Discussion of chess software programming and technical issues.
Moderators: hgm , Rebel , chrisw
Henk
Posts: 7216Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 10:31 am
Post by Henk Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:37 am
Don't know why I come up with this position.
[d] 8/8/3k1p2/4p3/4P3/3K4/8/8 w - - 0 1
Already know that Skipper can't play endgames
Code: Select all
exclude: none best +tail
dep score nodes time (not shown: tbhits knps seldep)
10 -2.02 5.15M 1:22.27 d3c3 d6e6 c3c2 f6f5 c2d3 f5f4 d3e2 e6d6 e2f3 d6c5
9 -2.02 2.71M 0:43.16 d3c3 d6e6 c3c2 f6f5 c2d3 f5f4 d3e2 e6d6 e2d3
8 -1.07 508965 0:08.29 d3c3 d6e6 c3b2 e6f7 b2b1 f7g6 b1a1 f6f5 e4f5 g6f5
7 -1.07 183499 0:02.97 d3c3 d6e6 c3b2 f6f5 e4f5 e6f5 b2a1
6 -1.08 69171 0:01.23 d3c3 d6e6 c3b2 f6f5 e4f5 e6f5
5 -1.08 26230 0:00.58 d3c3 d6e6 c3b2 f6f5 e4f5 e6f5
4 -1.08 8972 0:00.32 d3c3 d6e6 c3b2 f6f5 e4f5 e6f5
3 -1.05 886 0:00.19 d3c3 d6c5 c3d3
2 -1.05 234 0:00.18 d3c3 d6c5
1 -1.05 10 0:00.13 d3c3
Sven
Posts: 4052Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 9:57 pmLocation: Berlin, GermanyFull name: Sven Schüle
Post by Sven Fri Oct 16, 2020 6:20 pm
Should be easy with a good TT
Sven Schüle (engine author: Jumbo, KnockOut, Surprise)
Joost Buijs
Posts: 1563Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:47 amLocation: Almere, The Netherlands
Post by Joost Buijs Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:17 pm
The slow speed doesn't help either, 62 knps seems a bit slow for a simple position like this. Is the engine running on a RPI-1 or does it run with debug code?
zenpawn
Posts: 349Joined: Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:31 pmLocation: United States
Post by zenpawn Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:13 pm
Henk wrote: ↑ Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:37 am
Don't know why I come up with this position.
LOL. For those who don't know and/or future readers, this is from the end of Firouzja-Carlsen, Norway Chess 2020. Firouzja blundered with Kc3?? and resigned after ...Kc5. The move Kd2, taking distant opposition, is still a draw.
Erin Dame
hgm
Posts: 27788Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2006 10:06 amLocation: AmsterdamFull name: H G Muller
Post by hgm Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:53 pm
And it isn't just nps; there seems to be something horribly wrong with time-to-depth (or nodes-to-depth) as well. Fairy-Max needs only ~24K nodes (and consequently 0.01 sec) to reach depth 10, and it already switches to Kd2 there:
Code: Select all
dep score nodes time (not shown: tbhits knps seldep)
17 -1.56 333282 0:00.14 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Ke3 f5 3. Kf3 Kf6 4. Ke3 fxe4 5. Kxe4 Ke6 6. Ke3 Kf5
16 -1.61 189677 0:00.07 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Ke3 f5 3. Kf3 fxe4 4. Kxe4 Kd6 5. Kf3 Kd5 6. Ke3 e4 7. Kf4 Kd4 8. Kf5 e3
15 -1.11 124800 0:00.06 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Ke3 f5 3. Kf3 fxe4 4. Kxe4 Kd6 5. Kf3 Kd5 6. Ke3 e4 7. Kf4 Kd4 8. Kf5
14 -1.14 96672 0:00.04 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Ke3 f5 3. Kf3 fxe4 4. Kxe4 Kd6 5. Kf3 Kd5 6. Ke3 e4 7. Kf4
13 -1.13 68330 0:00.03 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Ke3 f5 3. Kf3 f4 4. Kg4 Kf6 5. Kf3 Kg5 6. Ke2 Kg4 7. Kd3
12 -0.74 50436 0:00.03 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Ke3 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kf3
11 -1.05 29255 0:00.01 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Ke2 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Ke3 e4 5. Kd4
10 -0.95 24360 0:00.01 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Ke3 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kf3
10 -0.96 21975 0:00.01 1. Ke3 Ke6 2. Ke2 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kf3 e4 5. Ke3 Ke5
10 -1.02 19543 0:00.01 1. Kc3 Ke6 2. Kb4 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kc5 e4 5. Kd4 Kf4
9 -0.75 15921 0:00.00 1. Kc3 Ke6 2. Kb4 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kc5 e4 5. Kd5
9 -0.81 13147 0:00.00 1. Ke3 Ke6 2. Ke2 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kf3 e4 5. Kg3
9 -0.94 9212 0:00.00 1. Kc2 Ke6 2. Kd2 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Ke3 e4 5. Kd4
8 -0.75 6202 0:00.00 1. Kc2 Ke6 2. Kd2 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Ke3 e4
7 -0.72 4725 0:00.00 1. Kc2 Ke6 2. Kc1 Ke7 3. Kd1
7 -0.78 3416 0:00.00 1. Kc4 Ke6 2. Kc5 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kd5
6 -0.72 2287 0:00.00 1. Kc4
6 -0.73 1999 0:00.00 1. Kc4 Ke6 2. Kc3 Kf7 3. Kd3 Kg6
5 -0.69 1281 0:00.00 1. Kc4 Ke6 2. Kc3
5 -0.70 1027 0:00.00 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Kc3 f5 3. exf5
4 -0.69 387 0:00.00 1. Kd2 Ke6 2. Kc3 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5
4 -0.77 274 0:00.00 1. Ke2 Ke6 2. Kf3 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5
3 -0.62 123 0:00.00 1. Ke2 Ke6 2. Ke3
2 -0.63 22 0:00.00 1. Ke2 Ke6
1 -0.62 11 0:00.00 1. Ke2
Now one of course cannot be sure whether it did that because it saw the other moves were losing, or just accidentally because it slightly preferred it. So I also analyzed the position after the losing Kc3:
Code: Select all
mover viewpoint fewer / Multi-PV margin = 0 / more
exclude: none best +tail
dep score nodes time (not shown: tbhits knps seldep)
28 +8.81 7.73M 0:03.54 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Kf2 Kd2 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kf2 Kxe4 8. Kg3 Kf5 9. Kf2
27 +8.75 5.63M 0:02.48 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kf2 Kxe4 8. Kg3 Kd3 9. Kg4 e4 10. Kf5 e3 11. Kxf6 e2 12. Kf5 e1=Q 13. Kf4 Kc3 14. Kg5 Kd4
26 +3.89 2.69M 0:01.18 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kf2 Kxe4 8. Ke2 f5 9. Kf2 f4 10. Ke2 f3 11. Kf2 Kf4 12. Kf1 Kg3 13. Kg1 e4
25 +3.95 1.95M 0:00.85 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Kf2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kf2 Kxe4 8. Ke2
24 +3.15 919023 0:00.40 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kf2 Kxe4 8. Kg2 f5 9. Kh2 f4 10. Kh1 f3 11. Kg1 Ke3 12. Kh1 f2 13. Kh2
23 +3.12 717467 0:00.31 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg3 Kxe4 8. Kg4 f5 9. Kg3 f4 10. Kh3 f3 11. Kh2 f2 12. Kg2 Ke3
22 +2.93 532600 0:00.23 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg2 Kxe4 8. Kh2
21 +2.44 400512 0:00.17 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg3 Ke3 8. Kh3 Kf3 9. Kh2 Kxe4
20 +2.42 318638 0:00.14 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Kf2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg4 Kxe4 8. Kh5 f5 9. Kg6 f4 10. Kf7 f3 11. Kg7
19 +2.36 243073 0:00.10 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg3 Kxe4 8. Kg4 f5 9. Kg5 f4 10. Kf6 f3
18 +1.75 169474 0:00.07 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Kf2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg3 Kxe4 8. Kh2 f5 9. Kh3
17 +1.65 128416 0:00.04 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg3 Kxe4 8. Kh4 f5 9. Kg5 f4
16 +1.65 99650 0:00.04 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg3 Kxe4 8. Kh3 f5 9. Kh2
15 +1.60 82172 0:00.03 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg3 Kxe4 8. Kh4 f5
14 +1.49 68364 0:00.01 Kc5 2. Kd3 Kb4 3. Kd2 Kc4 4. Ke3 Kc3 5. Ke2 Kd4 6. Kf3 Kd3 7. Kg3 Kxe4 8. Kh3
14 +0.95 57480 0:00.01 Ke6 2. Kd3 f5 3. Ke3 f4 4. Kf3 Kd6 5. Kf2 Kc5 6. Kg2 Kc4 7. Kf2 Kd4 8. Kf3
13 +1.03 33751 0:00.01 Ke6 2. Kc4 f5 3. Kd3 fxe4 4. Kxe4 Kd6 5. Kd3 Kd5 6. Ke3 e4 7. Kf4 Kd4
12 +1.03 25429 0:00.01 Ke6 2. Kc4 f5 3. Kd3 fxe4 4. Kxe4 Kd6 5. Kd3 Kd5 6. Ke3 e4 7. Kf4
11 +1.04 17977 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kc4 f5 3. Kd3 fxe4 4. Kxe4 Kd6 5. Kd3 Kd5 6. Ke3 e4
10 +0.83 8542 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kc4 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kd5 e4 5. Kd4 Kf4 6. Kd5
9 +0.83 5126 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kc4 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kd5 e4 5. Kd4 Kf4
8 +0.83 3506 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kc4 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kd5 e4 5. Kd4
7 +0.83 2231 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kc4 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kd5 e4
6 +0.74 1189 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kc4 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5 4. Kd5
5 +0.75 604 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kd3 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5
4 +0.75 217 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kd3 f5 3. exf5
3 +0.75 125 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kd3 f5 3. exf5 Kxf5
2 +0.72 10 0:00.00 Ke6 2. Kd3
1 +0.75 3 0:00.00 Ke6
From this it can be seen that it needs ~250K nodes to see there is additional material gain after 1. Kc3. (Score > 2. But for thinking in the original position it would of course also spend some effort on moves other than 1. Kc3). It needs 2.5 sec to see the promotion.
It would be interesting to see what Skipper thinks in the position after1. Kc3.
Henk
Posts: 7216Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 10:31 am
Post by Henk Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:18 pm
zenpawn wrote: ↑ Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:13 pm Henk wrote: ↑ Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:37 am
Don't know why I come up with this position.
LOL. For those who don't know and/or future readers, this is from the end of Firouzja-Carlsen, Norway Chess 2020. Firouzja blundered with Kc3?? and resigned after ...Kc5. The move Kd2, taking distant opposition, is still a draw.
Yes for those who did not see it:
VIDEO
Henk
Posts: 7216Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 10:31 am
Post by Henk Sat Oct 17, 2020 6:15 pm
Better. It did not use transposition table in main branch.
Code: Select all
dep score nodes time (not shown: tbhits knps seldep)
22 -2.59 14.8M 3:50.75 d3d2 d6e6 d2e2 e6f7 e2d3 f7g6 d3e2 f6f5 e4f5 g6f5 e2d2
21 -2.59 13.0M 3:22.50 d3d2 d6e6 d2e2 e6f7 e2d3 f7g6 d3e2 f6f5 e4f5 g6f5 e2d2
20 -2.59 10.8M 2:47.73 d3d2 d6e6 d2e2 f6f5 e4f5 e6f5 e2d2 e5e4 d2e2 f5g5 e2e1 g5f6 e1f2 f6e5 f2e1 e4e3 e1f1 e5f4
19 -2.44 10.1M 2:36.19 d3d2 d6e6 d2e2 e6e7 e2f3 e7d6 f3g3
19 -2.59 3.05M 0:48.19 d3c2 f6f5 e4f5 e5e4 c2b2 d6e5 b2b1 e5f5 b1c2 f5e5 c2c1 e4e3 c1d1 e5d4 d1e2
18 -2.44 2.06M 0:32.18 d3c2 d6e6 c2d2 e6f7 d2d1 f6f5 e4f5 e5e4 d1c1 f7g7 c1d1 g7f6 d1d2 f6f5 d2e3 f5e5 e3d2 e5d4
17 -2.44 1.60M 0:25.17 d3c2 d6e6 c2d2 f6f5 d2e3 f5e4 e3e4 e6f6 e4e3 f6f5 e3f3 e5e4 f3e3 f5e5 e3d2 e5d4
17 -3.09 934478 0:14.74 d3c3 d6c5 c3d3 c5b4 d3d2 b4c4 d2e2 c4d4 e2f3 d4d3 f3g3 d3e4 g3g4 f6f5 g4g3 f5f4 g3f2
16 -2.41 237564 0:04.23 d3c3 d6c5 c3d3 c5b4 d3d2 b4c4 d2e2 c4d4 e2f3 d4d3 f3g3 d3e4 g3g4 e4d3 g4f5 e5e4 f5f6
15 -2.19 201620 0:03.57 d3c3 d6c5 c3d3 c5b4 d3d2 b4c4 d2e2 c4d4 e2f3 d4d3 f3g2 d3e4 g2h2 f6f5 h2h1
14 -2.19 135119 0:02.46 d3c3 d6c5 c3d3 c5b4 d3d2 b4c4 d2e2 c4d4 e2f3 d4d3 f3g2 d3e4 g2h1 f6f5
13 -2.02 88135 0:01.66 d3c3 d6e6 c3d2 e6f7 d2c1 f7g6 c1c2 f6f5 c2d3 f5f4 d3e2 g6f6 e2d3
12 -2.02 60282 0:01.18 d3c3 d6e6 c3d2 f6f5 d2e3 f5f4 e3e2 e6d6 e2f2 d6c5 f2f3 c5c4
11 -2.03 37684 0:00.83 d3c3 d6e6 c3d2 f6f5 d2e3 f5f4 e3e2 e6d6 e2f3 d6c5 f3e2
10 -2.02 27874 0:00.67 d3c3 d6e6 c3d2 f6f5 d2e3 f5f4 e3e2 e6d6 e2f3 d6c5
9 -2.03 20257 0:00.53 d3c3 d6e6 c3d2 f6f5 d2e3 f5f4 e3f3 e6d6 f3e2
8 -2.02 9298 0:00.36 d3c3 d6e6 c3d2 f6f5 d2e3 f5f4 e3f3 e6d6
7 -1.07 3253 0:00.26 d3c3 d6e6 c3b2 f6f5 e4f5 e6f5 b2a1
6 -1.08 2520 0:00.24 d3c3 d6e6 c3b2 f6f5 e4f5 e6f5
5 -1.08 640 0:00.19 d3c3 d6e6 c3b2 f6f5 e4f5 e6f5
4 -1.05 154 0:00.18 d3c3 d6c5 c3d3 c5c6
3 -1.05 68 0:00.15 d3c3 d6c5 c3d3
2 -1.05 26 0:00.15 d3c3 d6c5
1 -1.05 8 0:00.12 d3c3
