Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

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Alayan
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Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Alayan »

That's a nice result. I counted 13 solutions found by 11.75 but not 12.25, so 64 of the found solutions were the same and 34 solutions were found by 12.25 but not 11.75.

Going through the results, I found one position that only Ethereal 11.75 had solved among the tested engines. :mrgreen:

One qualm I have with this sort of test suite is that it focuses on "only move" positions with a hard only move that wins or saves a draw. Positions with a superior move that doesn't outright win but gives better chances are critical in games but are absent from "hard positions" tests. Nevermind positions with multiple playable moves. Engines like Houdini 1.5 and Critter are good at finding some hard tactics, but they have much more trouble at playing well in quieter positions.
Vinvin
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Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Vinvin »

Alayan wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 9:24 pm Going through the results, I found one position that only Ethereal 11.75 had solved among the tested engines. :mrgreen:
Yes, it was pure luck.
I plan to make a criticism about a lot of the positions.
Alayan wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 9:24 pm One qualm I have with this sort of test suite is that it focuses on "only move" positions with a hard only move that wins or saves a draw. Positions with a superior move that doesn't outright win but gives better chances are critical in games but are absent from "hard positions" tests. Nevermind positions with multiple playable moves. Engines like Houdini 1.5 and Critter are good at finding some hard tactics, but they have much more trouble at playing well in quieter positions.
Yes, the positional play is important but tactical shots are also important.
Vinvin
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Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Vinvin »

2 new results :
Stockfish_20-06-27-10 : 153 sol (1252 sec)
Black-Diamond-XI-r2 : 135 sol (1419 sec)

Very good for Stockfish_20-06-27-10, if finds 12 more solutions the SF 11 !!! :twisted:

Not so good for Black-Diamond-XI-r2, if finds fewer solutions than Black-Diamond-XI and Black-Diamond-XR7. :(

Results sheet updated : http://home.scarlet.be/vincentlejeune/c ... 2020v2.ods
Vinvin
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Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Vinvin »

2 more results :

ShashChess 12.0 : 111 solutions (1842 seconds)
Not a lot of solutions but hold some records now. This engine has surely something special.
Another curious thing : the search changes when I restart with the same position. There should be random things in this engine.
I ask ed the question in the ShashChess thread : http://talkchess.com/forum3/viewtopic.p ... 37#p849637

Crystal-2020-06-29 : 159 solutions (1061 seconds)
Very good result for Crystal : +13 solutions over Crystal 2020-05-02 !
It's the best engine so far if we except "Bluefish-FD-XI-Tact=2-defens=no" (who use multi threads) and "Eman 5.40, FAD=12" (who use full depth for first plies)
I downloaded the engine from here : https://chess.ultimaiq.net/stockfish.html

Results sheet updated : http://home.scarlet.be/vincentlejeune/c ... 2020v2.ods
Dann Corbit
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Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Dann Corbit »

I wonder if the FAD = N could be applied to Bluefish to make a super tactical solver (that will probably stink up the joint when playing games)
Taking ideas is not a vice, it is a virtue. We have another word for this. It is called learning.
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Vinvin
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Full name: Vincent Lejeune

Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Vinvin »

Vinvin wrote: Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:33 pm I imported all the positions in Lichess Studies (but not all the mainlines yet) :
#1 to #60 : https://lichess.org/study/y6sM5eAf
#61 to #120 : https://lichess.org/study/Vfe59GOH
#121 to #180 : https://lichess.org/study/0FQa6riN
#181 to #213 : https://lichess.org/study/s2mTErEZ
I updated a lot of variations to explain all the "Hard-Talkchess-2020" points in these Studies.
Please tell me if you wish to add some variations.
Paloma
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Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Paloma »

Great, thanks for your work.
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Master Om
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Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Master Om »

Vinvin wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:02 am 2 new results :
Stockfish_20-06-27-10 : 153 sol (1252 sec)
Black-Diamond-XI-r2 : 135 sol (1419 sec)

Very good for Stockfish_20-06-27-10, if finds 12 more solutions the SF 11 !!! :twisted:

Not so good for Black-Diamond-XI-r2, if finds fewer solutions than Black-Diamond-XI and Black-Diamond-XR7. :(

Results sheet updated : http://home.scarlet.be/vincentlejeune/c ... 2020v2.ods
Stockfish_20-06-27-10 <---- Where to get this ?
Always Expect the Unexpected
zullil
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Full name: Louis Zulli

Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by zullil »

Master Om wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:18 pm
Vinvin wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:02 am 2 new results :
Stockfish_20-06-27-10 : 153 sol (1252 sec)
Black-Diamond-XI-r2 : 135 sol (1419 sec)

Very good for Stockfish_20-06-27-10, if finds 12 more solutions the SF 11 !!! :twisted:

Not so good for Black-Diamond-XI-r2, if finds fewer solutions than Black-Diamond-XI and Black-Diamond-XR7. :(

Results sheet updated : http://home.scarlet.be/vincentlejeune/c ... 2020v2.ods
Stockfish_20-06-27-10 <---- Where to get this ?
I assume it's simply the June 27 version of Stockfish-dev. You can get it at https://abrok.eu/stockfish/
Vinvin
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:40 am
Full name: Vincent Lejeune

Re: Hard-Talkchess-2020 set, final release

Post by Vinvin »

zullil wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:24 pm
Master Om wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:18 pm
Vinvin wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:02 am 2 new results :
Stockfish_20-06-27-10 : 153 sol (1252 sec)
Black-Diamond-XI-r2 : 135 sol (1419 sec)

Very good for Stockfish_20-06-27-10, if finds 12 more solutions the SF 11 !!! :twisted:

Not so good for Black-Diamond-XI-r2, if finds fewer solutions than Black-Diamond-XI and Black-Diamond-XR7. :(

Results sheet updated : http://home.scarlet.be/vincentlejeune/c ... 2020v2.ods
Stockfish_20-06-27-10 <---- Where to get this ?
I assume it's simply the June 27 version of Stockfish-dev. You can get it at https://abrok.eu/stockfish/
Yes, this one is here :
https://abrok.eu/stockfish/builds/ca41e ... modern.exe