A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense played on LiChess. In this game we had an early exchange of queens out of the opening. On move 13 Leela Gambits away it's b-pawn for some active piece play and long term positional pressure. The time control for this game was 5'3 blitz.
Bot NeuralAbyss: LC0 J96-44
Bot ChessHyperbot: Stockfish 12
A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
Moderators: hgm, Dann Corbit, Harvey Williamson
Forum rules
This textbox is used to restore diagrams posted with the [d] tag before the upgrade.
This textbox is used to restore diagrams posted with the [d] tag before the upgrade.
A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
"Good decisions come from experience, and experience comes from bad decisions."
__________________________________________________________________
Ted Summers
__________________________________________________________________
Ted Summers
Re: A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
Latest Stockfish devs are much stronger than Stockfish 12.... 
Re: A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
Are these not a dime a dozen?
I mean, a real win would be from the BLACK side of the Benoni.
I mean, a real win would be from the BLACK side of the Benoni.
Re: A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
The following diagram comes from a game where Black does win convincingly from the Black side of a Benoni, against a worthy opponent (let's say stronger than the current human World Champ).
[d]1r1qn1k1/1r1n1p1p/p2p2p1/2pP2P1/3bP3/2N5/RPQBBP1P/5RK1 b - - 0 22
Try to figure out the best move without engine assistance, then you'll appreciate the game below even better.
[d]1r1qn1k1/1r1n1p1p/p2p2p1/2pP2P1/3bP3/2N5/RPQBBP1P/5RK1 b - - 0 22
Try to figure out the best move without engine assistance, then you'll appreciate the game below even better.
Re: A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
But if SF or even Lela won with Back against the other...THAT would be of note. We never see those...because it's strategically a dubious opening. Tcarldaman wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 7:58 amThe following diagram comes from a game where Black does win convincingly from the Black side of a Benoni, against a worthy opponent (let's say stronger than the current human World Champ).
[d]1r1qn1k1/1r1n1p1p/p2p2p1/2pP2P1/3bP3/2N5/RPQBBP1P/5RK1 b - - 0 22
Try to figure out the best move without engine assistance, then you'll appreciate the game below even better.
Re: A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
Right, I myself don't play the Benoni for that same reason, but it still appeals to certain human players who like murky positions that are ripe for counter-attacks. Since people still make mistakes, that gives the Benoni players potential practical chances, especially when needing a 'must' win with Black.
This game can serve as an illustration of Black's hidden potential, *IF* White mishandles the opening. Yes, I know, White wasn't a human, but another engine, a tough opponent, nonetheless - even surpassing the strongest humans in strength.
PS. Games between two top engines that hardly ever go wrong don't really appeal to me.
Re: A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
One problem is that...one can't order up 'murky' on demand if White is half-way sensible.carldaman wrote: ↑Sat Dec 19, 2020 2:14 amRight, I myself don't play the Benoni for that same reason, but it still appeals to certain human players who like murky positions that are ripe for counter-attacks. Since people still make mistakes, that gives the Benoni players potential practical chances, especially when needing a 'must' win with Black.
This game can serve as an illustration of Black's hidden potential, *IF* White mishandles the opening. Yes, I know, White wasn't a human, but another engine, a tough opponent, nonetheless - even surpassing the strongest humans in strength.
PS. Games between two top engines that hardly ever go wrong don't really appeal to me.
The Benoni was the only thing in my playbook at one time. A few years back, I had black in the last round of the State Championship, needing only a draw (due to tie-breaks) against a 2350 I had beaten in a recent tourney (with a Benoni...) and he was ready this time. It wasn't pretty...when the slightest thing 'goes wrong' in the Benoni, it is likely to not end pretty for Black.
I ran a bunch of my older games thru an older Komodo recently and was particularly depressed by that game...
"Son of Sorrow" I think was the sub-title or somesuch of a Book on the Benoni at one time...rightly so. Even Tal had to give it up and that was 'pre-computer'.
Re: A nice Leela win over Stockfish 12 in the Benoni Defense
Yeah, 'Son of Sorrow' is about right. I remember a friend of mine of master strength was a regular Benoni fanatic, but had his hands full with it whenever facing stronger opposition. It still has its fans among masters, though.
I still believe it could work as a surprise weapon, and maybe just in must-win situations. The 2350 types can't know you're a habitual Benoni customer, or you'll be toast. You'll also have to feel like you know and understand it better than those opponents before deploying it.
I hope a game like the one I posted can alleviate some of the Benoni sorrow and reinject some confidence into adopting it, at least for a while.
I still believe it could work as a surprise weapon, and maybe just in must-win situations. The 2350 types can't know you're a habitual Benoni customer, or you'll be toast. You'll also have to feel like you know and understand it better than those opponents before deploying it.
I hope a game like the one I posted can alleviate some of the Benoni sorrow and reinject some confidence into adopting it, at least for a while.