The stats I've seen suggest "only" +15%
But I was amazed Lc0 drew with Houdini 6 on 8 cores in a mini-match I ran yesterday on my 1060 card. It's an interesting time for computer chess...
Moderators: hgm, Rebel, chrisw
The stats I've seen suggest "only" +15%
Here's the rule:George Tsavdaris wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:17 amNo. Tweaks to the engines are not allowed.whereagles wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:10 am think it's in the rules that tweaks can be made within season if a play-affecting issue is found.
Tweaks to the hardware for engines are. E.g lowering cores.
Sorry but this childish fanboy behaviour of yours, patronising and telling ppl what to do is not gonna work.Laskos wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:46 am Again spitting gibberish with some 5% here and there, while missing the general picture? Nvidia 11 series is just 2-3 months from now, and as we know, they will come with some massive improvements. And by the way, my OC i7 4790 is at least on par with say stock i7 7700. All in all, you nitpick (with misplaced wording) on the general picture that on fairly balanced CPU/GPU home hardware, Lc0 with a good net is on par with SF8 on 1-2 threads in blitz. And probably soon will be on par with SF8 on full CPU, and one could casually say "Lc0 is SF8 level". Generally, behave, and don't use misplaced language.
That rule talks about "engine bugs", which clearly wasn't the case here. It was a server issue, not an engine(s) issue. I think it's sad that Arasan will promote only because it was given a free point when Nemorino was about to beat it and crashed + was helped by the server issue that affected both Leela and lc0. The whole purpose of the tournament is that stronger engines should play the highest leagues. Here, clearly, lc0 and Ethereal were the strongest engines, by far, yet, because the server was misconfigured/poorly cooled/whatever, an engine will not advance. There wasn't anything the devs could do.kranium wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:58 pmHere's the rule:George Tsavdaris wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:17 amNo. Tweaks to the engines are not allowed.whereagles wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:10 am think it's in the rules that tweaks can be made within season if a play-affecting issue is found.
Tweaks to the hardware for engines are. E.g lowering cores.
"Critical Engine Bugs
In the case of a serious, play-limiting bug (like crashing or interface communication problems, not including losses on time) not discovered during the pre-Season testing, the engine can be updated once per Division to fix this/these bug/bugs only. If this update still doesn't fix the problem(s) or if there is no update available, the engine might have the number of cores reduced, have the hash size reduced or have the tablebase access disabled - these changes will remain for the rest of the Division."
The key words are: "play-limiting" (crashing or interface communication problems)
Clearly this was not the case for Lc0 and DeusX...
PS George-
lowering cores means changing the engine config, reducing ('tweaking') the UCI parameter for that particular engine, not for the entire system
Oh cry me a river. So much whining. Like kids. Ppl really get this too personally.CMCanavessi wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:37 pm That rule talks about "engine bugs", which clearly wasn't the case here. It was a server issue, not an engine(s) issue. I think it's sad that Arasan will promote only because it was given a free point when Nemorino was about to beat it and crashed + was helped by the server issue that affected both Leela and lc0. The whole purpose of the tournament is that stronger engines should play the highest leagues. Here, clearly, lc0 and Ethereal were the strongest engines, by far, yet, because the server was misconfigured/poorly cooled/whatever, an engine will not advance. There wasn't anything the devs could do.
Where did I say that lc0 should advance instead of Arasan? Learn to read.Milos wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:01 pmOh cry me a river. So much whining. Like kids. Ppl really get this too personally.CMCanavessi wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:37 pm That rule talks about "engine bugs", which clearly wasn't the case here. It was a server issue, not an engine(s) issue. I think it's sad that Arasan will promote only because it was given a free point when Nemorino was about to beat it and crashed + was helped by the server issue that affected both Leela and lc0. The whole purpose of the tournament is that stronger engines should play the highest leagues. Here, clearly, lc0 and Ethereal were the strongest engines, by far, yet, because the server was misconfigured/poorly cooled/whatever, an engine will not advance. There wasn't anything the devs could do.
You didn't even say a word when Ivanhoe was playing with a wrong binary (sent by competitor with agenda against Ivanhoe) that was never ever tested by TCEC, even though TCEC in the past already had a properly working binry. With working Ivanhoe Lc0 would anyway never promote to Div2 since it is most certainly weaker than Ivanhoe on 43 cores in TCEC conditions (that is of a strength of Gull).
So go cry somewhere else please. This is just ridiculous.
You said "it is sad that Arasan will promote" as something unfair and you also said that "lc0 and Ethereal were the strongest engines, by far", both of the claims frankly total bullshit (Ethereal is clearly the strongest but Lc0 certainly not). And then you are asking where did you say Lc0 should advance instead of Arasan??? I know English is not your first language, but seems you are really lacking some basic comprehension at least functional one.CMCanavessi wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:10 pmWhere did I say that lc0 should advance instead of Arasan? Learn to read.Milos wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:01 pmOh cry me a river. So much whining. Like kids. Ppl really get this too personally.CMCanavessi wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:37 pm That rule talks about "engine bugs", which clearly wasn't the case here. It was a server issue, not an engine(s) issue. I think it's sad that Arasan will promote only because it was given a free point when Nemorino was about to beat it and crashed + was helped by the server issue that affected both Leela and lc0. The whole purpose of the tournament is that stronger engines should play the highest leagues. Here, clearly, lc0 and Ethereal were the strongest engines, by far, yet, because the server was misconfigured/poorly cooled/whatever, an engine will not advance. There wasn't anything the devs could do.
You didn't even say a word when Ivanhoe was playing with a wrong binary (sent by competitor with agenda against Ivanhoe) that was never ever tested by TCEC, even though TCEC in the past already had a properly working binry. With working Ivanhoe Lc0 would anyway never promote to Div2 since it is most certainly weaker than Ivanhoe on 43 cores in TCEC conditions (that is of a strength of Gull).
So go cry somewhere else please. This is just ridiculous.
And also, even if you put ASMFish in div4, leela still promotes, because top 2 do so. Learn the rules.
Lol you really think that IvanHoe on 43 cores stronger than Lc0?Milos wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:24 pmYou said "it is sad that Arasan will promote" as something unfair and you also said that "lc0 and Ethereal were the strongest engines, by far", both of the claims frankly total bullshit (Ethereal is clearly the strongest but Lc0 certainly not). And then you are asking where did you say Lc0 should advance instead of Arasan??? I know English is not your first language, but seems you are really lacking some basic comprehension at least functional one.CMCanavessi wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:10 pmWhere did I say that lc0 should advance instead of Arasan? Learn to read.Milos wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:01 pmOh cry me a river. So much whining. Like kids. Ppl really get this too personally.CMCanavessi wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:37 pm That rule talks about "engine bugs", which clearly wasn't the case here. It was a server issue, not an engine(s) issue. I think it's sad that Arasan will promote only because it was given a free point when Nemorino was about to beat it and crashed + was helped by the server issue that affected both Leela and lc0. The whole purpose of the tournament is that stronger engines should play the highest leagues. Here, clearly, lc0 and Ethereal were the strongest engines, by far, yet, because the server was misconfigured/poorly cooled/whatever, an engine will not advance. There wasn't anything the devs could do.
You didn't even say a word when Ivanhoe was playing with a wrong binary (sent by competitor with agenda against Ivanhoe) that was never ever tested by TCEC, even though TCEC in the past already had a properly working binry. With working Ivanhoe Lc0 would anyway never promote to Div2 since it is most certainly weaker than Ivanhoe on 43 cores in TCEC conditions (that is of a strength of Gull).
So go cry somewhere else please. This is just ridiculous.
And also, even if you put ASMFish in div4, leela still promotes, because top 2 do so. Learn the rules.
You seems so angry that you can't even read properly. I clearly wrote that Lc0 wouldn't promote to Div2 because Ethereal and Ivanhoe would promote instead.
You should try to calm down, or if you can't go somewhere cry a bit and then after you feel a bit less sad and angry come back to comment .