Whither g4? SF turns up her fishy nose.

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Dann Corbit
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Re: Whither g4? SF turns up her fishy nose.

Post by Dann Corbit »

Where does the htc test set come from?
what does htc stand for (hard to crack?)
Taking ideas is not a vice, it is a virtue. We have another word for this. It is called learning.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.
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Spliffjiffer
Posts: 416
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:48 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Whither g4? SF turns up her fishy nose.

Post by Spliffjiffer »

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 1:38 am Where does the htc test set come from?
what does htc stand for (hard to crack?)
hi Dann,
htc stands for Hard TalkChess...suite created by Vinvin from France...if i err here plz Vinvin tell it right
he lastely melted all the best of his collected positions together and called it HTC114 (id like to give the word to Vinvin again...i might be wrong here again)
the best carefully choosen testsuite ive ever downloaded as far as my computeranalysis, combined with my sadly but true poor understanding of chess has ever noticed...but Vinvin: do u have an answer for 100....Kg7 ;-) ??? after Fischers brilliant Bg4 ?...is Ng4 really worse?
sry Dann, still into these positions...took around a week to collect all the analysis...pretty sure that Vinvin will clear all doubts :-)
thank u that ure always in contact with the members, concerned abaut clarifications and the discussions u share with us, Dann !
greetings to all hehe :-)
Wahrheiten sind Illusionen von denen wir aber vergessen haben dass sie welche sind.
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Thomas Lagershausen
Posts: 328
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Re: Whither g4? SF turns up her fishy nose.

Post by Thomas Lagershausen »

On a slow FX-8320E with only 6 core :!:

SFx512emb:
NNUE evaluation using C:\Motoren\$SFx512emb\nn-ac7637a567be.nnue enabled

50/5 08:49 1.368.588.542 2.583.392 0,00 Ld3-e2 Dh5-h3 Le2-f1 Dh3-h5
51/15 12:04 1.872.688.595 2.584.936 0,00 g3-g4 Dh5-h4 Sd4-f3 Dh4xg4 Th1-g1 Dg4xf3 Lf4-h6 g7-g6 Ld3xg6 f7xg6 Tg1xg6+ Kg8-h8 Lh6-g7+ Kh8-g8
52/32+ 16:32 2.548.862.072 2.567.008 +0,08 g3-g4
52/32+ 17:46 2.723.177.696 2.552.616 +0,16 g3-g4
52/60+ 24:56 3.823.092.382 2.554.056 +1,04 g3-g4
52/65 28:35 4.370.988.344 2.547.372 +1,23 g3-g4 Dh5xg4 Dc2-d2 La3-e7 h2-h4 Sb6xc4 Ld3xc4 d5xc4 h4-h5 Tf8-d8 Dd2-e3 Td8xd4 Td1xd4 b7-b6 Lf4-h6 Dg4-f5+ Kb1-a1 Lc8-b7 Th1-g1 g7-g6 Td4-d7 Le7-c5 De3-g5 Df5xg5 Lh6xg5 Lb7-f3 h5xg6 h7xg6 Td7-c7 Lf3-d5 Tg1-g3 Lc5-f8 Tg3-g4 a7-a6 Lg5-f6 Lf8-g7 Ka1-b2 a6-a5 a2-a4 Ta8-b8 Tg4-f4 Lg7xf6 e5xf6 e6-e5 Tf4-g4 Ld5-e6 Tg4-h4 Le6-f5 Tc7-e7 e5-e4 Kb2-c1 Tb8-d8
53/65+ 36:37 5.571.913.193 2.536.004 +1,31 g3-g4
53/65+ 41:14 6.283.861.319 2.539.279 +1,39 g3-g4
53/65+ 57:31 8.801.573.630 2.550.108 +2,27 g3-g4
53/68 1:11:44 10.977.270.030 2.550.022 +2,48 g3-g4 Dh5xg4 Dc2-d2 Dg4-h5 Td1-g1 f7-f5 Ld3-e2 Dh5-h4 Lf4-g5 Dh4-e4+ Sd4-c2 f5-f4 Lg5-f6 Tf8xf6 e5xf6 La3-f8 Le2-d3 Sb6xc4 Dd2-d1 De4-f3 Tg1xg7+ Lf8xg7 Dd1-g1 Df3xh1 Dg1xh1 Lg7xf6 Ld3xc4 d5xc4 Dh1-g2+ Kg8-h8 Sc2-a3 e6-e5 Sa3xc4 Lc8-f5+ Kb1-b2 e5-e4 Sc4-d6 Lf5-g6 Sd6xe4 Lf6-e5 Dg2-g5 Ta8-e8 Se4-d6 Le5xd6 Dg5-f6+ Kh8-g8 Df6xd6 f4-f3 Kb2-a3 Te8-e2 Dd6-d4 Lg6-f7 Dd4-d8+ Te2-e8 Dd8-g5+ Lf7-g6 Dg5-c5
TL
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Paloma
Posts: 1167
Joined: Thu Dec 25, 2008 9:07 pm
Full name: Herbert L

Re: Whither g4? SF turns up her fishy nose.

Post by Paloma »

Spliffjiffer wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 3:15 am ...
the best carefully choosen testsuite ive ever downloaded as far as my computeranalysis, combined with my sadly but true poor understanding of chess has ever noticed...but Vinvin: do u have an answer for 100....Kg7 ;-) ??? after Fischers brilliant Bg4 ?...is Ng4 really worse?
...
???
Bg4 is not possible, because Black has only a black squared Bishop.
[pgn][Event "Hard-CCC_2020 final"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "????.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Hard-Talkchess-2020.185"]
[Black "?"]
[Result "*"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "r3r1k1/pp1q1p2/2p2npb/PPPp4/3Pp3/2NNPpP1/1R1B1P1K/3Q3R b - - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "9"]

1... Kg7 2. bxc6 Ng4+ (2... bxc6 3. Kg1 Ng4 4. Ne5 Nxe5) 3. Kg1 bxc6 4. Ne5
Nxe5 5. dxe5 Bg5 *
[/pgn]
1...Kg7 -3.99/40
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Spliffjiffer
Posts: 416
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:48 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Whither g4? SF turns up her fishy nose.

Post by Spliffjiffer »

99. HTC.184,r3r1k1/pp1q1p2/2p2npb/PPPp1bnp/3PpN2/2N1P1PP/1R1B1PBK/3Q1R2 b - - bm Bg4:
MPv24:a6;MPv18:a6;MPv12:a6;MPv6:Bg4;MPv5:Bg4;MPv4:Bg4;MPv3:a6;MPv2:a6;MPv1:Bg4 final ev:1.91 solved in: 242 sec

and

100. HTC.185,r3r1k1/pp1q1p2/2p2npb/PPPp4/3Pp3/2NNPpP1/1R1B1P1K/3Q3R b - - bm Kg7:
MPv24:Nc6;MPv18:Nc6;MPv12:Nc6;MPv6:Nc6;MPv5:Nc6;MPv4:Nc6;MPv3:Nc6;MPv2:Nc6;MPv1:Nc6 final ev:4.62 solved in: 153 sec

are 2 different testpositions but derive from the same game
so " after Fischers brilliant Bg4 ?" is 99. HTC.184

and "but Vinvin: do u have an answer for 100....Kg7 ;-) ??? ...is Ng4 really worse?" is 100. HTC.185
Wahrheiten sind Illusionen von denen wir aber vergessen haben dass sie welche sind.
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Spliffjiffer
Posts: 416
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:48 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Whither g4? SF turns up her fishy nose.

Post by Spliffjiffer »

Spliffjiffer wrote: ↑Sat May 15, 2021 5:49 am
100. HTC.185,r3r1k1/pp1q1p2/2p2npb/PPPp4/3Pp3/2NNPpP1/1R1B1P1K/3Q3R b - - bm Kg7:
MPv24:Nc6;MPv18:Nc6;MPv12:Nc6;MPv6:Nc6;MPv5:Nc6;MPv4:Nc6;MPv3:Nc6;MPv2:Nc6;MPv1:Nc6 final ev:4.62 solved in: 153 sec
ups, just noticed that i forgot sth lol...seems as i did only copy the ev and the solution time but forgot the moves...sry for that !
a retest gives the following:

100. HTC.185,r3r1k1/pp1q1p2/2p2npb/PPPp4/3Pp3/2NNPpP1/1R1B1P1K/3Q3R b - - bm Kg7:
MPv24:Kg7;MPv18:Kg7;MPv12:Kg7;MPv6:Ng4;MPv5:Kg7;MPv4:Ng4;MPv3:Ng4;MPv2:Kg7;MPv1:Kg7 final ev:4.90 solved in: 161 sec (MPv=1)
Wahrheiten sind Illusionen von denen wir aber vergessen haben dass sie welche sind.
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