87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

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mwyoung
Posts: 2727
Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 8:00 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by mwyoung » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:06 am

Milos wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:49 pm
mwyoung wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 6:04 pm
I do not want TCEC to change any rules. But some people need to understand the RULES.

Garbage openings, garbage results.

Testing conditions matter!
Garbage openings only for garbage engines. And enormous pain for fanboys of a given garbage engine :lol: :lol: :lol:.
I am not a fanboy of anybody. But the results are the results. I was the first one to show that Stockfish was better then Houdini, and other engines on this forum. And got the same response as you today! :lol: Houdini a proven inferior clone of Stockfish, and better then all the rest of the engines. Including Komodo before anyone even paid attention to Stockfish. Guess who's results were correct!

You are a joke....
Last edited by mwyoung on Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
"The worst thing that can happen to a forum is a running wild attacking moderator(HGM) who is not corrected by the community." - Ed Schröder
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.

Milos
Posts: 4018
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:47 am

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by Milos » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:09 am

mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:06 am
Milos wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:49 pm
mwyoung wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 6:04 pm
I do not want TCEC to change any rules. But some people need to understand the RULES.

Garbage openings, garbage results.

Testing conditions matter!
Garbage openings only for garbage engines. And enormous pain for fanboys of a given garbage engine :lol: :lol: :lol:.
I am not a fanboy of anybody. But the results are the results. I was the first one to show the Stockfish was better then Houdini, and other engines on this forum. And got the same response as you today! :lol: Houdini a proven inferior clone of Stockfish, and better the all the rest of the engines. Including Komodo before anyone even paid attention to Stockfish. Guess who's results were correct!
To be fair you are actually a fanboy of garbage testing, i.e. let engines play from a starting position only. ;)

mwyoung
Posts: 2727
Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 8:00 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by mwyoung » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:12 am

Milos wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:09 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:06 am
Milos wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:49 pm
mwyoung wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 6:04 pm
I do not want TCEC to change any rules. But some people need to understand the RULES.

Garbage openings, garbage results.

Testing conditions matter!
Garbage openings only for garbage engines. And enormous pain for fanboys of a given garbage engine :lol: :lol: :lol:.
I am not a fanboy of anybody. But the results are the results. I was the first one to show the Stockfish was better then Houdini, and other engines on this forum. And got the same response as you today! :lol: Houdini a proven inferior clone of Stockfish, and better the all the rest of the engines. Including Komodo before anyone even paid attention to Stockfish. Guess who's results were correct!
To be fair you are actually a fanboy of garbage testing, i.e. let engines play from a starting position only. ;)
I know, since you could not argue with me record. As being a fanboy. Your projection is obvious! :lol:

[moderation] Please refrain from name calling.

I said "Really, then why does TCEC need bias openings? Lc0 was taught to play chess for this unbias position. :shock:
That we all know and love!"

"The worst thing that can happen to a forum is a running wild attacking moderator(HGM) who is not corrected by the community." - Ed Schröder
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.

maac
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:13 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by maac » Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:15 am

mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:12 am

I said "Really, then why does TCEC need bias openings? Lc0 was taught to play chess for this unbias position. :shock:
That we all know and love!"
Not at all.First, rule thumb, never say (anyone, not personal) "always" or "all",
second, "biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis.

Overall, to all: why simply doesn't recognize the greatness of SF (and LC0 btw) ? :D :wink:

mwyoung
Posts: 2727
Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 8:00 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by mwyoung » Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:35 am

maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:15 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:12 am

I said "Really, then why does TCEC need bias openings? Lc0 was taught to play chess for this unbias position. :shock:
That we all know and love!"
Not at all.First, rule thumb, never say (anyone, not personal) "always" or "all",
second, "biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis.

Overall, to all: why simply doesn't recognize the greatness of SF (and LC0 btw) ? :D :wink:
We are not talking about a weak player like you. Who is playing a weak opening to win against a weak player.
That is total B.S.

What are you talking about. Then yes when using garbage openings then use Stockfish. Then I highly recommend Stockfish. That is why I voted for Stockfish winning TCEC.

"as a stubborn Scandi player"-----EXACTLY!!!!

Use what ever engine that works, both engines are the best. But that is not the point of proper engine testing. And you clearly don't force inferior openings on a player, that does not play for example the Scandi, because they know it sucks.

And I did notice you did not give the position that Stockfish saved your position. What was the position, and what was Lc0 score. +1 after many hours of search, but you found a refutation with only Stockfish.

And why would you even bother to keep playing such a line to find only a way to draw that you thought was a clear loss. That is what you get from the starting position. I know "a stubborn Scandi player".
"The worst thing that can happen to a forum is a running wild attacking moderator(HGM) who is not corrected by the community." - Ed Schröder
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.

maac
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:13 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by maac » Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:14 am

mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:35 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:15 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:12 am

I said "Really, then why does TCEC need bias openings? Lc0 was taught to play chess for this unbias position. :shock:
That we all know and love!"
Not at all.First, rule thumb, never say (anyone, not personal) "always" or "all",
second, "biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis.

Overall, to all: why simply doesn't recognize the greatness of SF (and LC0 btw) ? :D :wink:
We are not talking about a weak player like you. Who is playing a weak opening to win against a weak player.
That is total B.S.

What are you talking about. Then yes when using garbage openings then use Stockfish. Then I highly recommend Stockfish. That is why I voted for Stockfish winning TCEC.

"as a stubborn Scandi player"-----EXACTLY!!!!

Use what ever engine that works, both engines are the best. But that is not the point of proper engine testing. And you clearly don't force inferior openings on a player, that does not play for example the Scandi, because they know it sucks.

And I did notice you did not give the position that Stockfish saved your position. What was the position, and what was Lc0 score. +1 after many hours of search, but you found a refutation with only Stockfish.

Why would you even bother to keep playing such line to find only a way to draw that you thought was a clear loss. That is what you get from the starting position. I know "a stubborn Scandi player".
Ok, first B01 doesnt suck! By incredible that it sounds, and i know i am against rhe stream,
but there are some myths in chess still, the lines that i found equalzed are
1) white plays 5. Ne5 Cbd7 6.f4 g6 6.7. Bc4 e6 8. a4 and
2) 5. Ne5 Be6 6. Af4 Qd8 7. Qd2 both in the 3. ...Qd6 scandinavian.

But it isn't the point and you would be know, the point is 'perfect" openings with about +- 0.20
are less common that those with say us +0.50 after the opening,in that sense TCEC is very well
designed.
And, bias or not bias, the conditions are the same (duh) for both engines, so, if engine
B is not enough trained in that openings (hypothesis..) that engine A, the fault of who is!?

mwyoung
Posts: 2727
Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 8:00 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by mwyoung » Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:24 am

maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:14 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:35 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:15 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:12 am

I said "Really, then why does TCEC need bias openings? Lc0 was taught to play chess for this unbias position. :shock:
That we all know and love!"
Not at all.First, rule thumb, never say (anyone, not personal) "always" or "all",
second, "biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis.

Overall, to all: why simply doesn't recognize the greatness of SF (and LC0 btw) ? :D :wink:
We are not talking about a weak player like you. Who is playing a weak opening to win against a weak player.
That is total B.S.

What are you talking about. Then yes when using garbage openings then use Stockfish. Then I highly recommend Stockfish. That is why I voted for Stockfish winning TCEC.

"as a stubborn Scandi player"-----EXACTLY!!!!

Use what ever engine that works, both engines are the best. But that is not the point of proper engine testing. And you clearly don't force inferior openings on a player, that does not play for example the Scandi, because they know it sucks.

And I did notice you did not give the position that Stockfish saved your position. What was the position, and what was Lc0 score. +1 after many hours of search, but you found a refutation with only Stockfish.

Why would you even bother to keep playing such line to find only a way to draw that you thought was a clear loss. That is what you get from the starting position. I know "a stubborn Scandi player".
Ok, first B01 doesnt suck! By incredible that it sounds, and i know i am against rhe stream,
but there are some myths in chess still, the lines that i found equalzed are
1) white plays 5. Ne5 Cbd7 6.f4 g6 6.7. Bc4 e6 8. a4 and
2) 5. Ne5 Be6 6. Af4 Qd8 7. Qd2 both in the 3. ...Qd6 scandinavian.

But it isn't the point and you would be know, the point is 'perfect" openings with about +- 0.20
are less common that those with say us +0.50 after the opening,in that sense TCEC is very well
designed.
And, bias or not bias, the conditions are the same (duh) for both engines, so, if engine
B is not enough trained in that openings (hypothesis..) that engine A, the fault of who is!?
Words mean things, and that was your point.

"biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis."

And clearly not at todays engine level. Or the top GM level +1 evaluations. :lol:

You claimed +1

Give the position!
"The worst thing that can happen to a forum is a running wild attacking moderator(HGM) who is not corrected by the community." - Ed Schröder
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.

maac
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:13 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by maac » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:35 am

mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:24 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:14 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:35 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:15 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:12 am

I said "Really, then why does TCEC need bias openings? Lc0 was taught to play chess for this unbias position. :shock:
That we all know and love!"
Not at all.First, rule thumb, never say (anyone, not personal) "always" or "all",
second, "biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis.

Overall, to all: why simply doesn't recognize the greatness of SF (and LC0 btw) ? :D :wink:
We are not talking about a weak player like you. Who is playing a weak opening to win against a weak player.
That is total B.S.

What are you talking about. Then yes when using garbage openings then use Stockfish. Then I highly recommend Stockfish. That is why I voted for Stockfish winning TCEC.

"as a stubborn Scandi player"-----EXACTLY!!!!

Use what ever engine that works, both engines are the best. But that is not the point of proper engine testing. And you clearly don't force inferior openings on a player, that does not play for example the Scandi, because they know it sucks.

And I did notice you did not give the position that Stockfish saved your position. What was the position, and what was Lc0 score. +1 after many hours of search, but you found a refutation with only Stockfish.

Why would you even bother to keep playing such line to find only a way to draw that you thought was a clear loss. That is what you get from the starting position. I know "a stubborn Scandi player".
Ok, first B01 doesnt suck! By incredible that it sounds, and i know i am against rhe stream,
but there are some myths in chess still, the lines that i found equalzed are
1) white plays 5. Ne5 Cbd7 6.f4 g6 6.7. Bc4 e6 8. a4 and
2) 5. Ne5 Be6 6. Af4 Qd8 7. Qd2 both in the 3. ...Qd6 scandinavian.

But it isn't the point and you would be know, the point is 'perfect" openings with about +- 0.20
are less common that those with say us +0.50 after the opening,in that sense TCEC is very well
designed.
And, bias or not bias, the conditions are the same (duh) for both engines, so, if engine
B is not enough trained in that openings (hypothesis..) that engine A, the fault of who is!?
Words mean things, and that was your point.

"biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis."

And clearly not at todays engine level. Or the top GM level +1 evaluations. :lol:

You claimed +1

Give the position!


In that position CFish 230920 evaluate +1.06 @D31, well i repaired that.

In my previous post i made clear the point: if LC0 is "not enough trained" in certain plausible
openings, the fault is his.

mwyoung
Posts: 2727
Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 8:00 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by mwyoung » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:15 am

maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:35 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:24 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:14 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:35 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:15 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:12 am

I said "Really, then why does TCEC need bias openings? Lc0 was taught to play chess for this unbias position. :shock:
That we all know and love!"
Not at all.First, rule thumb, never say (anyone, not personal) "always" or "all",
second, "biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis.

Overall, to all: why simply doesn't recognize the greatness of SF (and LC0 btw) ? :D :wink:
We are not talking about a weak player like you. Who is playing a weak opening to win against a weak player.
That is total B.S.

What are you talking about. Then yes when using garbage openings then use Stockfish. Then I highly recommend Stockfish. That is why I voted for Stockfish winning TCEC.

"as a stubborn Scandi player"-----EXACTLY!!!!

Use what ever engine that works, both engines are the best. But that is not the point of proper engine testing. And you clearly don't force inferior openings on a player, that does not play for example the Scandi, because they know it sucks.

And I did notice you did not give the position that Stockfish saved your position. What was the position, and what was Lc0 score. +1 after many hours of search, but you found a refutation with only Stockfish.

Why would you even bother to keep playing such line to find only a way to draw that you thought was a clear loss. That is what you get from the starting position. I know "a stubborn Scandi player".
Ok, first B01 doesnt suck! By incredible that it sounds, and i know i am against rhe stream,
but there are some myths in chess still, the lines that i found equalzed are
1) white plays 5. Ne5 Cbd7 6.f4 g6 6.7. Bc4 e6 8. a4 and
2) 5. Ne5 Be6 6. Af4 Qd8 7. Qd2 both in the 3. ...Qd6 scandinavian.

But it isn't the point and you would be know, the point is 'perfect" openings with about +- 0.20
are less common that those with say us +0.50 after the opening,in that sense TCEC is very well
designed.
And, bias or not bias, the conditions are the same (duh) for both engines, so, if engine
B is not enough trained in that openings (hypothesis..) that engine A, the fault of who is!?
Words mean things, and that was your point.

"biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis."

And clearly not at todays engine level. Or the top GM level +1 evaluations. :lol:

You claimed +1

Give the position!


In that position CFish 230920 evaluate +1.06 @D31, well i repaired that.

In my previous post i made clear the point: if LC0 is "not enough trained" in certain plausible
openings, the fault is his.


You are so full of B.S. Neither engine Lc0, or SF would play your crappy 9..Qc7??

New game Line
r1b1kb1r/pp1n1p1p/2pqpnp1/4N3/P1BP1P2/2N5/1PP3PP/R1BQK2R b KQkq - 0 1

Analysis by Lc0 v0.26.3:

9...Bg7 10.b3 0-0 11.Ba3 c5 12.dxc5 Qxd1+ 13.Rxd1 Nxe5 14.fxe5 Ng4 15.Ne4 Ne3 16.Bb2 Nxd1 17.Kxd1 Bd7 18.Bb5 Rfd8 19.Ke2 b6 20.c4 bxc5 21.Nxc5 Bc8 22.Rd1 Rxd1 23.Kxd1 Bf8 24.Bc6 Rb8 25.Bd4 Bxc5 26.Bxc5 Rxb3 27.Kc2 Rb7 28.Bxb7 Bxb7 29.g4 a5 30.g5 Bc6 31.Kb3 Bf3 32.Kc3 Bd1 33.Kd4 Bxa4 34.Be7 Bd1 35.Kd3 Bf3 36.h4 Kg7 37.Kd4 Be2 38.Kc3 h6 39.Kb3
White is slightly better: +/= (0.35) Depth: 34/68 00:04:42 5254kN
(, 13.10.2020)

New game Line
r1b1kb1r/pp1n1p1p/2pqpnp1/4N3/P1BP1P2/2N5/1PP3PP/R1BQK2R b KQkq - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish 051020:

9...Bg7 10.0-0 0-0 11.b3 Qc7 12.a5 b5 13.axb6 Nxb6 14.Qf3 Bb7 15.Ba6 Bxa6 16.Rxa6 Rfd8 17.Na4 Nfd5 18.Ba3 Nxa4 19.Rxa4 Nb6 20.Ra6 Rxd4 21.Nxc6 Rd7 22.c4 Qb7 23.Ra5 Rc7 24.Ne5 Rd8 25.h3 Qxf3 26.Rxf3 Nc8 27.Rc5 Bxe5 28.fxe5 Rcd7 29.Rc6 Ne7 30.Bxe7 Rxe7 31.Rd6 Rb8 32.c5 Rc7 33.c6 Rb5 34.Rc3 Rxe5
White is slightly better: +/= (0.50 ++) Depth: 45/51 00:04:46 6435MN, tb=1175
(, 13.10.2020)

A crappy opening with at even crappier move. What was your point again? If 9..Qc7 is your best move. No wonder your a stubborn Scandi player. :lol:
"The worst thing that can happen to a forum is a running wild attacking moderator(HGM) who is not corrected by the community." - Ed Schröder
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.

maac
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:13 pm

Re: 87% of the poll voted that SF will win Tcec Sufi 19.

Post by maac » Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:15 am

mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:15 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:35 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:24 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:14 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:35 am
maac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:15 am
mwyoung wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:12 am

I said "Really, then why does TCEC need bias openings? Lc0 was taught to play chess for this unbias position. :shock:
That we all know and love!"
Not at all.First, rule thumb, never say (anyone, not personal) "always" or "all",
second, "biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis.

Overall, to all: why simply doesn't recognize the greatness of SF (and LC0 btw) ? :D :wink:
We are not talking about a weak player like you. Who is playing a weak opening to win against a weak player.
That is total B.S.

What are you talking about. Then yes when using garbage openings then use Stockfish. Then I highly recommend Stockfish. That is why I voted for Stockfish winning TCEC.

"as a stubborn Scandi player"-----EXACTLY!!!!

Use what ever engine that works, both engines are the best. But that is not the point of proper engine testing. And you clearly don't force inferior openings on a player, that does not play for example the Scandi, because they know it sucks.

And I did notice you did not give the position that Stockfish saved your position. What was the position, and what was Lc0 score. +1 after many hours of search, but you found a refutation with only Stockfish.

Why would you even bother to keep playing such line to find only a way to draw that you thought was a clear loss. That is what you get from the starting position. I know "a stubborn Scandi player".
Ok, first B01 doesnt suck! By incredible that it sounds, and i know i am against rhe stream,
but there are some myths in chess still, the lines that i found equalzed are
1) white plays 5. Ne5 Cbd7 6.f4 g6 6.7. Bc4 e6 8. a4 and
2) 5. Ne5 Be6 6. Af4 Qd8 7. Qd2 both in the 3. ...Qd6 scandinavian.

But it isn't the point and you would be know, the point is 'perfect" openings with about +- 0.20
are less common that those with say us +0.50 after the opening,in that sense TCEC is very well
designed.
And, bias or not bias, the conditions are the same (duh) for both engines, so, if engine
B is not enough trained in that openings (hypothesis..) that engine A, the fault of who is!?
Words mean things, and that was your point.

"biased" positions are the bread and butter of chess any day, so, one of the
main functions of engines is the eval of such positions, case in point, as a stubborn
Scandi player i have studied certain positions where the score after opening is in
the vicinity of +1.0 for white, guess what, thanks to latest SF i have found the
refutations after many hours of (cyclic) analysis."

And clearly not at todays engine level. Or the top GM level +1 evaluations. :lol:

You claimed +1

Give the position!


In that position CFish 230920 evaluate +1.06 @D31, well i repaired that.

In my previous post i made clear the point: if LC0 is "not enough trained" in certain plausible
openings, the fault is his.


You are so full of B.S. Neither engine Lc0, or SF would play your crappy 9..Qc7??

New game Line
r1b1kb1r/pp1n1p1p/2pqpnp1/4N3/P1BP1P2/2N5/1PP3PP/R1BQK2R b KQkq - 0 1

Analysis by Lc0 v0.26.3:

9...Bg7 10.b3 0-0 11.Ba3 c5 12.dxc5 Qxd1+ 13.Rxd1 Nxe5 14.fxe5 Ng4 15.Ne4 Ne3 16.Bb2 Nxd1 17.Kxd1 Bd7 18.Bb5 Rfd8 19.Ke2 b6 20.c4 bxc5 21.Nxc5 Bc8 22.Rd1 Rxd1 23.Kxd1 Bf8 24.Bc6 Rb8 25.Bd4 Bxc5 26.Bxc5 Rxb3 27.Kc2 Rb7 28.Bxb7 Bxb7 29.g4 a5 30.g5 Bc6 31.Kb3 Bf3 32.Kc3 Bd1 33.Kd4 Bxa4 34.Be7 Bd1 35.Kd3 Bf3 36.h4 Kg7 37.Kd4 Be2 38.Kc3 h6 39.Kb3
White is slightly better: +/= (0.35) Depth: 34/68 00:04:42 5254kN
(, 13.10.2020)

New game Line
r1b1kb1r/pp1n1p1p/2pqpnp1/4N3/P1BP1P2/2N5/1PP3PP/R1BQK2R b KQkq - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish 051020:

9...Bg7 10.0-0 0-0 11.b3 Qc7 12.a5 b5 13.axb6 Nxb6 14.Qf3 Bb7 15.Ba6 Bxa6 16.Rxa6 Rfd8 17.Na4 Nfd5 18.Ba3 Nxa4 19.Rxa4 Nb6 20.Ra6 Rxd4 21.Nxc6 Rd7 22.c4 Qb7 23.Ra5 Rc7 24.Ne5 Rd8 25.h3 Qxf3 26.Rxf3 Nc8 27.Rc5 Bxe5 28.fxe5 Rcd7 29.Rc6 Ne7 30.Bxe7 Rxe7 31.Rd6 Rb8 32.c5 Rc7 33.c6 Rb5 34.Rc3 Rxe5
White is slightly better: +/= (0.50 ++) Depth: 45/51 00:04:46 6435MN, tb=1175
(, 13.10.2020)

A crappy opening with at even crappier move. What was your point again? If 9..Qc7 is your best move. No wonder your a stubborn Scandi player. :lol:
Qc7 is the best move only if white doesnt respond with Qe2; as club player, is very
probable an human exactly play it; anyway, why insist you with your "crappy" words
when, as your analysis show, it doesnt gives more of 0.5, pretty standard for any opening?

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