Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

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mwyoung
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by mwyoung » Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:26 pm

Nordlandia wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:16 pm
mwyoung wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:52 pm
Nordlandia wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:46 pm
Please explain why you choose to overload your system with 32+2 threads?
First I am not overloading my system. As you can see from the live stream. Let see if you can figure this out on your own.

I will give you a hint. How many threads is your compuer running right now.
8-core at 4.5GHz.
That was not the question. Again how many threads are you running right now. Find the answer....
Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
Take on me. foes 0

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Nordlandia
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by Nordlandia » Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:12 pm

I give up.

mwyoung
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by mwyoung » Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:37 pm

Nordlandia wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:12 pm
I give up.
Sorry to here that.

The next time you don't know. Just Ask before attacking someone because you dont know everything.

And there is more than one way to do thing. And some are better then others depending on the work load.

You want to carve out CPU cores and that is one method.

Some want to set processes to certain cores that is another method.

But there are other and better methods to manage the workload. Depending on what you are doing and the utilization of the processes.

With lc0 it was better to do the method I am using.

And the only program taking a hit is stockfish at about 6%. But for this stockfish is able to ponder. Lc0 has full access to the cores. With full speed in feeding the beast. The 2080 ti, as the card is the bottle neck
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Nordlandia
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by Nordlandia » Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:05 pm

You can't let Lc0 get feeded by CPU time already used on stockfish. Something has to be adjusted to account for that.

mwyoung
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by mwyoung » Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:33 pm

Nordlandia wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:05 pm
You can't let Lc0 get feeded by CPU time already used on stockfish. Something has to be adjusted to account for that.

Correct. And it is obviously not or lc0 would not run. There is more then one way to do things. Your issue is you assume things that are not true. And trap yourself in a mental box. Otherwise you would know my method.
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Hugo
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by Hugo » Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:02 pm

Nordlandia wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:12 pm
I give up.
1 +

mwyoung
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by mwyoung » Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:23 am

Laskos wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:26 am
hgm wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:51 pm
Pondering makes sense when playing against Leela on a many-core machine, as Leela wouldn't use many CPU threads while thinking, and all other threads would then go to waste. Likewise the GPUs would be idle during Stockfish' turn when Leela is not pondering.

If Leela need two unshared cores, you can just set an affinity for it for hyper-threads 0-3. You can then set affinity for Stockfish to the remaining HT. That way they won't compete for cores. They might still compete for memory bandwidth, though; not sure how important that is for Leela.

I don't see why Leela couldn't run its two threads on the same physical core. That could of course be a disadvantage compared to running 2 threads on 2 physical cores, but that also holds for Stockfish' threads sharing physical cores. Yet some people claim that hyper-threading is beneficial compared to running 1 thread per physical core, and testing both under conditions with 2 active HT per core does not seem particularly unfair. It is just like all HT are somewhat slower physical cores. This doesn't involve any scheduling, so it should not be noisy.

Of course if you don't also reserve some cores for the OS, that would cause noise.
This creature is running 34 threads on a 16 core machine, and it IS affecting heavily the engines, much more Leela than SF. I don't know, I have to perform plain experiment to show black on paper what is obvious:

4 cores i7 CPU, 8 logical cores.
Leela on RTX 2070 GPU using 2 threads.

1/ Leela to 1 million nodes on 2 threads (using one of the latest nets) without the interference from SF:

info depth 16 seldepth 52 time 35832 nodes 1021332 score cp 27 hashfull 481 nps 28503
info depth 16 seldepth 51 time 35866 nodes 1017115 score cp 27 hashfull 481 nps 28358
info depth 16 seldepth 52 time 36044 nodes 1027829 score cp 27 hashfull 483 nps 28515

Very high stability, within 0.5% deviation speeds.


2/ SF on 8 threads AND Leela to 1 million nodes on 2 threads:

info depth 16 seldepth 53 time 43960 nodes 1058510 score cp 27 hashfull 498 nps 24078
info depth 16 seldepth 52 time 48555 nodes 1017708 score cp 27 hashfull 480 nps 20959
info depth 16 seldepth 52 time 43277 nodes 999935 score cp 27 hashfull 474 nps 23105
info depth 16 seldepth 52 time 58460 nodes 1063476 score cp 27 hashfull 498 nps 18191

The speeds on average are some 30% lower and they are very erratic, some 20-30% deviation on average from one run to another.
The issue would be even graver with his 2080ti, as it uses a bit more of CPU resources than mine 2070. And more severe in shorter runs, as there are bursts of slowdowns. All in all, this creature's tests and posts here are plain garbage.
You know are comparing a 4 core i7. To a 2950x designed to run heavy process multi threaded workloads. With huge L1, L2, and L3 cache, and quad channel 8 dimm memory. With a much better memory controller, and process and thread scheduler. In other words a much more advanced architecture to run this kind of workload.

I am just saying :lol:
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MikeB
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by MikeB » Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:14 am

Nordlandia wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:12 pm
I give up.
+1
I give you credit, you had a lot more patience than I did. They have a list called "foe" but it is actually mislabled and should just be called "ignore" . Anyway, whenever you realize that you are dealing with a narcissist, simply click on the name and then click the "ignore" button. All futures posts will be hidden.

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Nordlandia
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by Nordlandia » Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:50 am

MikeB wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:14 am
Nordlandia wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:12 pm
I give up.
+1
I give you credit, you had a lot more patience than I did. They have a list called "foe" but it is actually mislabled and should just be called "ignore" . Anyway, whenever you realize that you are dealing with a narcissist, simply click on the name and then click the "ignore" button. All futures posts will be hidden.
The first problem is that he play with ponder on the same way he play with ponder off. as if nothing need to be adjusted. Secondly he simply ignore the majority's consensus here. Third problem is that he still continues his futile matches, wasting time and electricity. Fourth problem is that he make people agry because of his stubbornness, implying he is right when he is obviously wrong.

Hugo
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Re: Leela Chess Zero 42565 vs Stockfish 140619

Post by Hugo » Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:15 pm

Nordlandia wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:50 am
.... Fourth problem is that he make people agry because of his stubbornness, implying he is right when he is obviously wrong.
Forums are build, to connect peoples with the same kind of interests. So there is a great way of sharing experiences and bring the theme on a great level.
So its better to deal with the winners, the ones you feel good and connected, the ones that bring all forward. And there are a lot of them here.

Wish a good day to all computerchess enthusiasts :)

Clemens Keck

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