Analyzing a position Ding-Firouzja wcup19

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Look
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Analyzing a position Ding-Firouzja wcup19

Post by Look » Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:01 pm

Hi,

In the following position what may happen after ... Nd5 :



The game :


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Eelco de Groot
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Re: Analyzing a position Ding-Firouzja wcup19

Post by Eelco de Groot » Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:51 pm

Don't think there is much going on in the position, not that I can see. Old Ancalagon only gives +0.08 everywhere, this was pre contempt, I believe it had something to do with the side to move bonus but I'm nor sure anymore. Or was it a primitive contempt bonus? But that was the most interesting thing, Stockfish is a little bit less 0.00 oriented these days in the eval. Don't know if it really makes a difference.

Stockfish:


Engine: Stockfish Dev of a few days back (512 MB)
by T. Romstad, M. Costalba, J. Kiiski, G. Linscott

33 4:21 +0.23 23...Nd5 24.Bd2 f5 25.Rc1 Rec8
26.Rdc4 Rxc4 27.Rxc4 Kf7 28.b3 Ke7
29.Rc1 Kd7 30.f3 e5 31.Kf2 Rf8
32.Rc4 Re8 33.h4 h5 34.a5 Rb8
35.axb6 Rxb6 36.Ra4 Kd6 (430.013.288) 1644

33 4:21 +0.29 23...Rec8 24.Rd6 Nd5 25.Rc1 Rxc1+
26.Bxc1 Rc8 27.Bg5 b5 28.e4 Nb4
29.axb5 axb5 30.Rb6 f6 31.Rxb5 Nc2
32.Be3 Nxe3 33.fxe3 Rc2 34.Rb7 Re2
35.e5 fxe5 36.e4 Rc2 (430.013.288) 1644

33 4:21 +0.57 23...Kf8 24.Rc4 Nd5 25.Bd2 Rec8
26.Rac1 Rxc4 27.Rxc4 f5 28.f3 Ke7
29.e4 fxe4 30.fxe4 Nf6 31.Rc7+ Kd6
32.Rxg7 Nxe4 33.Bf4+ e5 34.Be3 Nc5
35.Rxh7 Nxa4 36.Rh6+ Kd5 (430.013.288) 1644

33 4:21 +0.66 23...b5 24.Rd6 h6 25.a5 Red8 26.Rad1 Nd5
27.Rxd8+ Rxd8 28.Bxh6 gxh6 29.e4 b4
30.exd5 exd5 31.Rd4 b3 32.Kg2 Kg7
33.g4 Rc8 34.Rxd5 Rc2 35.Rd6 Rxb2
36.Rxa6 Ra2 (430.013.288) 1644

33 4:21 +0.99 23...h6 24.Rd6 Red8 25.Rad1 Nd5
26.Rxd8+ Rxd8 27.Bxb6 Rc8 28.Bd4 f5
29.f3 Kf7 30.e4 fxe4 31.fxe4 Nf6
32.Bc3 Nxe4 33.Rd7+ Kg6 34.Rxg7+ Kf5
35.Rf7+ Kg6 36.Ra7 Nxc3 (430.013.288) 1644

____________________________________________________

34 6:07 +0.13 23...Nd5 24.Bd2 f5 25.Rc1 Rec8
26.Rdc4 Rxc4 27.Rxc4 Kf7 28.Rc6 Ke7
29.f3 Kd7 30.Rc1 e5 31.Kf2 Rf8 32.a5 Rb8
33.Ra1 g6 34.h4 Ke6 35.axb6 Rxb6
36.Bc3 Nxc3 (602.468.450) 1637

34 6:07 +0.45 23...Kf8 24.Rd2 Rab8 25.Rc1 Nd5
26.Rdc2 Nxe3 27.fxe3 a5 28.b3 b5
29.Rc7 Re7 30.Rc8+ Re8 31.Rxb8 Rxb8
32.Rc5 Ke7 33.Rc7+ Kf6 34.Ra7 bxa4
35.bxa4 Rb1+ 36.Kg2 g5 (602.468.450) 1637

34 6:07 +0.68 23...Rec8 24.Rd6 Nd5 25.Bd4 Rc4
26.e3 h5 27.Kg2 Kh7 28.h3 a5 29.f4 Nb4
30.Rb1 Nc6 31.Bc3 Rc8 32.Ra1 Kg8
33.Kf3 Kf8 34.Rd7 Ne7 35.Rb7 Nd5
36.Bd4 Rb4 (602.468.450) 1637

34 6:07 +0.77 23...h6 24.Rd6 b5 25.a5 Nd5 26.Rc1 Rec8
27.Rdc6 Rxc6 28.Rxc6 Nxe3 29.fxe3 Rd8
30.Rxa6 Rd2 31.b4 Rb2 32.Kf2 Rxb4
33.Rb6 Kh7 34.Kf3 Kg6 35.h3 Ra4
36.Rxb5 f5 (602.468.450) 1637

34 6:07 +0.80 23...b5 24.Rd6 bxa4 25.Rxa4 a5
26.Bd4 h6 27.Kg2 Rec8 28.Rb6 e5
29.Bxe5 Nd7 30.Rb5 Nxe5 31.Rxe5 Rcb8
32.Raxa5 Rxa5 33.Rxa5 Rxb2 34.Kf3 g5
35.h3 Kg7 36.Rd5 Kg6 (602.468.450) 1637

After 23... Nd5 Palantir Crystal (only gets low depths but good at hidden mates)

r3r1k1/5ppp/pp2p3/3n4/P2R4/4B1P1/1P2PP1P/R5K1 w - -

Engine: Palantir Crystal (512 MB)
by T. Romstad, M. Costalba, J. Kiiski, G. Linscott and Joseph Ellis

17/32 0:01 +0.50 24.Bd2 f5 25.b3 Rec8 26.Rc4 b5
27.Rxc8+ Rxc8 28.axb5 axb5 29.Kf1 Kf7
30.Ra7+ Rc7 31.Rxc7+ Nxc7 32.Bc3 Nd5
33.Bd4 g5 34.f3 b4 35.Kf2 g4 36.fxg4 fxg4 (1.495.014) 1448

18/26 0:03 +0.45 24.Bd2 f5 25.b3 Rec8 26.Rc4 b5
27.Rxc8+ Rxc8 28.axb5 axb5 29.Kf1 Kf7
30.Ra5 Rc2 31.Ke1 Nc3 32.Bxc3 Rxc3
33.Rxb5 Rc2 34.Rb7+ Kf6 35.b4 h6 (4.824.459) 1398

19/31 0:10 +0.49 24.Bd2 f5 25.Rc1 Kf7 26.Rc6 b5 27.e4 fxe4
28.Rxe4 Nf6 29.Re2 bxa4 30.Be1 Nd5
31.h4 Rac8 32.Rxa6 Ra8 33.Rc6 Rac8 (14.623.516) 1403

20/35 0:47 +0.60 24.Bd2 f5 25.Rc4 b5 26.Rc6 Rac8
27.axb5 axb5 28.Rac1 Ra8 29.f3 Ra2
30.Rb1 Rd8 31.Bg5 Re8 32.Kf2 Kf7
33.Bd2 Rea8 34.h3 Rd8 35.Rc5 b4
36.e4 fxe4 (65.884.286) 1394

21/31 1:13 +0.49-- 24.Bd2 f5 (103.478.625) 1403

21/32 1:15 +0.60++ 24.Bd2 (105.596.224) 1406

21/36 1:16 +0.38-- 24.Bd2 f5 (108.162.373) 1408

21/36 1:19 +0.48 24.Bd2 f5 25.Rc4 b5 26.Rc6 Rac8
27.axb5 axb5 28.Raa6 Kf7 29.f3 Rxc6
30.Rxc6 Ra8 31.Rc5 b4 32.e4 fxe4
33.fxe4 Nf6 34.Rc4 b3 35.Kf2 Rd8
36.Ke3 Kg6 37.Ba5 (113.077.383) 1415

22/43 3:18 +0.59++ 24.Bd2 (278.878.338) 1406

22/43 3:19 +0.68 24.Bd2 f5 25.Rc4 Rec8 26.Rac1 Rxc4
27.Rxc4 Kf7 28.Rc6 Ke7 29.f3 Kd7
30.Rc2 h6 31.Rc1 e5 32.Kf2 e4 33.Be3 exf3
34.exf3 Nxe3 35.Kxe3 b5 36.a5 (280.596.933) 1407

23/33 7:55 +0.57-- 24.Bd2 f5 (673.401.721) 1415

23/33 8:13 +0.46-- 24.Bd2 f5 (700.247.499) 1419

23/34 8:17 +0.57++ 24.Bd2 (706.104.052) 1419

23/34 8:17 +0.62 24.Bd2 f5 25.Rc4 Rec8 26.Rac1 Rxc4
27.Rxc4 Kf7 28.Rc6 Ke7 29.h4 Kd7
30.Rc1 a5 31.h5 e5 32.h6 g6 33.Kg2 e4
34.Kh3 Re8 35.Bg5 e3 36.fxe3 (706.945.646) 1419

24/26 19:02 +0.51-- 24.Bd2 f5 (1.633.838.148) 1430

24/38 20:01 +0.40-- 24.Bd2 f5 (1.723.259.086) 1434

24/39 20:07 +0.51++ 24.Bd2 (1.731.196.458) 1434

24/39 20:24 +0.38 24.Bd2 f5 25.Rc4 b5 26.Rc6 Rac8
27.axb5 axb5 28.Rac1 Ra8 29.R1c5 Ra1+
30.Kg2 Rd1 31.Bc3 b4 32.Be5 g5 33.e3 g4
34.Bd4 Kf7 35.Ra5 Rd2 36.Rb5 e5
37.Rxd5 (1.758.440.083) 1435

After 23... Nd5 24. Bd2 f5, Multi PV



Engine: Kaissa IV NoContempt (512 MB)
by T. Romstad, M. Costalba, J. Kiiski, G. Linscott

37 29:55 +0.60 25.Rc4 Rec8 26.Rcc1 e5 27.f3 a5
28.Kf2 Kf7 29.b3 Ke6 30.h3 Nf6 31.h4 Nd5
32.Rab1 Rxc1 33.Rxc1 Kd6 34.Rc4 Re8
35.e4 fxe4 36.fxe4 Ne7 37.b4 Nc6
38.b5 (2.960.738.006) 1648

37 29:55 +0.44 25.Rc1 Rec8 26.Rdc4 Rxc4 27.Rxc4 b5
28.Rc6 Kf7 29.a5 Ke7 30.Kg2 Kd7
31.Rc5 Kd6 32.Rc1 e5 33.h4 Re8 34.h5 e4
35.h6 g6 36.b4 e3 37.Bxe3 Nxe3+
38.fxe3 (2.960.738.006) 1648

37 29:55 +0.43 25.Kf1 Rac8 26.Ke1 Kf7 27.f3 Rc2
28.Kd1 Rec8 29.Rc1 Rxc1+ 30.Bxc1 h6
31.Bd2 Kf6 32.Rd3 Ke7 33.a5 bxa5
34.Ra3 Rc5 35.Rxa5 Ne3+ 36.Ke1 Rxa5
37.Bxa5 e5 38.Bd2 (2.960.738.006) 1648

37 29:55 +0.36 25.b3 Rec8 26.Rc4 b5 27.Rd4 bxa4
28.Rdxa4 Rc2 29.R1a2 Rxa2 30.Rxa2 Kf7
31.Kg2 h6 32.Ra3 Rc8 33.Kf1 Rc6
34.Ke1 e5 35.Ra5 Ke6 36.f3 f4 37.Ra4 g5
38.Kf2 (2.960.738.006) 1648

37 29:55 +0.26 25.h3 Rac8 26.g4 fxg4 27.hxg4 Rc2
28.g5 Rxb2 29.e4 Ne7 30.Rd7 Rc2
31.Rb1 Nc6 32.Bf4 e5 33.Be3 Rb8
34.Rxb6 Rxb6 35.Bxb6 Ra2 36.Rd6 Nd4
37.Kg2 Rxa4 38.Rd5 (2.960.738.006) 1648



Ancalagon, honestly no idea what those Tablebase hits are doing there :oops: Never seen that before...



Engine: Ancalagon 20171105 (512 MB)
by T. Romstad, M. Costalba, J. Kiiski, G.

50 155:27 +0.08 25.h3 Rac8 26.g4 Nf6 27.Rc1 Rxc1+
28.Bxc1 fxg4 29.hxg4 Rc8 30.Bg5 Kf7
31.f3 Rc5 32.Bxf6 Kxf6 33.Rd6 Ra5
34.Rxb6 Rxa4 35.Kf2 a5 36.Rb5 Rb4
37.Rxa5 Rxb2 38.f4 (18.054.043.832) 1935
TB:2.213

50 155:27 +0.08 25.e4 fxe4 26.Re1 Kf7 27.Rexe4 Rac8
28.Rd3 Nf6 29.Rf3 Kg8 30.Re5 Rc2
31.Bc3 h6 32.h4 Nd5 33.Kg2 Nxc3
34.bxc3 Re7 35.h5 Ra2 36.Re4 a5
37.Rfe3 e5 38.Rxe5 (18.054.043.832) 1935
TB:2.213

50 155:27 +0.08 25.Re1 Kf7 26.e4 fxe4 27.Rexe4 Rac8
28.Rd3 Nf6 29.Rf3 Kg8 30.Re5 Rc2
31.Bc3 h6 32.h4 Nd5 33.Kg2 Nxc3
34.bxc3 Re7 35.h5 Ra2 36.Re4 a5
37.Rfe3 e5 38.Rxe5 (18.054.043.832) 1935
TB:2.213

50 155:27 +0.08 25.Rc4 Rec8 26.Rac1 Rxc4 27.Rxc4 Kf7
28.b3 Ke8 29.e4 fxe4 30.Rxe4 Kf7
31.Rc4 Rb8 32.Kg2 Ke7 33.Bg5+ Ke8
34.Bf4 Nxf4+ 35.Rxf4 b5 36.Rg4 Kf7
37.Rg5 b4 38.Rh5 (18.054.043.832) 1935
TB:2.213

50 155:27 +0.08 25.Rc1 Rec8 26.Rdc4 Rxc4 27.Rxc4 Kf7
28.b3 Ke8 29.e4 fxe4 30.Rxe4 Kf7
31.Rc4 Rb8 32.Kg2 Ke7 33.Bg5+ Ke8
34.Bf4 Nxf4+ 35.Rxf4 b5 36.Rg4 Kf7
37.Rg5 b4 38.Rh5 (18.054.043.832) 1935
TB:2.213
_________________________________________________________

51 225:35 +0.08 25.h3 Rac8 26.g4 Nf6 27.Rc1 Rxc1+
28.Bxc1 fxg4 29.hxg4 Rc8 30.Bg5 Kf7
31.f3 Rc5 32.Bxf6 Kxf6 33.Rd6 Ra5
34.Rxb6 Rxa4 35.Kf2 a5 36.Rb5 Rb4
37.Rxa5 Rxb2 38.f4 (26.367.855.146) 1947
TB:5.630

51 225:35 +0.08 25.e4 fxe4 26.Re1 Kf7 27.Rexe4 Rac8
28.Rd3 Nf6 29.Rf3 Kg8 30.Re5 Rc2
31.Bc3 h6 32.h4 Nd5 33.Kg2 Nxc3
34.bxc3 Re7 35.h5 Ra2 36.Re4 a5
37.Rfe3 e5 38.Rc4 (26.367.855.146) 1947
TB:5.630

51 225:35 +0.08 25.Re1 Kf7 26.e4 fxe4 27.Rexe4 Rac8
28.Rd3 Nf6 29.Rf3 Kg8 30.Re5 Rc2
31.Bc3 h6 32.h4 Nd5 33.Kg2 Nxc3
34.bxc3 Re7 35.h5 Ra2 36.Re4 a5
37.Rfe3 e5 38.Rc4 (26.367.855.146) 1947
TB:5.630

51 225:35 +0.08 25.Rc4 Rec8 26.Rac1 Rxc4 27.Rxc4 Kf7
28.Kg2 h6 29.b3 Ke7 30.f3 b5 31.Rc5 bxa4
32.bxa4 Rb8 33.Kf2 Rb1 34.Ra5 Rb6
35.h4 Kf7 36.Be3 Nxe3 37.Kxe3 g5
38.h5 (26.367.855.146) 1947 TB:5.630

51 225:35 +0.08 25.Rc1 Rec8 26.Rdc4 Rxc4 27.Rxc4 Kf7
28.Kg2 h6 29.b3 Ke7 30.f3 b5 31.Rc5 bxa4
32.bxa4 Rb8 33.Kf2 Rb1 34.Ra5 Rb6
35.Be3 Rc6 36.h4 Nxe3 37.Kxe3 Kf6
38.Kd4 (26.367.855.146) 1947
TB:5.630
Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan

Look
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Full name: Mehdi Amini
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Re: Analyzing a position Ding-Firouzja wcup19

Post by Look » Wed Sep 18, 2019 10:44 am

It seems drawish to me.

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Re: Analyzing a position Ding-Firouzja wcup19

Post by Look » Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:18 pm

After two draws in classical time control , Firouzja lost both rapid games to Ding. First game reached here:



I thought draw was easy to reach. But White's rook became active and he got the upper hand:



I expected ... Ra3 with a draw. Firouzja played ... Rd3. my Table-base says White wins this.

Then:



I see that ... Kd5 draws but Black played ... Rd7 and lost. It is said that rook endgames are tricky and they are. Both players missed their best results being low on time.

The game:


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Re: Analyzing a position Ding-Firouzja wcup19

Post by Look » Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:16 pm

In the next game Firouzja played a risky opening in the hope of equalizing the score. After:



He played the pawn sacrifice c5. A few moves later:



He went for pawn storm on kingside with g4. But his queen can hardly join the attack on the other side. Here he may find another plan.

Later on:



After Rf2 he has a pinned rook. His attack is stopped and black counters in the center.

The game:


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Re: Analyzing a position Ding-Firouzja wcup19

Post by Look » Thu Sep 19, 2019 10:44 am

Any Stockfish analysis of the two rapid games ?

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