Minic version 2

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xr_a_y
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Re: Minic version 2

Post by xr_a_y » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:50 am

Minic 2.51 is available.

https://github.com/tryingsomestuff/Mini ... s/tag/2.51

NNUE performance is just crazy with this release, as shown in previous post.

Have fun.

chysiddh14
Posts: 37
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Full name: Siddhartha Chaudhary

Re: Minic version 2

Post by chysiddh14 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:33 pm

same android binary can be used in arm7 and arm8 device ,thanks

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xr_a_y
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Re: Minic version 2

Post by xr_a_y » Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:58 pm

chysiddh14 wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:33 pm
same android binary can be used in arm7 and arm8 device ,thanks
Great news ! I must say I don't test that by myself.

If you can post some figures about Minic on android speed and strength it would be great !

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Rebel
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Re: Minic version 2

Post by Rebel » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:22 pm

xr_a_y wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:50 am
Minic 2.51 is available.

https://github.com/tryingsomestuff/Mini ... s/tag/2.51

NNUE performance is just crazy with this release, as shown in previous post.

Have fun.
SRL 1000ms, quite some differences between the 4 nets I tested with version 2.51

Code: Select all

                     The SRL rating list of : Wed Oct 14 17:06:37 2020
    EPD  : epd\lc1.epd
    Time : 1000ms
                                                                     Max            Time   Hash          
    Engine                 Points  Used Time   Found   Pos    Elo   Score   Score    ms     Mb  Cpu  Errors  NNUE
 1  Stockfish 12           341638  11:34:09.7  25383  40000  3416  400000  85.41%   1000   128    1     0    SV-2257
 2  Ethereal-NNUE          334327  11:37:45.7  24676  40000  3343  400000  83.58%   1000   128    1     0    nn-baeb9ef2d183
 3  RubiChess 1.8 NNUE     328244  11:30:21.7  23651  40000  3282  400000  82.06%   1000   128    1     0    nn-97f742aaefcd
 4  Minic 2.51 SV-2257     327917  11:02:37.3  23628  40000  3279  400000  81.98%   1000   128    1     0    SV-2257
 5  Minic 2.51 NNUE        325905  11:01:15.1  23441  40000  3259  400000  81.48%   1000   128    1     0    nn-97f742aaefcd
 6  Minic 2.50 NNUE        322147  11:06:22.6  22986  40000  3221  400000  80.54%   1000   128    1     0    nn-97f742aaefcd
 7  Nemorino 6.00          319148  10:36:00.7  22853  40000  3191  400000  79.79%   1000   128    1    42
 8  Orion 0.7 NNUE_Player  318886  11:43:55.1  22654  40000  3188  400000  79.72%   1000   128    1     0    SV-2257
 9  Ethereal 12.62         317128  11:37:07.9  22428  40000  3171  400000  79.28%   1000   128    1     0
10  Komodo 14              317110  11:09:21.4  22398  40000  3171  400000  79.28%   1000   128    1     0
11  igel 2.80 NNUE         316831  11:32:02.3  22679  40000  3168  400000  79.21%   1000   128    1     0
12  Minic 2.51 nexus       315288  11:01:57.0  22397  40000  3152  400000  78.82%   1000   128    1     0    napping_nexus
13  Houdini 6.03           314596  11:27:54.8  22218  40000  3146  400000  78.65%   1000   128    1     0
14  SlowChess 2.2          313139  10:30:56.4  21860  40000  3131  400000  78.28%   1000   128    1     0
15  Minic 2.51 nutrient    312407  11:02:18.3  21729  40000  3124  400000  78.10%   1000   128    1     0    nascent_nutrient
16  rofChade 2.3           309642  11:24:20.2  21587  40000  3096  400000  77.41%   1000   128    1    41
17  Ethereal 12            309088  11:30:20.9  21840  40000  3090  400000  77.27%   1000   128    1     0
18  Laser 1.7              308178  11:29:30.5  21320  40000  3081  400000  77.04%   1000   128    1     0
19  Schooner 2.2           306808  10:22:01.9  21335  40000  3068  400000  76.70%   1000   128    1     0
20  Xiphos 0.6             306796  10:03:55.9  21333  40000  3068  400000  76.70%   1000   128    1     0
21  Booot 6.4              305082  12:56:19.6  21267  40000  3050  400000  76.27%   1000   128    1   124
22  Defenchess 2.2         303754  10:12:00.7  21208  40000  3037  400000  75.94%   1000   128    1    41
23  Andscacs 0.95          301560  12:10:30.8  20745  40000  3015  400000  75.39%   1005   128    1    41
24  Shredder 13            300619  11:28:47.0  20946  40000  3006  400000  75.15%   1000   128    1     0
25  Wasp 4.00              299925  11:45:50.1  20727  40000  2999  400000  74.98%   1000   128    1     0
26  Senpai 2               299279  11:36:50.5  20615  40000  2992  400000  74.82%   1000   128    1    42
27  Winter 0.9             298713  10:06:38.6  20518  40000  2987  400000  74.68%   1000   128    1     0
28  Arasan 22              298663  11:27:32.7  20460  40000  2986  400000  74.67%   1000   128    1     0
29  ice 4.0                297995  11:49:51.1  20767  40000  2980  400000  74.50%   1000   128    1     0
30  Critter 1.6            297939  11:38:55.1  20654  40000  2979  400000  74.48%   1000   128    1    22
31  Fire 7.1               296996  11:26:35.7  20356  40000  2970  400000  74.25%   1000   128    1     0
32  Vajolet 2.8            296269  11:25:51.6  20327  40000  2962  400000  74.07%   1000   128    1     0
33  Demolito 200514        295686  10:53:58.5  20429  40000  2956  400000  73.92%   1000   128    1     0
34  Gogobello 2.2          293824  11:44:24.1  20296  40000  2938  400000  73.46%   1000   128    1    41
35  Nemorino 5.00          291649  10:05:27.4  19882  40000  2916  400000  72.91%   1000   128    1    41
36  Rodent 4               291647  11:45:03.3  19774  40000  2916  400000  72.91%   1000   128    1     0
37  Winter 0.8             291596  10:02:03.0  20057  40000  2916  400000  72.90%   1000   128    1    41
38  Hannibal 1.7           291446  11:39:04.6  19985  40000  2914  400000  72.86%   1000   128    1     0
39  Combusken 1.2          291389  12:25:31.9  19902  40000  2914  400000  72.85%   1000   128    1    41
40  Texel 1.7              291164  11:27:40.3  20064  40000  2911  400000  72.79%   1000   128    1     0
41  Monolith 2             290807  11:31:27.5  19972  40000  2908  400000  72.70%   1000   128    1     0
42  Topple 0.7.5           290649  12:13:57.0  19696  40000  2906  400000  72.66%   1000   128    1     0
43  Deuterium 2019         290578  11:31:42.7  19819  40000  2905  400000  72.64%   1000   128    1     0
44  Chiron 4               290250  11:46:17.8  19978  40000  2902  400000  72.56%   1000   128    1     0
45  Godel 7.0              290222  12:52:57.9  19758  40000  2902  400000  72.56%   1000   128    1    42
46  Amoeba 3.1             289712  09:40:26.2  19682  40000  2897  400000  72.43%   1000   128    1     0
47  FabChess 1.15          289296  11:50:40.2  19849  40000  2892  400000  72.32%   1000   128    1    41
48  sting-sf-21            288904  11:31:56.3  19905  40000  2889  400000  72.23%   1000   128    1     0
49  Marvin 3.60            288732  10:48:52.8  19848  40000  2887  400000  72.18%   1000   128    1    41
50  Bobcat 8               287527  10:54:11.9  19486  40000  2875  400000  71.88%   1000   128    1     0
51  Invictus r305          285355  10:16:08.6  19227  40000  2853  400000  71.34%   1000   128    1     0
52  Counter 3.5            285137  11:25:20.1  19329  40000  2851  400000  71.28%   1000   128    1     0
53  Weiss 1.0              284693  11:23:14.3  19241  40000  2846  400000  71.17%   1000   128    1     0
54  Asymptote 0.8          284305  12:19:43.9  19245  40000  2843  400000  71.08%   1000   128    1    41
55  Tucano 8.0             280426  04:46:55.0  18777  40000  2804  400000  70.11%   1000   128    1     0
56  RuyDos 1.1.11          278666  10:25:44.5  18567  40000  2786  400000  69.67%   1000   128    1     0
57  Cheese 2.1             277252  11:28:33.3  18763  40000  2772  400000  69.31%   1000   128    1     0
58  GreKo 2020.03          276482  11:29:35.7  18694  40000  2764  400000  69.12%   1000   128    1     0
59  Fruit 2.3              275618  11:30:55.1  18270  40000  2756  400000  68.90%   1000   128    1     0
60  ProDeo 2.2             273793  11:29:46.3  18263  40000  2738  400000  68.45%   1000   128    1     0
61  Benjamin               271801  11:29:55.8  17985  40000  2718  400000  67.95%   1000   128    1     0
62  Fridolin 3.10          271357  11:40:42.9  18030  40000  2713  400000  67.84%   1000   128    1     0
63  Fruit 2.1              270830  11:29:45.7  17982  40000  2708  400000  67.71%   1000   128    1     0
64  Devel 3.0.0b           269433  12:22:53.0  17986  40000  2694  400000  67.36%   1000   128    1    65
65  Ruffian 2              265592  11:13:01.7  17740  40000  2656  400000  66.40%   1000   128    1     0
66  Stash 18.0             253693  11:10:20.4  16848  40000  2536  400000  63.42%   1000   128    1     0
67  CT800 1.40             253449  10:45:20.4  16533  40000  2534  400000  63.36%   1000   128    1     0
68  Ares 005-2             243380  04:42:01.1  15937  40000  2433  400000  60.84%   1000   128    1     0
69  FoxSee 3.3.3           240244  11:08:18.3  15505  40000  2402  400000  60.06%   1000   128    1     0

Code: Select all

                                                                     Max            Time   Hash          
    Engine                 Points  Used Time   Found   Pos    Elo   Score   Score    ms     Mb  Cpu  Errors  NNUE
 4  Minic 2.51 SV-2257     327917  11:02:37.3  23628  40000  3279  400000  81.98%   1000   128    1     0    SV-2257
 5  Minic 2.51 NNUE        325905  11:01:15.1  23441  40000  3259  400000  81.48%   1000   128    1     0    nn-97f742aaefcd
12  Minic 2.51 nexus       315288  11:01:57.0  22397  40000  3152  400000  78.82%   1000   128    1     0    napping_nexus
15  Minic 2.51 nutrient    312407  11:02:18.3  21729  40000  3124  400000  78.10%   1000   128    1     0    nascent_nutrient
90% of coding is debugging, the other 10% is writing bugs.

Gabor Szots
Posts: 623
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Location: Szentendre, Hungary
Full name: Gabor Szots

Re: Minic version 2

Post by Gabor Szots » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm

Vivien, please enlighten me. If the NNUE used is not from SF but your own work why don't you want it to be tested?
Gabor Szots
CCRL testing group

User avatar
xr_a_y
Posts: 1320
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Location: France

Re: Minic version 2

Post by xr_a_y » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:54 pm

Gabor Szots wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm
Vivien, please enlighten me. If the NNUE used is not from SF but your own work why don't you want it to be tested?
NNUE merge was too easy :oops:
NNUE technology is from SF.
But yes I built my own net (nascent nutrient).

Please see this
http://talkchess.com/forum3/viewtopic.p ... fe#p863067

User avatar
xr_a_y
Posts: 1320
Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2017 1:28 pm
Location: France

Re: Minic version 2

Post by xr_a_y » Wed Oct 14, 2020 5:11 pm

Rebel wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:22 pm
xr_a_y wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:50 am
Minic 2.51 is available.

https://github.com/tryingsomestuff/Mini ... s/tag/2.51

NNUE performance is just crazy with this release, as shown in previous post.

Have fun.
SRL 1000ms, quite some differences between the 4 nets I tested with version 2.51

Code: Select all

                     The SRL rating list of : Wed Oct 14 17:06:37 2020
    EPD  : epd\lc1.epd
    Time : 1000ms
                                                                     Max            Time   Hash          
    Engine                 Points  Used Time   Found   Pos    Elo   Score   Score    ms     Mb  Cpu  Errors  NNUE
 1  Stockfish 12           341638  11:34:09.7  25383  40000  3416  400000  85.41%   1000   128    1     0    SV-2257
 2  Ethereal-NNUE          334327  11:37:45.7  24676  40000  3343  400000  83.58%   1000   128    1     0    nn-baeb9ef2d183
 3  RubiChess 1.8 NNUE     328244  11:30:21.7  23651  40000  3282  400000  82.06%   1000   128    1     0    nn-97f742aaefcd
 4  Minic 2.51 SV-2257     327917  11:02:37.3  23628  40000  3279  400000  81.98%   1000   128    1     0    SV-2257
 5  Minic 2.51 NNUE        325905  11:01:15.1  23441  40000  3259  400000  81.48%   1000   128    1     0    nn-97f742aaefcd
 6  Minic 2.50 NNUE        322147  11:06:22.6  22986  40000  3221  400000  80.54%   1000   128    1     0    nn-97f742aaefcd
 7  Nemorino 6.00          319148  10:36:00.7  22853  40000  3191  400000  79.79%   1000   128    1    42
 8  Orion 0.7 NNUE_Player  318886  11:43:55.1  22654  40000  3188  400000  79.72%   1000   128    1     0    SV-2257
 9  Ethereal 12.62         317128  11:37:07.9  22428  40000  3171  400000  79.28%   1000   128    1     0
10  Komodo 14              317110  11:09:21.4  22398  40000  3171  400000  79.28%   1000   128    1     0
11  igel 2.80 NNUE         316831  11:32:02.3  22679  40000  3168  400000  79.21%   1000   128    1     0
12  Minic 2.51 nexus       315288  11:01:57.0  22397  40000  3152  400000  78.82%   1000   128    1     0    napping_nexus
13  Houdini 6.03           314596  11:27:54.8  22218  40000  3146  400000  78.65%   1000   128    1     0
14  SlowChess 2.2          313139  10:30:56.4  21860  40000  3131  400000  78.28%   1000   128    1     0
15  Minic 2.51 nutrient    312407  11:02:18.3  21729  40000  3124  400000  78.10%   1000   128    1     0    nascent_nutrient
16  rofChade 2.3           309642  11:24:20.2  21587  40000  3096  400000  77.41%   1000   128    1    41
17  Ethereal 12            309088  11:30:20.9  21840  40000  3090  400000  77.27%   1000   128    1     0
18  Laser 1.7              308178  11:29:30.5  21320  40000  3081  400000  77.04%   1000   128    1     0
19  Schooner 2.2           306808  10:22:01.9  21335  40000  3068  400000  76.70%   1000   128    1     0
20  Xiphos 0.6             306796  10:03:55.9  21333  40000  3068  400000  76.70%   1000   128    1     0
21  Booot 6.4              305082  12:56:19.6  21267  40000  3050  400000  76.27%   1000   128    1   124
22  Defenchess 2.2         303754  10:12:00.7  21208  40000  3037  400000  75.94%   1000   128    1    41
23  Andscacs 0.95          301560  12:10:30.8  20745  40000  3015  400000  75.39%   1005   128    1    41
24  Shredder 13            300619  11:28:47.0  20946  40000  3006  400000  75.15%   1000   128    1     0
25  Wasp 4.00              299925  11:45:50.1  20727  40000  2999  400000  74.98%   1000   128    1     0
26  Senpai 2               299279  11:36:50.5  20615  40000  2992  400000  74.82%   1000   128    1    42
27  Winter 0.9             298713  10:06:38.6  20518  40000  2987  400000  74.68%   1000   128    1     0
28  Arasan 22              298663  11:27:32.7  20460  40000  2986  400000  74.67%   1000   128    1     0
29  ice 4.0                297995  11:49:51.1  20767  40000  2980  400000  74.50%   1000   128    1     0
30  Critter 1.6            297939  11:38:55.1  20654  40000  2979  400000  74.48%   1000   128    1    22
31  Fire 7.1               296996  11:26:35.7  20356  40000  2970  400000  74.25%   1000   128    1     0
32  Vajolet 2.8            296269  11:25:51.6  20327  40000  2962  400000  74.07%   1000   128    1     0
33  Demolito 200514        295686  10:53:58.5  20429  40000  2956  400000  73.92%   1000   128    1     0
34  Gogobello 2.2          293824  11:44:24.1  20296  40000  2938  400000  73.46%   1000   128    1    41
35  Nemorino 5.00          291649  10:05:27.4  19882  40000  2916  400000  72.91%   1000   128    1    41
36  Rodent 4               291647  11:45:03.3  19774  40000  2916  400000  72.91%   1000   128    1     0
37  Winter 0.8             291596  10:02:03.0  20057  40000  2916  400000  72.90%   1000   128    1    41
38  Hannibal 1.7           291446  11:39:04.6  19985  40000  2914  400000  72.86%   1000   128    1     0
39  Combusken 1.2          291389  12:25:31.9  19902  40000  2914  400000  72.85%   1000   128    1    41
40  Texel 1.7              291164  11:27:40.3  20064  40000  2911  400000  72.79%   1000   128    1     0
41  Monolith 2             290807  11:31:27.5  19972  40000  2908  400000  72.70%   1000   128    1     0
42  Topple 0.7.5           290649  12:13:57.0  19696  40000  2906  400000  72.66%   1000   128    1     0
43  Deuterium 2019         290578  11:31:42.7  19819  40000  2905  400000  72.64%   1000   128    1     0
44  Chiron 4               290250  11:46:17.8  19978  40000  2902  400000  72.56%   1000   128    1     0
45  Godel 7.0              290222  12:52:57.9  19758  40000  2902  400000  72.56%   1000   128    1    42
46  Amoeba 3.1             289712  09:40:26.2  19682  40000  2897  400000  72.43%   1000   128    1     0
47  FabChess 1.15          289296  11:50:40.2  19849  40000  2892  400000  72.32%   1000   128    1    41
48  sting-sf-21            288904  11:31:56.3  19905  40000  2889  400000  72.23%   1000   128    1     0
49  Marvin 3.60            288732  10:48:52.8  19848  40000  2887  400000  72.18%   1000   128    1    41
50  Bobcat 8               287527  10:54:11.9  19486  40000  2875  400000  71.88%   1000   128    1     0
51  Invictus r305          285355  10:16:08.6  19227  40000  2853  400000  71.34%   1000   128    1     0
52  Counter 3.5            285137  11:25:20.1  19329  40000  2851  400000  71.28%   1000   128    1     0
53  Weiss 1.0              284693  11:23:14.3  19241  40000  2846  400000  71.17%   1000   128    1     0
54  Asymptote 0.8          284305  12:19:43.9  19245  40000  2843  400000  71.08%   1000   128    1    41
55  Tucano 8.0             280426  04:46:55.0  18777  40000  2804  400000  70.11%   1000   128    1     0
56  RuyDos 1.1.11          278666  10:25:44.5  18567  40000  2786  400000  69.67%   1000   128    1     0
57  Cheese 2.1             277252  11:28:33.3  18763  40000  2772  400000  69.31%   1000   128    1     0
58  GreKo 2020.03          276482  11:29:35.7  18694  40000  2764  400000  69.12%   1000   128    1     0
59  Fruit 2.3              275618  11:30:55.1  18270  40000  2756  400000  68.90%   1000   128    1     0
60  ProDeo 2.2             273793  11:29:46.3  18263  40000  2738  400000  68.45%   1000   128    1     0
61  Benjamin               271801  11:29:55.8  17985  40000  2718  400000  67.95%   1000   128    1     0
62  Fridolin 3.10          271357  11:40:42.9  18030  40000  2713  400000  67.84%   1000   128    1     0
63  Fruit 2.1              270830  11:29:45.7  17982  40000  2708  400000  67.71%   1000   128    1     0
64  Devel 3.0.0b           269433  12:22:53.0  17986  40000  2694  400000  67.36%   1000   128    1    65
65  Ruffian 2              265592  11:13:01.7  17740  40000  2656  400000  66.40%   1000   128    1     0
66  Stash 18.0             253693  11:10:20.4  16848  40000  2536  400000  63.42%   1000   128    1     0
67  CT800 1.40             253449  10:45:20.4  16533  40000  2534  400000  63.36%   1000   128    1     0
68  Ares 005-2             243380  04:42:01.1  15937  40000  2433  400000  60.84%   1000   128    1     0
69  FoxSee 3.3.3           240244  11:08:18.3  15505  40000  2402  400000  60.06%   1000   128    1     0

Code: Select all

                                                                     Max            Time   Hash          
    Engine                 Points  Used Time   Found   Pos    Elo   Score   Score    ms     Mb  Cpu  Errors  NNUE
 4  Minic 2.51 SV-2257     327917  11:02:37.3  23628  40000  3279  400000  81.98%   1000   128    1     0    SV-2257
 5  Minic 2.51 NNUE        325905  11:01:15.1  23441  40000  3259  400000  81.48%   1000   128    1     0    nn-97f742aaefcd
12  Minic 2.51 nexus       315288  11:01:57.0  22397  40000  3152  400000  78.82%   1000   128    1     0    napping_nexus
15  Minic 2.51 nutrient    312407  11:02:18.3  21729  40000  3124  400000  78.10%   1000   128    1     0    nascent_nutrient
Thanks for this test. Order and strength of nets is well respected. Very good tool you have !

Code: Select all

13  Houdini 6.03           314596  11:27:54.8  22218  40000  3146  400000  78.65%   1000   128    1     0
14  SlowChess 2.2          313139  10:30:56.4  21860  40000  3131  400000  78.28%   1000   128    1     0
15  Minic 2.51 nutrient    312407  11:02:18.3  21729  40000  3124  400000  78.10%   1000   128    1     0    nascent_nutrient
16  rofChade 2.3           309642  11:24:20.2  21587  40000  3096  400000  77.41%   1000   128    1    41
17  Ethereal 12            309088  11:30:20.9  21840  40000  3090  400000  77.27%   1000   128    1     0
18  Laser 1.7              308178  11:29:30.5  21320  40000  3081  400000  77.04%   1000   128    1     0
19  Schooner 2.2           306808  10:22:01.9  21335  40000  3068  400000  76.70%   1000   128    1     0
20  Xiphos 0.6             306796  10:03:55.9  21333  40000  3068  400000  76.70%   1000   128    1     0
21  Booot 6.4              305082  12:56:19.6  21267  40000  3050  400000  76.27%   1000   128    1   124
22  Defenchess 2.2         303754  10:12:00.7  21208  40000  3037  400000  75.94%   1000   128    1    41
Gabor, that's an example why I don't want MinicNNUE (even with nascent nutrient) to be rated and been called Minic. Because there is good chance it will here between Ethereal, Xiphos, Defenchess, rofChade, ... I don't feel like it is its right place.

Another example is what is currently happening in Graham division 2 (with nascent nutrient also)

Code: Select all

   1.   MINIC 2.50 64-BIT                           34    21.0    **** ===. 101. 0=0. ===. 10=. 11=. ==1. 1=1. =1=1 1=0. 11=. 
   2.   DEFENCHESS 2.2 64-BIT                       34    20.0    ===. **** 1==. =0=. =1=. =1=. ==== 01=. =1=. ==1. ===. 11=. 
   3.   RUBICHESS 1.8 64-BIT                        34    19.0    010. 0==. **** 1=1. ===. 0==. =0=. 11=. 1=1. 1==. ===. ==1= 
   4.   ANDSCACS 0.95 64-BIT                        34    18.5    1=1. =1=. 0=0. **** ===. =1=0 =0=. =1=. 0=1. 11=. 0==. =1=. 
   5.   ARASAN 22.1 64-BIT                          33    18.0    ===. =0=. ===. ===. **** 11=. 10=. ==1. 01=. =1=. 10=. ===. 
In front of Defenchess, Rubi, Andsacs, Arasan, ... and on a quite small hardware I guess from the nps ... will be even worst on better hardware I think. So not me league ...

For now, I'm learning about NN and that's enough.

nabildanial
Posts: 125
Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 3:29 am
Location: Malaysia

Re: Minic version 2

Post by nabildanial » Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:47 pm

xr_a_y wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:54 pm
Gabor Szots wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm
Vivien, please enlighten me. If the NNUE used is not from SF but your own work why don't you want it to be tested?
NNUE merge was too easy :oops:
NNUE technology is from SF.
But yes I built my own net (nascent nutrient).

Please see this
http://talkchess.com/forum3/viewtopic.p ... fe#p863067
NNUE is no different than every single technique/technology used in chess (LMR, null move etc.) except that all of them are related to search. Is it something about NNUE being an eval-based technology that makes it undeserved to be recognized by you?

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xr_a_y
Posts: 1320
Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2017 1:28 pm
Location: France

Re: Minic version 2

Post by xr_a_y » Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:59 pm

nabildanial wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:47 pm
xr_a_y wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:54 pm
Gabor Szots wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm
Vivien, please enlighten me. If the NNUE used is not from SF but your own work why don't you want it to be tested?
NNUE merge was too easy :oops:
NNUE technology is from SF.
But yes I built my own net (nascent nutrient).

Please see this
http://talkchess.com/forum3/viewtopic.p ... fe#p863067
NNUE is no different than every single technique/technology used in chess (LMR, null move etc.) except that all of them are related to search. Is it something about NNUE being an eval-based technology that makes it undeserved to be recognized by you?
I not only borrow the technology, but also the code itself (a code bigger in number of lines than Minic code itself !).
Moreover NNUE merging inside Minic (both evaluation code and learning code) was very easy, because the code was already well cleaned by Stockfish contributors.

I'll rethink my position for example if NNUE and associated learning tools become a shared lib for the community. Or if like 30 engines is going for NNUE and uses SF nets ... (a situation I will dislike a lot ...)
I did this NNUE experiment for fun, for learning, not for position in rating list.

Of course anyone can use it ! And I'll try to build net for it. Think of it as an option, not a way to climb the ladder. (a ladder that Minic is already climbing quite fast anyway http://ccrl.chessdom.com/ccrl/404/cgi/c ... +opponents, thanks to the forum, to CPW, to advices, to discord channel, to code reading, ...)

nabildanial
Posts: 125
Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 3:29 am
Location: Malaysia

Re: Minic version 2

Post by nabildanial » Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:07 pm

xr_a_y wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:59 pm
nabildanial wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:47 pm
xr_a_y wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:54 pm
Gabor Szots wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm
Vivien, please enlighten me. If the NNUE used is not from SF but your own work why don't you want it to be tested?
NNUE merge was too easy :oops:
NNUE technology is from SF.
But yes I built my own net (nascent nutrient).

Please see this
http://talkchess.com/forum3/viewtopic.p ... fe#p863067
NNUE is no different than every single technique/technology used in chess (LMR, null move etc.) except that all of them are related to search. Is it something about NNUE being an eval-based technology that makes it undeserved to be recognized by you?
I not only borrow the technology, but also the code itself (a code bigger in number of lines than Minic code itself !).
Moreover NNUE merging inside Minic (both evaluation code and learning code) was very easy, because the code was already well cleaned by Stockfish contributors.
I get it if the used net to rank Minic is SF nets, but I don't quite get why you don't want to recognize your own homebrew nets that are created from Minic own eval as a part of Minic.

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