Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

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Pafifi
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Full name: Rong Lin

Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by Pafifi » Fri Aug 07, 2020 12:57 am


White to win.
Sting SF instinctively found the solution in a second. No other engines did :D

Alayan
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Re: Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by Alayan » Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:37 am

What's the move ? Lichessfish goes for Nd3 and letting it play itself black goes on to lose, but the moves are not really deep or accurate.

Dann Corbit
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Re: Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by Dann Corbit » Fri Aug 07, 2020 4:28 am

Sting said:
36+ 13:09 9,199,995k 11,647k +3.34 Nxg6 fxg6 Bxg6+ Ke7 Nd3 Qd4 Bxf5 Qxc4+ Kd2 Kf8 e4 Qxa2 g6 Kg8 Bd7 c5 f5 Qe6 fxe6 c4 e7 cxd3 e8Q+
Taking ideas is not a vice, it is a virtue. We have another word for this. It is called learning.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.

peter
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Re: Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by peter » Fri Aug 07, 2020 6:05 am

Pafifi wrote:
Fri Aug 07, 2020 12:57 am

White to win.
Sting SF instinctively found the solution in a second. No other engines did :D
Very fine one!
Whrere did you find it?

4k2q/p4p1B/1pp3pP/2N2pP1/2P2P1N/8/PP2P3/2K5 w - - 0 1

Analysis by Lc0 v0.26.0 (24x320-t60-64000) RTX2080Ti+RTX2080 syzygy:

1.Nd3 Qxh7 2.Ne5 b5 3.c5 a5 4.Nhf3 f6 5.gxf6 Qxh6
= (-0.09) Depth: 7/11 00:00:05 1kN
...
1.Nd3 Qxh7 2.Ne5 Qg8 3.Kd1 Qf8 4.b3 Qd6+ 5.Kc2 Qf8 6.Kd1 a5 7.e3 b5 8.c5 a4 9.Ke2 a3 10.Kf2 b4 11.Kg3 Qh8 12.Nhf3 f6 13.Nxc6 fxg5
= (-0.11) Depth: 15/36 00:00:25 612kN
1.Nxg6 Qxh7 2.Nd7 Qxg6 3.Nf6+ Kd8 4.b4 a6 5.a4 Kc8 6.Kd2 Kd8 7.c5 bxc5 8.bxc5 Ke7 9.a5 Kf8 10.Ke1 Ke7 11.Kd1 Kf8 12.Kd2 Ke7 13.Kc1 Kf8 14.Kc2
= (-0.04) Depth: 15/36 00:00:29 811kN
...
1.Nxg6 Qxh7 2.Nd7 Qxg6 3.Nf6+ Kd8 4.b4 a6 5.a4 Ke7 6.a5 bxa5 7.bxa5 Kf8 8.Kd2 Ke7 9.Ke3 Ke6 10.Kf2 Ke7 11.Ke3 Ke6 12.Kd3 c5 13.Kd2 Ke7 14.Ke1 Kf8 15.Kd2 Ke7 16.Ke1 Kf8 17.Kd2
= (0.12) Depth: 20/48 00:01:45 12166kN, tb=2

Drawish eval maybe comes from 4.b4?, which gives away the win to 4...c5, end of output- line is threefold by 17...Ke7, yet at least LC0 finds the first three key-moves.

Should have let it run longer, but it was a rented engine in chessbase cloud.

And here I have SF NNUE in MulitPV=2 mode started with empty hash:

4k2q/p4p1B/1pp3pP/2N2pP1/2P2P1N/8/PP2P3/2K5 w - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish 040820:

1. +- (4.62): 1.Nxg6 Qd4 2.Nd3 fxg6 3.Bxg6+ Kf8 4.Kd2 Qd7 5.Ke1 b5 6.Ne5 Qd4 7.Bxf5 Qg1+ 8.Kd2 Qh2 9.Ng6+ Kg8 10.cxb5 cxb5 11.Bd3 Qf2 12.Bxb5 Qd4+ 13.Bd3 Qxb2+ 14.Ke3 Qc1+ 15.Kf3 Qh1+ 16.Kg4 Qg1+ 17.Kh5 Qh1+ 18.Nh4 Qd5 19.Kg4 a5 20.g6 Qxa2 21.f5 Qd5 22.f6 Qe6+ 23.Kg5 Qd5+ 24.Nf5 Kh8 25.g7+ Kg8 26.Bc4 Qxc4 27.Ne7+ Kh7 28.g8Q+ Qxg8+ 29.Nxg8
2
. = (0.00): 1.Nd3 Qxh7 2.Ne5 Qg8 3.a3 a5 4.Kd2 Qf8 5.Ke3 b5 6.cxb5 cxb5 7.b4 axb4 8.axb4 Qg8 9.Nhf3 Qh8 10.Kf2 Ke7 11.Nc6+ Ke6 12.Nfe5 Qc8 13.Kg3 Qa8 14.Nd4+ Ke7 15.Ndc6+ Kf8 16.Nd7+ Kg8 17.Nce5 Qb7 18.Nf6+ Kh8 19.Kf2 Qc7 20.Kf3 Qa7 21.Kg2 Qa8+ 22.Kh2 Qb7 23.Kg3 Qe7 24.Kf2 Qf8 25.Kg3 Qe7

At this one try I should have taken a GUI storing time and eval in MultiPV, pity I didn't and Fritz doesn't.
Output is copied in depth 45 after about 3 minutes, Nxg6 ist among the two best lines rather quickly but with 0.00 eval for quite a while.

Net is 1934 SV from 23.7., 24 threads of 12x3GHz, 32G hash.
Peter.

Dicaste
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Re: Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by Dicaste » Fri Aug 07, 2020 8:27 am

Sting with NNUE looks like next thing then :D

Hobacle
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Re: Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by Hobacle » Sun Mar 28, 2021 1:36 pm

This was the 'legacy' of my friend K.
I helped him release this puzzle, and he'd been missing ever since. K's another friend, Pafifi, reprinted it to Talkchess.

Vinvin
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Re: Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by Vinvin » Sun Mar 28, 2021 1:59 pm

Nice one !
0.764 second for Sting-sf-27:

Code: Select all

2021-03-28 15:55:31,832<--1:info depth 10 multipv 1 score cp 222 upperbound nodes 39607 nps 53450 time 741 pv c5b3 h8h7 b3d4 f7f6 g5f6 h7h6 d4c6 h6h4 c6a7 h4f4 c1b1 f4c4 a7c8 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,839<--1:info depth 10 multipv 1 score cp 210 nodes 77886 nps 101945 time 764 pv h4g6 h8d4 c5d3 f7g6 h7g6 e8f8 g6f5 d4c4 c1d2 c4d5 e2e4 d5a2 d2e3 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,854<--1:info depth 11
2021-03-28 15:55:31,855<--1:info depth 11 multipv 1 score cp 202 nodes 99030 nps 127287 time 778 pv h4g6 h8d4 c5d3 f7g6 h7g6 e8f8 g6f5 d4c4 c1d2 c4a2 e2e4 f8g8 g5g6 c6c5 d2e3 a2c4 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,863<--1:info depth 12
2021-03-28 15:55:31,864<--1:info depth 12 multipv 1 score cp 189 upperbound nodes 128398 nps 161710 time 794 pv h4g6 h8d4 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,872<--1:info depth 12 multipv 1 score cp 202 nodes 141896 nps 177148 time 801 pv h4g6 h8d4 c5d3 f7g6 h7g6 e8f8 g6f5 d4c4 c1d2 c4a2 e2e4 f8g8 g5g6 c6c5 d2e3 a2c4 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,880<--1:info depth 13
2021-03-28 15:55:31,881<--1:info depth 13 multipv 1 score cp 202 nodes 182008 nps 221151 time 823 pv h4g6 h8d4 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,889<--1:info depth 14
2021-03-28 15:55:31,889<--1:info depth 14 multipv 1 score cp 193 upperbound nodes 316155 nps 352065 time 898 pv h4g6 h8d4 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,898<--1:info depth 14 multipv 1 score cp 185 upperbound nodes 371516 nps 401205 time 926 pv h4g6 h8d4 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,906<--1:info depth 14 multipv 1 score cp 173 upperbound nodes 419920 nps 441556 time 951 pv h4g6 h8d4 c5d3 f7g6 h7g6 e8f8 g6f5 d4c4 c1d2 c4a2 e2e4 f8g8 g5g6 c6c5 d2e3 a2c4 d3e5 c4b3 e3d2 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,915<--1:info depth 14 multipv 1 score cp 210 lowerbound nodes 465578 nps 477026 time 976 pv h4g6 h8d4 c5d3 f7g6 h7g6 e8f8 g6f5 d4c4 c1d2 c4a2 e2e4 f8g8 g5g6 c6c5 d2c3 a2a5 c3c2 a5a4 b2b3 a4d4 f5e6 g8f8 c2d2 d4e4 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,924<--1:info depth 14 multipv 1 score cp 206 nodes 499848 nps 502865 time 994 pv h4g6 h8d4 c5d3 f7g6 h7g6 e8f8 g6f5 d4c4 c1d2 c4a2 e2e4 f8g8 g5g6 a7a5 d2c3 b6b5 c3d2 a5a4 d2e3 a2b3 e4e5 b3c4 
2021-03-28 15:55:31,932<--1:info depth 15
2021-03-28 15:55:32,074<--1:info depth 15 multipv 1 score cp 197 upperbound nodes 832382 nps 713878 time 1166 pv h4g6 h8h7 
2021-03-28 15:55:32,122<--1:info depth 15 multipv 1 score cp 189 upperbound nodes 930459 nps 767072 time 1213 pv h4g6 h8h7 
2021-03-28 15:55:32,168<--1:info depth 15 multipv 1 score cp 177 upperbound nodes 1033830 nps 821151 time 1259 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 d2e3 c6c5 b2b4 f6g6 b4c5 b6c5 h6h7 g6h7 e3d2 h7g7 d2e3 g7g6 e3d2 g6g7 
2021-03-28 15:55:32,220<--1:info depth 15 multipv 1 score cp 159 upperbound nodes 1141989 nps 871082 time 1311 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 d2e3 c6c5 b2b4 f6g6 b4c5 b6c5 h6h7 g6h7 e3d2 h7g7 d2e3 g7g6 e3d2 g6g7 
2021-03-28 15:55:32,283<--1:info depth 15 multipv 1 score cp 132 upperbound nodes 1274632 nps 927679 time 1374 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 d2e3 c6c5 b2b4 f6g6 b4c5 b6c5 h6h7 g6h7 e3d2 h7g7 d2e3 g7g6 e3d2 g6g7 
2021-03-28 15:55:32,402<--1:info depth 15 multipv 1 score cp 109 nodes 1519657 nps 1017173 time 1494 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 e2e4 f6g6 e4f5 g6h6 d2e3 h6g7 e3e4 g7f6 a2a3 f6e7 e4e5 f7f6 e5d4 e7d6 
2021-03-28 15:55:32,413<--1:info depth 16
2021-03-28 15:55:32,610<--1:info depth 16 multipv 1 score cp 113 nodes 1929103 nps 1146910 time 1682 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 e2e4 f6g6 e4f5 g6h6 d2e3 h6g7 e3e4 g7f6 b2b4 f6e7 e4e5 f7f6 e5d4 e7d6 c4c5 b6c5 b4c5 d6d7 d4e4 d7e7 e4d4 
2021-03-28 15:55:32,622<--1:info depth 17
2021-03-28 15:55:32,786<--1:info depth 17 multipv 1 score cp 113 nodes 2315676 nps 1233711 time 1877 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 e2e4 
2021-03-28 15:55:32,794<--1:info depth 18
2021-03-28 15:55:33,207<--1:info depth 18 multipv 1 score cp 113 nodes 3192448 nps 1389228 time 2298 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 e2e4 f6g6 e4f5 g6h6 d2e3 h6g7 e3e4 g7f6 b2b4 f6e7 e4e5 f7f6 e5d4 e7d6 c4c5 b6c5 b4c5 d6d7 d4e4 d7e7 e4e3 e7d7 e3d4 d7e7 d4e4 
2021-03-28 15:55:33,215<--1:info depth 19
2021-03-28 15:55:33,839<--1:info depth 19 multipv 1 score cp 113 nodes 4513602 nps 1540478 time 2930 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 e2e4 f6g6 e4f5 g6h6 d2e3 h6g7 e3e4 g7f6 b2b4 f6e7 
2021-03-28 15:55:33,847<--1:info depth 20
2021-03-28 15:55:33,970<--1:info depth 20 multipv 1 score cp 121 lowerbound nodes 4811355 nps 1571824 time 3061 pv h4g6 
2021-03-28 15:55:33,980<--1:info currmove h4g6 currmovenumber 1
2021-03-28 15:55:34,019<--1:info depth 20 multipv 1 score cp 129 lowerbound nodes 4911450 nps 1578736 time 3111 pv h4g6 
2021-03-28 15:55:34,028<--1:info currmove h4g6 currmovenumber 1
2021-03-28 15:55:34,045<--1:info currmove c5b3 currmovenumber 2
2021-03-28 15:55:34,054<--1:info currmove e2e3 currmovenumber 3
2021-03-28 15:55:34,069<--1:info currmove h7g8 currmovenumber 4
2021-03-28 15:55:34,084<--1:info currmove c5d3 currmovenumber 5
2021-03-28 15:55:34,230<--1:info currmove c1c2 currmovenumber 6
2021-03-28 15:55:34,236<--1:info currmove c5d7 currmovenumber 7
2021-03-28 15:55:34,244<--1:info currmove b2b4 currmovenumber 8
2021-03-28 15:55:34,244<--1:info currmove c1d2 currmovenumber 9
2021-03-28 15:55:34,245<--1:info currmove e2e4 currmovenumber 10
2021-03-28 15:55:34,252<--1:info currmove c1d1 currmovenumber 11
2021-03-28 15:55:34,259<--1:info currmove a2a4 currmovenumber 12
2021-03-28 15:55:34,262<--1:info currmove c1b1 currmovenumber 13
2021-03-28 15:55:34,276<--1:info currmove a2a3 currmovenumber 14
2021-03-28 15:55:34,281<--1:info currmove h4f3 currmovenumber 15
2021-03-28 15:55:34,283<--1:info currmove c5e6 currmovenumber 16
2021-03-28 15:55:34,289<--1:info currmove c5e4 currmovenumber 17
2021-03-28 15:55:34,290<--1:info currmove c5a6 currmovenumber 18
2021-03-28 15:55:34,293<--1:info currmove b2b3 currmovenumber 19
2021-03-28 15:55:34,293<--1:info currmove c5b7 currmovenumber 20
2021-03-28 15:55:34,327<--1:info currmove c5a4 currmovenumber 21
2021-03-28 15:55:34,327<--1:info currmove h4g2 currmovenumber 22
2021-03-28 15:55:34,327<--1:info currmove h4f5 currmovenumber 23
2021-03-28 15:55:34,345<--1:info currmove h7g6 currmovenumber 24
2021-03-28 15:55:34,400<--1:info depth 20 multipv 1 score cp 125 nodes 5683886 nps 1627687 time 3492 pv h4g6 h8h7 c5d7 h7g6 d7f6 e8e7 c1d2 g6f6 g5f6 e7f6 c4c5 b6b5 e2e4 f6g6 e4f5 g6h6 d2e3 h6g7 e3e4 g7f6 b2b4 f6e7 e4e5 f7f6 e5e4 e7d7 e4d4 d7e7 a2a3 

Jouni
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Re: Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by Jouni » Sun Mar 28, 2021 4:51 pm

Easy for Lc0 in GTX card. It don't consider other moves at all!

Analysis by Lc0 v0.27.0 94-130

1.Nxg6 Qxh7 2.Nd7 Qxg6 3.Nf6+ Kf8 4.b4 Ke7 5.Kd2 Kd6
= (0.30) Depth: 7/11 00:00:03 0kN
...
1.Nxg6 Qxh7 2.Nd7 Qxg6 3.Nf6+ Kd8 4.b4 Kc8 5.b5 Kb7 6.Kd2 cxb5 7.cxb5 Kb8 8.Ke3 Kb7 9.Kd4 a6 10.a4 axb5 11.axb5
+/- (0.84) Depth: 13/24 00:00:25 44kN

Three best moves:

1. +/- (0.80): 1.Nxg6 Qxh7 2.Nd7 Qxg6 3.Nf6+ Kd8 4.b4 Kc8 5.Kc2 Kb7 6.b5 cxb5 7.cxb5 a6 8.a4 axb5 9.axb5 Ka8 10.Kc3 Ka7 11.Kd4 Kb7 12.Kd5 Kc7 13.h7 Qg7 14.Ne8+ Kd7 15.Nxg7 Kc7
2. = (0.09): 1.Nd3 Qxh7 2.Ne5 Qh8 3.Kc2 Qf8 4.Nhf3 b5 5.b3 bxc4 6.Nxc4 f6
3. -/+ (-0.71): 1.Bxg6 bxc5 2.e3 fxg6 3.Nxg6 Qh7 4.Ne5 Kf8 5.Kc2 Kg8 6.a3 a6 7.Kc1 a5

Many times Lc0 shows wanted move very fast, but don't display correct line.
Jouni

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MikeB
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Re: Nomination to hard-talkchess (2)

Post by MikeB » Sun Mar 28, 2021 6:17 pm

Bluefish NNUE evaluation using C:\cluster.mfb\Popcnt-LP\eval\nn-1f660bd3107c.nnue enabled Download nn-1f660bd3107c.nnue
Tried other combinations with Honey engines and various nnue, nothing else was as fast.

42 +2.41! 17.2G 2:26.42 Nxg6!
42 +2.25! 14.4G 2:03.77 Nxg6!
42 +2.13! 13.9G 1:59.97 Nxg6!
42 +2.04! 13.5G 1:56.24 Nxg6!
41 110 seconds
41 100 seconds
41 90 seconds
41 80 seconds
41 70 seconds
41 60 seconds
41 50 seconds
41 40 seconds
41 30 seconds
41 +1.96 9.43G 1:23.05 Nxg6 Qxh7 Nd7 Qxg6 Nf6+ Kf8 Kc2 Ke7 c5 Kd8 cxb6 axb6 Kd3 Kc8 Kd4 Kc7 Ke5 c5 Kd5 Kb7 Kd6 c4 Ke7 b5 Kf8 b4 h7 Qxh7 Nxh7 c3 bxc3 bxc3 Kxf7 c2 g6 c1=Q g7 Qxf4 g8=Q Qc4+ Kg7 Qg4+ Kh8 Qxe2 Ng5 Qf1 Qf7+ Kc6 Qe8+ Kc5 Kg7 Kc4 Qe5
41 +1.86! 5.50G 0:50.96 Nxg6!
41 +1.37! 4.27G 0:41.19 Nxg6!
41 +1.00! 3.55G 0:35.47 Nxg6!
41 +0.71! 2.75G 0:29.42 Nxg6!
41 +0.48! 2.36G 0:26.22 Nxg6!
41 +0.32! 2.27G 0:25.41 Nxg6!
41 +0.20! 2.21G 0:24.83 Nxg6!
41 +0.12! 2.19G 0:24.66 Nxg6!
41 +0.06! 2.13G 0:24.03 Nxg6!
40 20 seconds
40 0.00 1.37G 0:15.53 Nd3 Qxh7 Ne5 Qh8 Kd1 a6 a3 a5 Kc2 Qg8 Nhf3 a4 Nh4 Qh8 Kd2 c5 Kd3 Qf8 Kc2 Qh8
Image

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