interesting correspondence game

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zullil
Posts: 6326
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Location: PA USA
Full name: Louis Zulli

Re: interesting correspondence game

Post by zullil » Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:30 pm

peter wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:21 pm
Leto wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:23 pm
Maybe 8.qd2 might be the problem, on ICCF it seems 8.Ne2 is showing some promise.
Also true, even if there are only 76 games on Bellmann's CD, 25 white wins and 5 for Black with 8.Ne2, it's main move in Cerebellum.
After 8.Qd2 there are 2473 games, 842 1-0, 264 0-1.
Stockfish+nnue agrees:

+0.26 8. Ne2 cxd4 9. Nexd4 Be7 10. Be2 Nc5 11. Nb3 b6 12. c3 O-O 13. O-O Bd7 14. Kh1 Qc7 15. Bg1 a5 16. a4 Rac8 17. Re1 Qb7 18. Bb5 Qc7 19. Nbd4 Nxd4 20. Nxd4 Ne4 21. Ba6 Rb8 22. Rc1 Ra8 23. Bd3 Qb7 24. Ra1 Bc5 25. Qe2 Bxd4 26. Bxd4 Rfc8 27. Rf1 Nc5 28. f5 exf5 29. Bxf5 Bxf5 30. Rxf5 Qc6 31. Raf1 (depth 45, 0:28:55)

carldaman
Posts: 1952
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:13 am

Re: interesting correspondence game

Post by carldaman » Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:36 pm

jdart wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 4:31 pm
In general, .. c4 tends to be a bad move in the French, it just locks the pawn structure and leaves Black with little counterplay. There are always exceptions, though.

10. Qf2 is in fact the newest trend in this line, it appears.
Right, c5-c4 is usually hideous in the French - unless White has castled Q-side and Black has that option as well, as we saw here. Then you'd have a far less safe white king, although that may not be immediately apparent. The relative position of the Kings determines if the idea is correct.

zullil
Posts: 6326
Joined: Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:31 pm
Location: PA USA
Full name: Louis Zulli

Re: interesting correspondence game

Post by zullil » Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:42 pm

zullil wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:30 pm
peter wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:21 pm
Leto wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:23 pm
Maybe 8.qd2 might be the problem, on ICCF it seems 8.Ne2 is showing some promise.
Also true, even if there are only 76 games on Bellmann's CD, 25 white wins and 5 for Black with 8.Ne2, it's main move in Cerebellum.
After 8.Qd2 there are 2473 games, 842 1-0, 264 0-1.
Stockfish+nnue agrees:

+0.26 8. Ne2 cxd4 9. Nexd4 Be7 10. Be2 Nc5 11. Nb3 b6 12. c3 O-O 13. O-O Bd7 14. Kh1 Qc7 15. Bg1 a5 16. a4 Rac8 17. Re1 Qb7 18. Bb5 Qc7 19. Nbd4 Nxd4 20. Nxd4 Ne4 21. Ba6 Rb8 22. Rc1 Ra8 23. Bd3 Qb7 24. Ra1 Bc5 25. Qe2 Bxd4 26. Bxd4 Rfc8 27. Rf1 Nc5 28. f5 exf5 29. Bxf5 Bxf5 30. Rxf5 Qc6 31. Raf1 (depth 45, 0:28:55)
Until it doesn't:

+0.21 8. a3 cxd4 9. Nxd4 Bc5 10. Qd2 O-O 11. Qf2 Nxd4 12. Bxd4 Bxd4 13. Qxd4 Nb8 14. Bd3 Nc6 15. Qe3 f6 16. O-O fxe5 17. fxe5 Rxf1+ 18. Rxf1 Bd7 19. Na4 Qe7 20. Nc5 Be8 21. c4 Nxe5 22. Nxe6 Qxe6 23. Rf5 Nf3+ 24. Rxf3 Qxe3+ 25. Rxe3 dxc4 26. Bxc4+ Bf7 27. Bd3 Rc8 28. Be4 b6 29. Rd3 Bg6 30. Bxg6 hxg6 31. Rd2 Kf7 32. Kf2 Ke6 33. Ke3 g5 34. Re2 Kf5 35. Kd4 Rd8+ 36. Kc4 Rd7 37. a4 Rd1 38. b3 Rb1 39. Kb4 g4 40. g3 g6 41. Kc4 g5 42. b4 Ra1 43. Kd5 Rxa4 44. Re5+ Kf6 45. Re6+ Kf5 46. Rxb6 (depth 56, 1:30:13)

zullil
Posts: 6326
Joined: Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:31 pm
Location: PA USA
Full name: Louis Zulli

Re: interesting correspondence game

Post by zullil » Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:28 am

zullil wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:42 pm
zullil wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:30 pm
peter wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:21 pm
Leto wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:23 pm
Maybe 8.qd2 might be the problem, on ICCF it seems 8.Ne2 is showing some promise.
Also true, even if there are only 76 games on Bellmann's CD, 25 white wins and 5 for Black with 8.Ne2, it's main move in Cerebellum.
After 8.Qd2 there are 2473 games, 842 1-0, 264 0-1.
Stockfish+nnue agrees:

+0.26 8. Ne2 cxd4 9. Nexd4 Be7 10. Be2 Nc5 11. Nb3 b6 12. c3 O-O 13. O-O Bd7 14. Kh1 Qc7 15. Bg1 a5 16. a4 Rac8 17. Re1 Qb7 18. Bb5 Qc7 19. Nbd4 Nxd4 20. Nxd4 Ne4 21. Ba6 Rb8 22. Rc1 Ra8 23. Bd3 Qb7 24. Ra1 Bc5 25. Qe2 Bxd4 26. Bxd4 Rfc8 27. Rf1 Nc5 28. f5 exf5 29. Bxf5 Bxf5 30. Rxf5 Qc6 31. Raf1 (depth 45, 0:28:55)
Until it doesn't:

+0.21 8. a3 cxd4 9. Nxd4 Bc5 10. Qd2 O-O 11. Qf2 Nxd4 12. Bxd4 Bxd4 13. Qxd4 Nb8 14. Bd3 Nc6 15. Qe3 f6 16. O-O fxe5 17. fxe5 Rxf1+ 18. Rxf1 Bd7 19. Na4 Qe7 20. Nc5 Be8 21. c4 Nxe5 22. Nxe6 Qxe6 23. Rf5 Nf3+ 24. Rxf3 Qxe3+ 25. Rxe3 dxc4 26. Bxc4+ Bf7 27. Bd3 Rc8 28. Be4 b6 29. Rd3 Bg6 30. Bxg6 hxg6 31. Rd2 Kf7 32. Kf2 Ke6 33. Ke3 g5 34. Re2 Kf5 35. Kd4 Rd8+ 36. Kc4 Rd7 37. a4 Rd1 38. b3 Rb1 39. Kb4 g4 40. g3 g6 41. Kc4 g5 42. b4 Ra1 43. Kd5 Rxa4 44. Re5+ Kf6 45. Re6+ Kf5 46. Rxb6 (depth 56, 1:30:13)
And back to Ne2:

+0.14 8. Ne2 Be7 9. c3 O-O 10. dxc5 Nxc5 11. Ng3 a5 12. Be2 Nd7 13. O-O f6 14. exf6 Nxf6 15. Ne5 Qc7 16. Ng4 Nxg4 17. Bxg4 a4 18. Kh1 Bd6 19. Ne2 Kh8 20. Bg1 Bxf4 21. Bc5 e5 22. Bxc8 Rfxc8 23. Qxd5 Ne7 24. Bxe7 Qxe7 25. Nxf4 exf4 26. Rxf4 Qe2 27. Qxb7 Rab8 28. Qf7 Qxb2 29. Raf1 h6 30. Rxa4 Rxc3 31. h3 Rg3 32. Qf2 Qxf2 33. Rxf2 Rb1+ 34. Kh2 Rg5 35. h4 Rg6 36. Rc2 Kh7 37. Rc3 Ra1 38. a3 Rb1 39. Rg3 h5 40. Ra8 Ra1 41. Rxg6 Kxg6 42. Ra7 Kh6 43. g3 Ra2+ 44. Kh3 (depth 60, 5:25:55)

Stopped here.

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Ovyron
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Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:30 am

Re: interesting correspondence game

Post by Ovyron » Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:58 am

Stockfish+nnue with 1 hour/game time controls might be playing stronger than these corr chess players of 2017 :P

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