Why was Lyudmil banned?

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zullil
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Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by zullil » Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:11 am

I was contacted recently by Lyudmil Tsvetkov, who told me he has been banned from TalkChess. He asked me to post here and ask why he was banned, since he cannot do so himself.

I haven't been here much of late, and am unfamiliar with what might have occurred. So, in particular, I am in no position to question the judgments of the moderators, and this post should not be construed as an attempt to do so.

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hgm
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by hgm » Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:52 am

It seems he did not agree with Harvey's decision to lock the "secret of TakChess" thread, which had degraded to a "Lyudmil ranting against the rest of the World" thread, and could not refrain from starting new threads attacking the moderator team without a little help.

I suppose no one knows better what he has done than Lyudmil himself, so it should be pretty self-evident why he was banned even if Harvey did not explicitly notify him. Even during his ban he can still send private messages, and can approach us directly for seeking clarification. Don't let Lyudmil manipulate you into waging his wars for him...
Last edited by hgm on Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:24 am, edited 2 times in total.

whereagles
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by whereagles » Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:56 am

Is the ban permanent? Seems a bit odd to ban him and subsequently unlock the "Secret of chess 2" thread.

I think people here are sometimes overly aggressive towards him and his concepts. In general out-of-the-box ideas are useful in science, but I do agree he lets himself get carried away when things slide out of rail.

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hgm
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by hgm » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:06 am

The moving of the "secret of chess 2" to a hidden place was not meant to be permanent, (announced as "for the time being..."), but just until I had time to cleanse it. Yesterday I was out of town, but today I had the time.

Lyudmil's ban is not supposed to be permanent, just to allow him to cool down. A period of 1 week was proposed. Of course repeating the misbehavior after his return would simply lead to a new, and probably longer ban, so I am not sure that we would do Lyudmil a service by allowing him to return earlier, and possibly too early.

Cardoso
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by Cardoso » Mon Apr 02, 2018 12:49 pm

It seems you are not aware of all of his agressive behaviour.
The problem is not his out-of-the-box ideas. The problem is when someone disagrees of his ideas. If you do that he starts being "Lyudmil".

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Nordlandia
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by Nordlandia » Mon Apr 02, 2018 12:58 pm

Alvaro: disagreement is fairly common on the internet. Like "Hierarchy of Disagreements"

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Laskos
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by Laskos » Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:11 pm

Cardoso wrote:It seems you are not aware of all of his agressive behaviour.
The problem is not his out-of-the-box ideas. The problem is when someone disagrees of his ideas. If you do that he starts being "Lyudmil".
There are many problems.

As much as we can be dissatisfied with Pablo Ignacio Restrepo posts (Grand-father), this game from Engine Room is for real:

Cfish 110318 64 BMI2 NUMA (40 threads): 24.9 plies; 33.174kN/s Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2640 v4 @ 2.40GHz 2394MHz, (20 cores, 40 threads)

[pgn][Event "Rated game, 5 min"]
[Site "Engine Room"]
[Date "2018.03.15"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Grand-father"]
[Black "Calabrese1947"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "D00"]
[WhiteElo "2016"]
[BlackElo "2564"]
[PlyCount "271"]
[EventDate "2018.03.15"]
[SourceTitle "playchess.com"]
[TimeControl "300"]

1. d4 {8} d5 {B 0} 2. e3 {1} e6 {B 0} 3. c3 {1} Nf6 {B 0} 4. f4 {0} Nc6 {B 0}
5. Nf3 {0} Bd6 {B 0} 6. Bd3 {1} O-O {B 0} 7. O-O {0} Ne7 {B 0} 8. Re1 {35} c5 {
-0.61/25 14} 9. g3 {20 (b3)} c4 {-0.67/23 5} 10. Bc2 {5} b5 {-0.64/24 0} 11. a3
{1 (Nbd2)} a5 {4} 12. Qe2 {-0.96/26 0 (Nbd2)} Bb7 {-0.95/29 12} 13. Kg2 {
1 (Nbd2)} Nf5 {-1.19/21 4} 14. Nbd2 {4} Ng4 {-1.07/23 1} 15. Nb1 {3 (Nf1)} Be7
{-1.40/23 6} 16. Kg1 {1 (b3)} Nd6 {-1.52/27 11} 17. Kg2 {1 (Bd2)} Nf6 {-1.63/
23 5} 18. Ne5 {1 (Rf1)} a4 {-1.61/26 7} 19. Nf3 {2 (Nd2)} Nfe4 {-1.67/26 8} 20.
Rg1 {1 (Rf1)} Qe8 {-1.61/27 20} 21. Nbd2 {2 (Rf1)} g6 {-1.71/26 4} 22. Nf1 {
1 (Rf1)} h5 {-1.55/28 31} 23. h4 {3 (Bd2)} Nf5 {-2.06/19 4} 24. Kh1 {4 (Ng5)}
Rd8 {-1.77/25 16} 25. Rg2 {1 (Ng5)} Kg7 {-1.82/23 12} 26. Kg1 {2 (Bd2)} Nh6 {
-1.79/24 9} 27. N3d2 {3 (Bd2)} f6 {-2.10/23 6} 28. Nxe4 {2 (Nh2)} dxe4 {8} 29.
Nd2 {-2.66/26 0} f5 {-2.27/26 4} 30. Nf1 {3} Kf7 {-2.07/34 3} 31. Bd2 {1} Qc6 {
-2.07/34 0} 32. Be1 {1} Rh8 {-2.07/35 1} 33. Ra2 {1 (Bf2)} Bf8 {-2.07/34 3} 34.
Ra1 {1 (Kh1)} Ng4 {-2.07/37 2} 35. Nh2 {3 (Kh1)} Nf6 {-2.07/37 2} 36. Nf1 {1}
Ng4 {-2.07/37 1} 37. Nh2 {2 (Kh1)} Nf6 {-2.07/40 2} 38. Nf1 {1 (Kh1)} Bg7 {
-2.07/39 2} 39. Ra2 {1 (Kh1)} Ng4 {-2.07/34 3} 40. Nh2 {2} Nf6 {-2.07/39 0} 41.
Nf1 {1} Kg8 {-2.07/33 1} 42. Ra1 {1} Qc7 {-2.07/37 0} 43. Ra2 {1 (Bf2)} Ng4 {
-2.07/36 2} 44. Nh2 {2 (Ra1)} Nh6 {-2.07/37 3} 45. Nf1 {1 (Kh1)} Kh7 {-2.07/36
1} 46. Ra1 {1 (Bf2)} Ng4 {-2.07/38 3} 47. Nh2 {2} Nh6 {-2.07/39 0} 48. Nf1 {
1 (Rd1)} Kg8 {-2.07/36 2} 49. Ra2 {1 (Nh2)} Rh7 {-2.07/37 2} 50. Ra1 {1 (Bf2)}
Bc6 {-2.07/37 1} 51. Ra2 {1 (Kh1)} Qb6 {-2.07/34 1} 52. Ra1 {1 (Nh2)} Ng4 {
-2.07/35 1} 53. Nh2 {2} Nh6 {-2.07/38 0} 54. Kh1 {1 (Rd1)} Qb7 {-2.07/36 2} 55.
Nf1 {0 (Kg1)} Bf6 {-2.07/35 1} 56. Kg1 {2 (Bf2)} Qc7 {-2.07/33 1} 57. Ra2 {
1 (Rd1)} Rhd7 {-2.07/35 1} 58. Ra1 {1 (Bf2)} Bg7 {-2.07/35 1} 59. Ra2 {1 (Nh2)}
Kf7 {-2.07/31 2} 60. Ra1 {1} Kg8 {-2.07/36 0} 61. Ra2 {1 (Nh2)} Nf7 {-2.07/30 1
} 62. Ra1 {1 (Kh1)} Re7 {-2.07/32 1} 63. Ra2 {1 (Kh1)} Bd5 {-2.07/31 1} 64. Ra1
{1 (Bf2)} Nh6 {-2.07/34 1} 65. Ra2 {1 (Nh2)} Ng4 {-2.07/31 10} 66. Nh2 {2 (Ra1)
} Nf6 {-2.07/28 1} 67. Nf1 {1 (Ra1)} Ree8 {-2.07/22 3} 68. Ra1 {1} Kf7 {
-2.07/24 0} 69. Ra2 {1 (Kh1)} Rf8 {-1.99/22 6} 70. Ra1 {2} Kg8 {-1.84/22 1} 71.
Ra2 {1 (Kh1)} Rf7 {-1.92/19 4} 72. Nh2 {1 (Ra1)} Rfd7 {-1.74/18 1} 73. Ra1 {
2 (Nf1)} Ng4 {-1.45/18 2} 74. Nf1 {3 (Kh1)} Kf7 {-0.90/20 3} 75. Nh2 {1 (Kh1)}
Re7 {-1.32/22 0} 76. Nf1 {1 (Bb1)} Kg8 {-0.62/23 1} 77. Nh2 {1 (Kh1)} Nxh2 {
-1.32/31 0} 78. Rxh2 {2} Bf6 {-1.32/38 0} 79. Bf2 {3 (Rc1)} Rh7 {-1.33/35 1}
80. Be1 {0} Qd6 {-1.33/38 0} 81. Bd2 {1 (Rd1)} Ra7 {-1.33/28 0} 82. Bc1 {
1 (Be1)} Bc6 {-1.33/29 1} 83. Bd2 {0} Kg7 {-1.33/31 0} 84. Rh3 {1 (Rd1)} e5 {
-1.59/16 0} 85. Rf1 {33 (Rh2)} exd4 {-1.35/22 0} 86. exd4 {2 (cxd4)} Bd5 {
-1.57/23 0} 87. Be3 {1} Kf8 {-1.60/35 0} 88. Qe1 {1 (Rh1)} Kg8 {-1.60/28 0} 89.
Rf2 {1 (Qe2)} Qc7 {-1.60/26 0} 90. Rhh2 {1 (Rf1)} Rd6 {-1.60/24 0} 91. Rf1 {1}
Qe7 {-1.60/39 0} 92. Bb1 {3 (Qe2)} Rad7 {-1.60/26 0} 93. Bc2 {0} Qe6 {-1.60/38
0} 94. Rh3 {2 (Qe2)} Rh7 {-1.60/24 0} 95. Kh2 {1 (Qe2)} Qf7 {-1.60/25 0} 96.
Kg1 {1 (Kg2)} Rb6 {-1.60/20 0} 97. Kh2 {1 (Qe2)} Qe6 {-1.60/24 0} 98. Kg1 {1}
Qd7 {-1.60/39 0} 99. Kh2 {1 (Qe2)} Qc6 {-1.60/22 0} 100. Kg2 {0} Qc7 {-1.60/40
0} 101. Qf2 {2 (Qe2)} Rd7 {-1.60/22 0} 102. Kg1 {0 (Rhh1)} Rd8 {-1.60/18 0}
103. Qe1 {1 (Rh2)} Rbd6 {-1.60/23 0} 104. Rf2 {1 (Rh2)} Bg7 {-1.60/22 0} 105.
Rd2 {0 (Qe2)} Rc6 {-1.60/22 0} 106. Rd1 {0 (Rhh2)} Rcd6 {-1.60/22 0} 107. Qf2 {
0 (Rh2)} Qc6 {-1.60/23 0} 108. Qe1 {0 (Rf1)} Bf6 {-1.60/23 0} 109. Ra1 {1 (Qe2)
} Qc7 {-1.60/23 0} 110. Qf2 {1 (Rh2)} Qd7 {-1.60/21 0} 111. Ra2 {1 (Re1)} Bg7 {
-1.60/21 0} 112. Kh2 {0 (Ra1)} Rf8 {-1.60/20 0} 113. Ra1 {0} Bf6 {-1.60/38 0}
114. Ra2 {1 (Kg1)} Rf7 {-1.60/22 0} 115. Ra1 {1} Qc7 {-1.60/37 0} 116. Ra2 {
2 (Kg1)} Rh7 {-1.60/21 0} 117. Ra1 {1 (Kg2)} Qb6 {-1.60/21 0} 118. Ra2 {1 (Kg1)
} Rd8 {-1.60/22 0} 119. Ra1 {0 (Kg1)} Rhd7 {-1.60/23 0} 120. Rd1 {0 (Kg1)} Rf8
{-1.60/19 0} 121. Qe2 {0 (Kg2)} Qa5 {-1.60/18 0} 122. Qf2 {1 (Kg2)} Qc7 {
-1.60/22 0} 123. Qe2 {1 (Kg2)} Rd6 {-1.60/21 0} 124. Qe1 {0 (Kg2)} Bg7 {
-1.60/18 0} 125. Kg1 {0 (Kg2)} Rd7 {-1.60/19 0} 126. Qe2 {0 (Rh2)} Qc6 {
-1.60/19 0} 127. Qe1 {1 (Re1)} Rb8 {-1.60/17 0} 128. Qe2 {1 (Rh2)} Rb6 {
-1.60/15 0} 129. Qe1 {1 (Re1)} Qd6 {-1.60/13 0} 130. Ra1 {0 (Qe2)} Qe6 {
-1.60/10 0} 131. Qf2 {0} Rbd6 {-0.06/21 0} 132. Rh2 {0} Rb7 {0.00/41 0} 133.
Rh3 {0 (Ra2)} Rd8 {0.00/22 0} 134. Rh2 {0} Qf7 {0.00/44 0} 135. Rh3 {0 (Ra2)}
Rdb8 {0.00/31 0} 136. Rh2 {0 (Lag: Bv=1.18s, max=1.8s) (Rf1)} 1/2-1/2
[/pgn]

Yes, no increment, and just set the engine at Contempt 300cp, and the outcome would probably be diferent. But it is no farce and no fraud, a draw is a draw, in regular conditions, a thing even top players hardly achieve.

On the other hand Tsvetkov (I will never buy any of his books), from his posts, and especially from his "games" posted here against top engines, is something different. He generally seems to have some issues, which are better solved with specialized personnel, not with Talkchess mods, who give him anyway too much of attention.

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hgm
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by hgm » Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:43 pm

The task and goal of the TalkChess mods is not so much to solve any issues, but to protect the forum from too much expression of these issues. The ban is one of the tools that help achieving that.

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Harvey Williamson
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by Harvey Williamson » Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:30 pm

zullil wrote:I was contacted recently by Lyudmil Tsvetkov, who told me he has been banned from TalkChess. He asked me to post here and ask why he was banned, since he cannot do so himself.
He knows exactly why he was banned as he was notified by email. I have had emails from other people he has made the same claim to. The ban is for 7 days so he will be back next Sunday.

Cardoso
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Re: Why was Lyudmil banned?

Post by Cardoso » Mon Apr 02, 2018 5:15 pm

hgm wrote:The task and goal of the TalkChess mods is not so much to solve any issues, but to protect the forum from too much expression of these issues. The ban is one of the tools that help achieving that.

And I think moderation is being quite reasonable on the 7 days ban.
I'm not sure there would be too many forums where the mods would have been so patient with Lyudmil.
I need peace and quite and I'm here to learn and I think most of the members are here to discuss ideas in a civilized manner. There is already too much conflict in this world. And we would be much better off without it.
Lately I've seen some slight bickering on other posts (apart from Lyudmil's). Perhaps if we make an effort to read more than once the post we intent to reply to and ponder for a while what we want to say would help to keep peace. If we rush a reply we risk being replied: "please read carefully what I wrote".

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