After 50 moves it looks like one more 1:1 pair:CMCanavessi wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 3:58 pmLeela leading now after an amazing game 33. Check it out if you can, it was really cool. Reverse is playing right now.
Ongoing:
87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
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Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
Ongoing:
Peter.
Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
Yes I did a quick test to mickmick yours I found here: viewtopic.php?t=74239&start=10#p848375Laskos wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:19 pmSo, you tackled too the issue with possible bad scaling of SV 3010 and later nets, right? Interesting, if J-92 nets scale well indeed as you found out, this Sufi might look different from expected. I might check too the scaling of J92-190 versus SV 3972mlh used in Season 18.
I just dig it up from my computer. The results are a bit different from those I had in memory, but close enough I think!
I did the tests before J92-190 was selected for SuFi (J92-210 and J92-220 were the other nets considered).
On a rtx 2060 at 10s + 0.1s: (I can't remember the opening set. Maybe past TCEC).
Code: Select all
# PLAYER : RATING ERROR PLAYED (%) CFS W D L D(%)
1 J92-220 : 50.2 15.6 400 56.5 75 110 232 58 58.0
2 J92-210 : 40.1 15.0 500 55.2 100 119 314 67 62.8
3 T60-3010 : 0.0 9.3 900 44.2 --- 125 546 229 60.7
White advantage = 106.74 +/- 6.89
Draw rate (equal opponents) = 71.17 % +/- 1.82Code: Select all
# PLAYER : RATING ERROR PLAYED (%) CFS W D L D(%)
1 J92-210 : 32.9 10.7 240 54.6 100 39 184 17 76.7
2 T60-3010 : 0.0 10.7 240 45.4 --- 17 184 39 76.7
White advantage = 50.42 +/- 11.32
Draw rate (equal opponents) = 82.04 % +/- 2.60-
Nay Lin Tun
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Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
Still tied after 42 games. It is very likely that these two engines are within +/- 50 elo, most likely +/- 20 elo.
Thus being said, NNUE +100 elo hype was wrong against Leela.
In case, they are not equal in strength,
1. Is SF +50 elo better than Leela or
2. Is Leela + 50 elo better than SF?
Thus being said, NNUE +100 elo hype was wrong against Leela.
In case, they are not equal in strength,
1. Is SF +50 elo better than Leela or
2. Is Leela + 50 elo better than SF?
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Dann Corbit
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Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
Moving target.
They changed the Leela ratio for the this contest.
Nobody can say what the right ratio is anyway,
For that matter, both engines are moving targets.
They changed the Leela ratio for the this contest.
Nobody can say what the right ratio is anyway,
For that matter, both engines are moving targets.
Taking ideas is not a vice, it is a virtue. We have another word for this. It is called learning.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.
Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
Who says ?
Isn't the hardware the same as for TCEC 18 ?
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Dann Corbit
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Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
I stand corrected.
I just checked and the hardware and time control is identical.
Not sure where I got the impression that something was changed.
I just checked and the hardware and time control is identical.
Not sure where I got the impression that something was changed.
Taking ideas is not a vice, it is a virtue. We have another word for this. It is called learning.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.
Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
Still, I wonder (and of course I am not the only one...) why Lc0 is "resisting" so well against SF NNUE in Sufi 19.
As if the NNUE improvement almost did not help under the current playing conditions. Or...?
As if the NNUE improvement almost did not help under the current playing conditions. Or...?
Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
That is because testing has shown SF NNUE is not much stronger then Lc0. At long time controls. The confusion comes from only looking or testing at STC results. And assuming that result also applies to LTC games.
"The worst thing that can happen to a forum is a running wild attacking moderator(HGM) who is not corrected by the community." - Ed Schröder
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.
Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.
The Lc0 binaries are significantly faster now (+40%?). Also, the score now is back to almost regular: 3:1 =25 pairwise, with very high pairwise draw ratio. Maybe this pairwise draw rate is one of the reasons Elo difference seems small.