What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

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Chessqueen
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Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Chessqueen » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:50 am

Chessqueen wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:48 am
Dann Corbit wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:02 am
There is plenty of room for diversity of opinion.
And you will never, never, never offend me because your opinion is different than mine.

I want to play against the computer at full strength.
Sure, I get a lot of beat downs that way. But even so, I enjoy it.

And when I have had one too many punches to the head by the unfeeling monster, I simply play a game against a weak program like Golem to get my revenge against the machine.

I would not play odds against a human or a machine because I would not enjoy it.
But other people can get a bang out of it and have fun.
At least you could have picked Vice 1.0 64 Bit rate around 2040. since Golem must be around 800 or 900 rated with plenty of bugs. My 9 years old daughter played this games and Golem lost on time.

[Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-OFQ3C0P"]
[Date "2019.01.10"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Princess Soraida"]
[Black "Golem_0441"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2000"]
[ECO "A00"]
[Opening "Clemenz (Mead-Basman-de Klerk-Welling) Opening"]
[Time "19:33:22"]
[Variation "1.e4 c5"]
[WhiteElo "1500"]
[TimeControl "120"]
[Termination "time forfeit"]
[PlyCount "7"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. h3 e6 {(e7e5 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3 b8c6 d2d3 0.90 3.33-20.00 b2 <kn534> 41x)
+0.46/6 6} 2. e4 Nf6 3. Nc3 Be7 4. d4 ... {Black forfeits on time} 1-0

Dann Corbit
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Location: Redmond, WA USA
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Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Dann Corbit » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:18 am

I play against this version, which is more stable, but probably not any stronger:

Code: Select all

 Directory of F:\chess\golem01
2000-05-03  10:28 AM           173,056 golem01.exe
2000-05-12  03:50 PM             2,769 readme.txt
Here is a contest I ran ages ago, where Golem landed dead last:
http://www.tckerrigan.com/Chess/TSCP/Co ... /botc.html
Taking ideas is not a vice, it is a virtue. We have another word for this. It is called learning.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.

Chessqueen
Posts: 417
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:16 am
Full name: Nancy M Pichardo

Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Chessqueen » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:38 am

Dann Corbit wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:18 am
I play against this version, which is more stable, but probably not any stronger:

Code: Select all

 Directory of F:\chess\golem01
2000-05-03  10:28 AM           173,056 golem01.exe
2000-05-12  03:50 PM             2,769 readme.txt
Here is a contest I ran ages ago, where Golem landed dead last:
http://www.tckerrigan.com/Chess/TSCP/Co ... /botc.html

Thanks for the advice Dan, I decided to play versus Tscp and enjoyed even more than playing versus F with odds handicap.

[Event "Testing lower rated program"]
[Site "DESKTOP-OFQ3C0P"]
[Date "2019.01.11"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Me"]
[Black "Tscp181"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2000"]
[ECO "C64"]
[Opening "Spanish"]
[Time "04:13:13"]
[Variation "Classical, 4.c3 Nf6 5.d4"]
[WhiteElo "?"]
[TimeControl "900"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "51"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 e5 {(e7e5 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3 b8c6 d2d4 d7d6) -0.18/7 19} 2. Nf3 Nc6
{(b8c6 d2d4 e5d4 f3d4 c6d4 d1d4 g8f6) -0.13/7 19} 3. Bb5 Bc5 {(f8c5 b1c3
g8e7 d2d3 e8g8 c1g5 f7f6) -0.12/7 18} 4. c3 Nf6 {(g8f6 d2d4 e5d4 e4e5 f6e4
c3d4 c5b6) -0.12/7 18} 5. d4 exd4 {(e5d4 e4e5 f6g4 c3d4 c5e7 h2h3 e7b4)
-0.23/7 17} 6. e5 Qe7 {(d8e7 b5c6 d7c6 e1g1 f6e4 c3d4 c5b6) -0.20/7 16} 7.
O-O Ne4 {(f6e4 c3d4 c5b6 d1d3 d7d5 b5c6 b7c6 b1c3) -0.83/7 16} 8. cxd4 Bb4
{(c5b4 d1c2 f7f5 b5d3 d7d5 c1e3) -1.08/6 15} 9. Qc2 f5 {(f7f5 a2a3 b4a5
b5d3 d7d5 c1e3) -1.11/6 15} 10. exf6 Nxf6 {(e4f6 a2a3 b4a5 c1d2 a5b6 f1e1)
-0.64/6 14} 11. a3 Ba5 {(b4a5 b2b4 a5b4 a3b4 e7b4 f1e1) -1.17/6 24} 12. b4
Bxb4 {(a5b4 a3b4 e7b4 b5c6 d7c6 f1e1 e8d8 b1c3) -1.38/7 23} 13. axb4 Qxb4
{(e7b4 c2e2 e8f7 c1a3 b4a5 a3b2 a5b6) -1.44/6 22} 14. Bxc6 dxc6 {(d7c6 f1e1
e8d8 c1a3 b4b5 a3e7 d8d7 b1c3) -1.58/6 21} 15. Ba3 Qb5 {(b4b5 b1c3 b5f5
f1e1 e8f7 e1e7 f7g8 c2f5 c8f5 e7c7) -1.75/6 21} 16. Re1+ Kf7 {(e8f7 b1c3
b5f5 e1e7 f7g8 c2b3 f6d5 c3d5 f5d5 b3d5 c6d5 e7c7) -2.19/5 20} 17. Nc3 Qh5
{(b5h5 c2b3 f7g6 e1e5 h5g4 e5g5 g4g5 f3g5 g6g5) -2.25/6 19} 18. Ne5+ Qxe5
{(f7g8 c2b3 f6d5 c3d5 c6d5 b3d5 c8e6 d5e6) -4.71/5 19} 19. Rxe5 Be6 {(c8e6
a1e1 h8e8 c2e2 e6g4 f2f3) -7.02/6 18} 20. Rxe6 Kxe6 {(f7e6 c2b3 f6d5 b3b7
e6d7 c3d5 c6d5 b7d5) -7.34/7 17} 21. Re1+ Kf7 {(e6f7 e1e7 f7f8 e7c7 f8g8
c7b7 a8d8 c2b3 f6d5 c3d5 d8d5 b7a7) -8.15/6 17} 22. Re7+ Kf8 {(f7f8 e7c7
f8g8 c2a2 f6d5 c3d5 c6c5 d5b6 c5c4 b6a8) -13.21/6 16} 23. Qe2 Ne4 {(f6e4
e7c7 c6c5 a3c5 e4c5 e2e7 f8g8 e7g7) -M4/6 4} 24. Qxe4 c5 {(c6c5 e4e6 c5d4
e7c7) -M2/5 0} 25. Qe6 cxd4 {(c5d4 e7c7) -M1/3 0} 26. Rxc7# 1-0



Michael Sherwin
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Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Michael Sherwin » Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:19 am



Stockfish had 10 threads. I had to fix the pgn because I accidently made a move after the game was over.
I hate if statements. Pawns demand if statements. Therefore I hate pawns.

Chessqueen
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Full name: Nancy M Pichardo

Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Chessqueen » Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:08 pm

Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:19 am


Stockfish had 10 threads. I had to fix the pgn because I accidently made a move after the game was over.
Great Game Mike. I would also like to see more games from different great players like you such as Uri Blass who is also a great player.

Michael Sherwin
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Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Michael Sherwin » Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:50 pm

Chessqueen wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:08 pm
Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:19 am


Stockfish had 10 threads. I had to fix the pgn because I accidently made a move after the game was over.
Great Game Mike. I would also like to see more games from different great players like you such as Uri Blass who is also a great player.
I tried two more times with the black pieces with the same odds and got two more draws but just barely. I see no reason to keep posting draws. If I manage to win a game I'll post it. My impression is though, that with only N odds and playing black that SF almost will always find some resource that a human will not see. Although I can't really understand why a human grandmaster given at least a minute a move would not be able to win almost every game?
I hate if statements. Pawns demand if statements. Therefore I hate pawns.

Chessqueen
Posts: 417
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:16 am
Full name: Nancy M Pichardo

Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Chessqueen » Sun Jan 13, 2019 8:03 pm

Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:50 pm
Chessqueen wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:08 pm
Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:19 am


Stockfish had 10 threads. I had to fix the pgn because I accidently made a move after the game was over.
Great Game Mike. I would also like to see more games from different great players like you such as Uri Blass who is also a great player.
I tried two more times with the black pieces with the same odds and got two more draws but just barely. I see no reason to keep posting draws. If I manage to win a game I'll post it. My impression is though, that with only N odds and playing black that SF almost will always find some resource that a human will not see. Although I can't really understand why a human grandmaster given at least a minute a move would not be able to win almost every game?
GM Nakamura can draw or win versus Komodo with a pawn for a knight odds, but an IM should be able to win almost always versus a Knight odds either versus Komodo, SF version 10 or Lela. Here is GM Nakamura with a pawn for a knight odds ==>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0-sxnAzMMw

GM Nakamura is very dangerous against Komodo earlier version, but I do NOT believe that Nakamura can still do that versus the latest Komodo version ==>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clB8HMCU3Yg

I would also like to see the latest Komodo versus Master rated players with a knight odds, that would be a great promotion or advertising for Komodo to see how it does on Youtube, NOT just versus GM like Nakamura or MVL. Notice that the majority of the people buying Komodo are average people rated less than GM that are just a few or less than 1% of the players in the World.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_p0AQoUVgEw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyTFqrcoSmg

Michael Sherwin
Posts: 3016
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 1:00 am
Location: WY, USA
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Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Michael Sherwin » Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:23 pm

Chessqueen wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 8:03 pm
Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:50 pm
Chessqueen wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:08 pm
Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:19 am


Stockfish had 10 threads. I had to fix the pgn because I accidently made a move after the game was over.
Great Game Mike. I would also like to see more games from different great players like you such as Uri Blass who is also a great player.
I tried two more times with the black pieces with the same odds and got two more draws but just barely. I see no reason to keep posting draws. If I manage to win a game I'll post it. My impression is though, that with only N odds and playing black that SF almost will always find some resource that a human will not see. Although I can't really understand why a human grandmaster given at least a minute a move would not be able to win almost every game?
GM Nakamura can draw or win versus Komodo with a pawn for a knight odds, but an IM should be able to win almost always versus a Knight odds either versus Komodo, SF version 10 or Lela. Here is GM Nakamura with a pawn for a knight odds ==>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0-sxnAzMMw

GM Nakamura is very dangerous against Komodo earlier version, but I do NOT believe that Nakamura can still do that versus the latest Komodo version ==>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clB8HMCU3Yg

I would also like to see the latest Komodo versus Master rated players with a knight odds, that would be a great promotion or advertising for Komodo to see how it does on Youtube, NOT just versus GM like Nakamura or MVL. Notice that the majority of the people buying Komodo are average people rated less than GM that are just a few or less than 1% of the players in the World.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_p0AQoUVgEw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyTFqrcoSmg
Very interesting! I'll take a look at those links. Well I finally got a victory. I could have won sooner but I was trying too hard to checkmate SF with queens on the board.



And I guess this ends it for me because what mattered was if I could actually do it. And now that I have there is no point for me to continue. Although it was the most fun that I have had playing chess in a while. 😊
I hate if statements. Pawns demand if statements. Therefore I hate pawns.

Chessqueen
Posts: 417
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:16 am
Full name: Nancy M Pichardo

Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Chessqueen » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:18 pm

Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:23 pm
Chessqueen wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 8:03 pm
Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:50 pm
Chessqueen wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:08 pm
Michael Sherwin wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:19 am


Stockfish had 10 threads. I had to fix the pgn because I accidently made a move after the game was over.
Great Game Mike. I would also like to see more games from different great players like you such as Uri Blass who is also a great player.
I tried two more times with the black pieces with the same odds and got two more draws but just barely. I see no reason to keep posting draws. If I manage to win a game I'll post it. My impression is though, that with only N odds and playing black that SF almost will always find some resource that a human will not see. Although I can't really understand why a human grandmaster given at least a minute a move would not be able to win almost every game?
GM Nakamura can draw or win versus Komodo with a pawn for a knight odds, but an IM should be able to win almost always versus a Knight odds either versus Komodo, SF version 10 or Lela. Here is GM Nakamura with a pawn for a knight odds ==>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0-sxnAzMMw

GM Nakamura is very dangerous against Komodo earlier version, but I do NOT believe that Nakamura can still do that versus the latest Komodo version ==>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clB8HMCU3Yg

I would also like to see the latest Komodo versus Master rated players with a knight odds, that would be a great promotion or advertising for Komodo to see how it does on Youtube, NOT just versus GM like Nakamura or MVL. Notice that the majority of the people buying Komodo are average people rated less than GM that are just a few or less than 1% of the players in the World.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_p0AQoUVgEw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyTFqrcoSmg
Very interesting! I'll take a look at those links. Well I finally got a victory. I could have won sooner but I was trying too hard to checkmate SF with queens on the board.



And I guess this ends it for me because what mattered was if I could actually do it. And now that I have there is no point for me to continue. Although it was the most fun that I have had playing chess in a while. 😊
congratulations well done Michael !

Chessqueen
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Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:16 am
Full name: Nancy M Pichardo

Re: What is the minimum odd that you can take to play Vs SF ?

Post by Chessqueen » Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:43 pm

Very interesting! I'll take a look at those links. Well I finally got a victory. I could have won sooner but I was trying too hard to checkmate SF with queens on the board.



And I guess this ends it for me because what mattered was if I could actually do it. And now that I have there is no point for me to continue. Although it was the most fun that I have had playing chess in a while. 😊
[/quote]

congratulations well done Michael !
[/quote]

I noticed that you mentioned that trying to checkmate with the queens on the board is hard, in several games that GM Nakamura played versus Komodo on youtube I also heard him saying that trading the queens versus programs makes it much easier for him, and also trying to beat it tactically with the queens on the board it is almost impossible to beat the dragon Komodo, but by playing strategically he has a better chance specially when he is already two pawns up with odds.

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