIGHT have an old Sony Vaio around, but everything else I use here or at the office is 64 bits.

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fern
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by fern » Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:46 am

Perhaps we could generalize. Older people does not have interest in getting new things as far old ones works. We already know very well how much of an illusion is the thrill of novelties. So the scenery which surrounds older people looks like, sometimes, the stage of an old movie. I have sometimes surprised myself talking as Humphrey Bogart...

Fern

mjlef
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by mjlef » Wed Oct 01, 2014 3:03 am

We think it is important to support old technology, which is why I am proud to announce the release of "Komodo Chess 8 for Abacus". Merely follow the 3643 page instruction manual on your abacus to calculate each move. And no other chess program is a great physical workout for your fingers, hands and arms!

j/l. But we do continue to include 32 bit Windows compiles for people with older hardware, even though Komodo takes a bigger hit on going to 32 bit from 64 than most programs.

ernest
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by ernest » Wed Oct 01, 2014 3:55 am

mjlef wrote:Komodo takes a bigger hit on going to 32 bit from 64 than most programs.
Yes, but why??? :o

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fern
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by fern » Wed Oct 01, 2014 3:19 pm

For Abacus?
That's too much modern.
Prepare one for a sheet of paper and a pencil...

From the madmen asylum regards
Fern

daws
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by daws » Wed Oct 01, 2014 5:50 pm

fern wrote:For Abacus?
That's too much modern.
Prepare one for a sheet of paper and a pencil...
Fern
This must be what you're looking for.
Alan Turing used chess-playing as an example of what a computer could do. Along with David Champernowne he specified a chess playing algorithm, implemented as "paper machine" dubbed Turochamp. Since there was no machine yet that could execute the instructions, he did himself, acting as a human CPU requiring more than half an hour per move. One game is recorded, which Turing's "paper machine" lost to one of his colleagues [11], Alick Glennie. At the University of Manchester, Turing began programming Turochamp, as well as Michie's and Wylie's program Machiavelli, to run on a Ferranti Mark 1 computer, but could not complete them.
https://chessprogramming.wikispaces.com/Alan+Turing

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fern
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by fern » Wed Oct 01, 2014 10:20 pm

Precisely...but the paper and the pencil must not to be expensive...


Fern

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Eelco de Groot
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by Eelco de Groot » Wed Oct 01, 2014 11:21 pm

A ten year old car, that is nothing. Yesterday I wore a pair of Adidas running shoes that were made around 1983, probably bought 1984. They are still as good as new, only the netted shock absorbers are a bit discoloured. Okay, I'm not much of a runner... My feet have grown a bit since so I have to curl up my toes a bit. But for walking they are fine. I bought new running shoes and suddenly I need a size 10, but my Adidas are just size 8 :shock: A sure sign of aging I think, buying sports equipment and finding your feet have grown. Soon your nose and ears follow...

Image
The 2012 remake of my running shoes. Mine look almost as new as these, 30 years later. If only they would still fit...

I also still have the same CD player from that year. A Philips CD 104 first shown on the Firato wich I visited with a couple of HiFi enthusiasts from Eringa that had hired a touring car just to go see CD playing equipment. Nice solid build, all metal chassis and everything. Weighs about 7 kilos so it also stabilizes the record player on the shelf on top.

Image
Straight from the Firato in Amsterdam. Modified cable by Eringa, which sadly does not exist anymore

It is only 14 bits though... Sony had a 16 bits model and that became the standard, so the Philips engineers had to think of something to also reach sixteen bits. Pure marketing issue and in the end their solution probably hurt more than it gained. They went to oversampling their 14 bits to 16 bits. Now some people still modify their old CD players to undo the oversampling.

Maybe Fernando could oversample his old computers, to look like a true 64 bit. Or we could start selling oversampled 128 bit computers, or some kit with DIY soldering schematics. If it does not work there is also an abacus version included in the manual, with a chess program, word processor, spread sheet.

Dinosaur, Eelco
Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan

mjlef
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by mjlef » Thu Oct 02, 2014 2:32 am

ernest wrote:
mjlef wrote:Komodo takes a bigger hit on going to 32 bit from 64 than most programs.
Yes, but why??? :o
Because of its positional nature, using lots of 64 bit values where the bit have to be counted (called popcounts). Most 64 bit processors have fast hardware instructions to do the popcounts, where 32 bit processors do not. We recently found a faster way to do the popcounts in 32 bits, and put that in the Play Store Android version of the Komodo 8 Engine (which is currently 32 bit). Seems to have sped up the 32 bit version about 10% with some user reporting a 20% speed gain. We will try to roll out these changes to other versions in the future.

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fern
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Re: "64 Bits ONLY...."

Post by fern » Thu Oct 02, 2014 4:07 pm

Well, now that you mention it, my main sound equipment is a technic, recipe 1980, and the speakers are Saba from 1970. Everything works OK... Same with the Cd plasyer, one of the first.

I cannot see a reason to throw a gear that still works and I do not see any superiority in the new things.

Fern

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