New computer chess forum

Discussion of anything and everything relating to chess playing software and machines.

Moderators: Harvey Williamson, Dann Corbit, hgm

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Guenther
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Location: Regensburg, Germany
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New computer chess forum

Post by Guenther » Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:58 pm

I decided a few weeks ago to leave here, because the forum didn't meet my expectations anymore.
(trolls, stupids, haters, you name it, they took over and produce meanwhile >75% of all posts, while most respectable, experienced and serious members vanished, guess why)

It was not planned, but after two weeks of wonderful abstinence from this mess, I created my own little computerchess forum.
No idea, if it will last, or offer anything useful, it simply started :)

http://rwbc-computerchess.xobor.de/

Goodbye.

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Ovyron
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Re: New computer chess forum

Post by Ovyron » Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:43 pm

Hopefully you show more tolerance towards people on there than on here :mrgreen:

Stephen Ham
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Re: New computer chess forum

Post by Stephen Ham » Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:08 am

Hello Guenther,

I will miss your posts here as I perceive you as an intelligent/informed computer chess enthusiast.

Since I'll miss you, I visited your new site. As a result, I have constructive criticism. Like TalkChess presently, you allow Fake Names. In fact, the only posts presently on your site are from people with fake names. Therefore I won't join your website.

TalkChess once forbade fake names, but for some reason allows it now. Perhaps prevention of fake names is difficult to enforce. For example, if somebody not named Sam Smith wants register as Sam Smith, then how would anyone know? Nonetheless, TalkChess was once effective in banning fake names. Therefore, I don't understand why that's now acceptable.

You don't like the nasty/stupid/trolling posts seen here. However, such posts are more common when people are allowed to hide behind fake names. Posting a nasty/stupid/trolling remark with one's real name is embarrassing for decent people. Such posts reflect upon them - showing the whole world their flaws.

Anyway, good luck with your new site, Guenther.

All the very best,
-Steve Ham- My real name

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Ovyron
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Re: New computer chess forum

Post by Ovyron » Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:16 am

Stephen Ham wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:08 am
TalkChess was once effective in banning fake names.
Was it? I was never asked for my credentials, I could have passed as some fake named "Dylan Sharp" all along, and wouldn't have been discovered, like I did on Hiarcs Forum (and the only reason I was caught there was because I told the truth when asked, I could have lied and still remained like that to this day.)

Real names is an unenforceable rule and you just get an illusion (you trust your members are following the rule, but have no way of being certain), and with more than 10 years of moderator experience I can say that I never saw the difference between people that used fake names or real names, that anonymous people would do indecent things is an assumption (what you get is people with real names behaving indecently anyway.)

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xr_a_y
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Re: New computer chess forum

Post by xr_a_y » Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:03 am

I am quite new to the forum so I haven't seen much but I must say I don't understand your choice.
I find the 3 "main" forum" very helpfull and people here, including you of course (your work is very valuable) !, very kind, calm, enlightening, professionnal, ready to debate.
I won't classify as troll much of the threads here.

This place is a very good source of information for me and I consider it being "the chess programming community".

As said before, I can be wrong, it is just my opinion, but at least it would be great to debate improvement you'd like in here before splitting people in many places ?

Alayan
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Re: New computer chess forum

Post by Alayan » Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:19 am

There has been some bad blood (mostly in the past, but the recent thread about "hash collisions" was sad, and real names of the main posters didn't help at all). But most of the forum is just fine, with a lot of interesting discussion, imo. Discussing chess engines with others is nice and can be fruitful.

I guess it's an attitude thing. Guenther has been adding people to his "foes" list for a very long time, so he must have a different way to see things. Look at how he tracks the "troll explosion at talkchess", link in his signature.

Guenther
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Re: New computer chess forum

Post by Guenther » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:24 am

Stephen Ham wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:08 am
Hello Guenther,

I will miss your posts here as I perceive you as an intelligent/informed computer chess enthusiast.

Since I'll miss you, I visited your new site. As a result, I have constructive criticism. Like TalkChess presently, you allow Fake Names. In fact, the only posts presently on your site are from people with fake names. Therefore I won't join your website.

TalkChess once forbade fake names, but for some reason allows it now. Perhaps prevention of fake names is difficult to enforce. For example, if somebody not named Sam Smith wants register as Sam Smith, then how would anyone know? Nonetheless, TalkChess was once effective in banning fake names. Therefore, I don't understand why that's now acceptable.

You don't like the nasty/stupid/trolling posts seen here. However, such posts are more common when people are allowed to hide behind fake names. Posting a nasty/stupid/trolling remark with one's real name is embarrassing for decent people. Such posts reflect upon them - showing the whole world their flaws.

Anyway, good luck with your new site, Guenther.

All the very best,
-Steve Ham- My real name
Hello Steve, one last post from my side in this thread.

There is a difference between nick names and fake names Steve. Still I know what you mean and have similar feelings about this.
Note that the two accounts in the just newborn forum were of course mine, (you need at least 2 accounts for testing group rights).
I have renamed the nicks now, ('trouble2' was of course a tongue-in-cheek nick name)

Note that the main difference is that:
1. I will manually check all acounts, which is told in registration process - I will only accept people I know for sure from 20 years of computerchess
and through my work on the chronology etc, or if their existence can be proven (and their behaviour is ok).
2. Besides the nick name, you can always check the real name in each profile, once you are registered (guests can not, thus you couldn't)!
Obviously Talkchess doesn't show, or require the real/full name in the profiles, only if users voluntarily add them they are shown.

Some people are used to their nick, e.g. github account or similar or over lots of different media and I don't want to prevent this option,
as long as there still is a verifiable real person behind.

Collingwood
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Full name: Colin Wood

Re: New computer chess forum

Post by Collingwood » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:43 am

Alayan wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:19 am
I guess it's an attitude thing. Guenther has been adding people to his "foes" list for a very long time, so he must have a different way to see things.
He has 100 people on his foes list but has the attitude that it's the 100 people who are wrong, not the 1 person who can't tolerate different opinions like an adult.

He calls people "stupids", etc., but thinks they are the "trolls" and "haters".

He is the problem, not talkchess.

Gabor Szots
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Re: New computer chess forum

Post by Gabor Szots » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:08 am

xr_a_y wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:03 am
it would be great to debate improvement you'd like in here before splitting people in many places ?
I agree.
Gabor Szots
CCRL testing group

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Ovyron
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Re: New computer chess forum

Post by Ovyron » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:29 am

Well, one "improvement" Guenther has made very clear is me quitting Talkchess, to the point I'm sure if I had quit he'd have remained around, probably to tell someone else to also quit, until Talkchess had people he liked, exclusively.

It's odd that the forum had a system that allows you to add people to a list and then not have to see their posts anymore, he filled it up and that wasn't enough. Let's hope one month from now Guenther's forum doesn't look like a ghost town, unless that makes a more tolerant Guenther come back here.

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