Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

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daniel71
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by daniel71 » Fri Feb 19, 2021 2:44 pm

This is from the GNU License website:
https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-3.0.en.html

When we speak of free software, we are referring to freedom, not price. Our General Public Licenses are designed to make sure that you have the freedom to distribute copies of free software (and charge for them if you wish), that you receive source code or can get it if you want it, that you can change the software or use pieces of it in new free programs, and that you know you can do these things.

To protect your rights, we need to prevent others from denying you these rights or asking you to surrender the rights. Therefore, you have certain responsibilities if you distribute copies of the software, or if you modify it: responsibilities to respect the freedom of others.

For example, if you distribute copies of such a program, whether gratis or for a fee, you must pass on to the recipients the same freedoms that you received. You must make sure that they, too, receive or can get the source code. And you must show them these terms so they know their rights.

Developers that use the GNU GPL protect your rights with two steps: (1) assert copyright on the software, and (2) offer you this License giving you legal permission to copy, distribute and/or modify it.

amchess
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by amchess » Fri Feb 19, 2021 3:05 pm

CEGT, in the past, told me they don't accept any stockfish derivate...
http://www.cegt.net/40_40%20Rating%20Li ... liste.html
clearly, the clones yes...

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hgm
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by hgm » Fri Feb 19, 2021 3:18 pm

daniel71 wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 2:41 pm
Maybe use a different license before Stockfish 13 comes out. How about using this license for future versions: https://omnetpp.org/intro/license
You don't get it. Stockfish is GPLv3, and GPL clings to you as a forever indelible stain. It is not possible to release any future version of Stockfish under any other license than GPL. That would be a GPL violation.

This apart from the fact that whatever the license, as long as it can be freely downloaded, ChessBase can sell nets that run with it. The only way to prevent that is not by any license, but by making absolutely sure that no one in the world ever gets access to a Stockfish 13 executable.

gonzochess75
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by gonzochess75 » Fri Feb 19, 2021 4:04 pm

hgm wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 3:18 pm
daniel71 wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 2:41 pm
Maybe use a different license before Stockfish 13 comes out. How about using this license for future versions: https://omnetpp.org/intro/license
You don't get it. Stockfish is GPLv3, and GPL clings to you as a forever indelible stain. It is not possible to release any future version of Stockfish under any other license than GPL. That would be a GPL violation.

This apart from the fact that whatever the license, as long as it can be freely downloaded, ChessBase can sell nets that run with it. The only way to prevent that is not by any license, but by making absolutely sure that no one in the world ever gets access to a Stockfish 13 executable.
This is factually wrong. If all the copyright authors of Stockfish agree to re-license SF under a different license they are free to do so. Of course, getting all current copyright holders of SF to agree might be a significant undertaking, but in theory they could get together and agree to license it however they wish.

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hgm
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by hgm » Fri Feb 19, 2021 6:06 pm

In theory, perhaps. But in practice it is not possible. Contributors to Stockfish are not requested to transfer the copyrights on their contribution, like they would for GNU projects such as XBoard.

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mclane
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by mclane » Fri Feb 19, 2021 7:00 pm

MMarco wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 12:04 am
An important message from open source chess organizations: https://lichess.org/blog/YCvy7xMAACIA80 ... -a-rip-off
The legal status of fat fritz, product of chess base company is deep into question.
Talkchess should not promote any further promoting of this product in legal question.
Please close all fat fritz threads.
What seems like a fairy tale today may be reality tomorrow.
Here we have a fairy tale of the day after tomorrow....

cpeters
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by cpeters » Fri Feb 19, 2021 8:19 pm

There's no promotion for this thing as I'm concerned - so please: Where did you get this impression? Enlightening people is not possible if you switch off the lights and close the door.

Perhaps outside shines the sun though. Oh my.

daniel71
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by daniel71 » Sat Feb 20, 2021 3:33 am

I cannot believe what I'm reading, suppression of free speech in a chess forum that I have read since the beginning with Computer Chess Reports on paper.
Now people are trying to silence dissatisfaction with a company that takes free software and repackages it to be sold for profit. I support the Stockfish Team, whether they wish to not charge for their work or to charge money is their business, my concern is their work feels to me as if stolen. I'm a long time ChessBase fan also, I have 90% of their catalog of software and used to buy every release of new chess engines. I have purchased Fritz 17 (FF1) because I like the analysis features of Chessbase products, I'm going to skip FF2 purchase this time.

Collingwood
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by Collingwood » Sat Feb 20, 2021 3:45 am

daniel71 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 3:33 am
I support the Stockfish Team ... their work feels to me as if stolen. I'm a long time ChessBase fan also, I have 90% of their catalog of software and used to buy every release of new chess engines. I have purchased Fritz 17 (FF1) because I like the analysis features of Chessbase products, I'm going to skip FF2 purchase this time.
Maybe you and other like-minded Chessbase customers should boycott all their products and write to them telling them why.

Maybe that is what the Stockfish Team should do: try to campaign for a boycott.

Collingwood
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Re: Interesting read about Fat Fritz 2

Post by Collingwood » Sat Feb 20, 2021 4:02 am

Someone on lichess pointed to this article: https://frederic-38110.medium.com/scam- ... a683203283
I have said it before: I am basically a scammer. An amateur who has never made a penny off his scams, but quite talented, you must admit.

The art of scamming includes seizing the moment ... Opportunities arise on a daily basis, and if you make use of them you can impress people no end and earn a big reputation.
Maybe the second sentence needs updating.

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