An idea for new Handicap games for dragon

[lkaufman]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It is indeed strange that the analysis shows Smerdon making fewer errors than Komodo in all games after the first one in which he blundered early. It could mean that the algorithm disregards errors that still leave the side making the error with a decisive advantage, in which case it would be useless for analyzing knight odds games or larger unless the winning side blundered enough to drop below the threshold. Or it could be that the quality of the analysis is so far below the level of Komodo (probably due to time and cores used) that Komodo "errors" were actually played to avoid something worse beyond the horizon of the evaluating engine. Also Komodo played with high "Contempt" which will cause it to play moves that look bad to an engine not using Contempt in order to avoid trades. Running the same analysis on some of the smaller handicap games on the Komodochess website, like "pawn and move" games by Movsesian and Lenderman, might shed some light on this, as the initial position would not be considered hopeless by most algorithms.
Incidentally, all the games on the website were played live on actual chessboards, before chess.com did the matches, so there was no real chance of any cheating in any of those games. I personally do not suspect that any of our opponents in these handicap matches have ever cheated against us even in online play; for one thing the prize money isn't large enough for these players to risk their reputations for, and in any case we have avoided choosing opponents we didn't trust.

[Uri Blass]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It does not support your theory. A score of 15 or higher is expected from a GM player. You just ignored everything.
And this was also the same positions repeating. And mistakes were made in the games. Unlike chessqueen who made ZERO!

So now you want to throw out data of the match, and cherry pick.....

This supports Centipawn analysis.

And you are clueless here. This is not a comparison of players of this match. One has nothing to do with the other. This is determining if a players precision is above expected human norms. Based on the stats of the best players in the world. Everything else is just a bonus. Who played better, and who is the stronger and more accurate player.

GM Smerdon played within humans norms as shown by the results. Chessqueen did not and played way outside expected human norms of a GM Player. And Chessqueen is not a GM.

More results coming.

I wonder what is the average error rate in the following game of both opponents
I took extreme case when I knew I can win easily.

If my error rate is smaller than stockfish when I did not find the fastest mates then it proves my point

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-7QE6S12"]
[Date "2020.12.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "àåøé"]
[Black "Stockfish_20112916_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2200"]
[Time "08:56:25"]
[WhiteElo "2400"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "1nb1kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 g6 {(g7-g6 Ng1-e2 b7-b6 d2-d3 Nb8-c6 g2-g4 e7-e6 Bf1-g2 Bf8-g7 O-O
Ng8-e7 g4-g5 Ke8-f8 Qd1-d2 Bc8-a6 c2-c3 Nc6-e5 Ne2-f4 d7-d5 Rf1-d1 d5xe4
d3xe4 Kf8-g8 h2-h4) -22.78/29 12} 2. d4 e6 {(e7-e6 c2-c3 b7-b6 Bc1-f4
Bf8-d6 Bf4-e3 f7-f5 e4-e5 Bd6-f8 Qd1-a4 a7-a5 Nb1-d2 Ng8-e7 c3-c4 Ne7-c6
Nd2-f3 Bc8-b7 a2-a3 Nc6-e7 O-O-O Bb7-c6 Qa4-b3 Bc6xf3 Ng1xf3 Ne7-c6 h2-h4
Bf8-g7 h4-h5 Ke8-f7 Nf3-d2 Kf7-g8 h5xg6 h7xg6) -22.67/27 4} 3. Nf3 d6
{(d7-d6 Bc1-g5 f7-f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Nb1-c3 Bf8-e7 Bg5-c1 a7-a6 d4-d5 Ng8-f6
Qd1-d4 c7-c5 Qd4-a4+ b7-b5 Qa4-b3 c5-c4 Bf1xc4 Nf6-e4 Nc3xb5 a6xb5 Qb3xb5+
Nb8-d7) -22.63/23 2} 4. Bc4 Nc6 {(Nb8-c6 c2-c3 Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ng8-f6 Bc4-d3
Ke8-f8 O-O Kf8-g7 Rf1-e1 Bh6xd2 Bc1xd2 a7-a6 Qd1-a4 Nc6-e7 h2-h3 h7-h5
Qa4-b3 Ne7-c6 Re1-e2 Nc6-e7 a2-a3 Ne7-c6 c3-c4 e6-e5 d4-d5 Nc6-e7)
-22.37/26 1} 5. O-O Bh6 {(Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ke8-f8 c2-c3 Kf8-g7 Bc4-d3 Bh6xd2
Bc1xd2 b7-b6 Qd1-e2 Bc8-b7 g2-g4 Nc6-e7 g4-g5 d6-d5 e4-e5 a7-a6 a2-a4
Ne7-c6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 b4-b5 a6xb5 a4xb5 Nc6-d8) -22.44/25 2 Black resigns} 6.
Bxh6 Nxh6 {(Ng8xh6 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8 Qd2-c3 h7-h6 d4-d5 Nc6-e7 d5xe6 f7xe6
Bc4-b3 c7-c6 Rf1-d1 d6-d5 Qc3-g7 b7-b5 Nf3-e5 Bc8-d7 Nb1-c3 a7-a5 Qg7-f7+
Ke8-d8 a2-a4 b5-b4 Nc3-e2 Kd8-c7 f2-f3 g6-g5 Qf7-h5 Kc7-d8 c2-c3 b4xc3
Ne2xc3 Kd8-c8) -22.59/28 3 Black resigns} 7. d5 Ne5 {(Nc6-e5 Nf3xe5)
-23.99/29 18 Black resigns} 8. Nxe5 a6 {(a7-a6 Ne5-f3 e6-e5 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8
Qd2-a5 b7-b6 Qa5-c3 f7-f6 Nf3-d2 Ke8-d8 Qc3-e3 Kd8-e7 Nb1-c3 a6-a5 Bc4-b3
Bc8-d7 a2-a4 h7-h5 Qe3-e2 Ke7-d8 Qe2-a6 Bd7-c8 Qa6-c4 Bc8-d7 Ra1-e1 Kd8-c8
f2-f3 Ng8-e7) -24.80/27 7 Black resigns} 9. dxe6 Bxe6 {(Bc8xe6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Ke8-d7 Qg4-h4 h7-h6 Qh4-f6 Nf7-d8 Qf6-g7+ Kd7-c8
Qg7xh6 b7-b5 Qh6xg6 Kc8-b7 Qg6-g8 Nd8-c6 Qg8xe6 Nc6-a5 Qe6-d5+ Kb7-b6
Nb1-c3 Na5-c6 Qd5-f7 Kb6-b7 a2-a3) -24.40/20 1 Black resigns} 10. Bxe6 fxe6
{(f7xe6 Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Nf7-d8 Qg4-h3 e6-e5 Qh3xh7 Nd8-e6 Qh7xg6+
Ke8-e7 Qg6xe6+ Ke7xe6 g2-g3 a6-a5 Nb1-c3 c7-c6 Kg1-g2 Ke6-f7 a2-a4 Kf7-f6
Kg2-f3 Kf6-g7 h2-h3 Kg7-g6 h3-h4 b7-b6) -25.03/24 4 Black resigns} 11. Nf3
Nf7 {(Nh6-f7 Qd1-d4) -26.02/24 16 Black resigns} 12. Qd2 c5 {(c7-c5 Qd2-f4
b7-b5 Qf4-f6 b5-b4 Qf6xe6+ Ke8-f8 Qe6xf7+ Kf8xf7 Nb1-d2 Kf7-e6 Nf3-g5+
Ke6-e7 Ng5xh7 d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke7-d6 Nh7-f6 Kd6-e5 Nd2-e4 c5-c4 h2-h4 c4-c3
b2xc3 b4xc3 g2-g4) -24.94/22 3 Black resigns} 13. Ng5 a5 {(a6-a5 Ng5xf7
d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke8xf7 d5xe6+ Kf7-e7 Rf1-e1 a5-a4 Qd2-f4 c5-c4 Re1-d1 Ke7xe6
Rd1-d6+ Ke6-e7 Qf4-f6+ Ke7-e8 Rd6-d8+) -M9/24 4 Black resigns} 14. Nxf7 d5
{(d6-d5 Qd2-f4 Ke8-e7 Qf4-c7+ Ke7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Nf7xg5 Kf6-g6 Qc7xh7+
Kg6-f6 Qh7-f7+) -M6/51 1 Black resigns} 15. Ng5 d4 {(d5-d4 Qd2-f4 Ke8-d7
Nb1-c3 d4xc3 Rf1-d1+ Kd7-c6 Qf4-d6+ Kc6-b5 a2-a4+ Kb5-c4 Qd6xe6+ Kc4-b4
Qe6-b3+) -M7/48 1 Black resigns} 16. Nxe6 Kf7 {(Ke8-f7 Ne6-c7 g6-g5 Qd2xg5
h7-h6 Qg5-f5+ Kf7-e7 Qf5-e6+ Ke7-f8 Qe6-f6+ Kf8-g8 Nc7-e6 d4-d3 Qf6-g7+)
-M7/46 1 Black resigns} 17. Nxc5 b6 {(b7-b6 Qd2xd4 b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6
Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4 Qe5-f5+) -M6/54 1 Black resigns}
18. Qxd4 bxc5 {(b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6 Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4
Qe5-f5+) -M5/145 1 Black resigns} 19. Qd6 c4 {(c5-c4 Rf1-d1 a5-a4 Qd6-c7+
Kf7-e6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns} 20. Re1 h5 {(h7-h5
Re1-d1 h5-h4 Qd6-c7+ Kf7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns}
21. Re3 Kg7 {(Kf7-g7 Re3-f3 Kg7-h7 Qd6-e7+ Kh7-h6 Qe7-f8+ Kh6-g5 Qf8-f4+)
-M4/245 0 Black resigns} 22. Rg3 h4 {(h5-h4 Rg3xg6+ Kg7-h7 Qd6-f6 a5-a4
Qf6-g7+) -M3/245 0 Black resigns} 23. Rxg6+ Kh8 {(Kg7-h8 Qd6-f8+ Kh8-h7
Rg6-h6+) -M2/245 0 Black resigns} 24. Qf8+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7 Rg6-h6+) -M1/245 0
Black resigns} 25. Qg7# 1-0[/pgn]

[mwyoung]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It does not support your theory. A score of 15 or higher is expected from a GM player. You just ignored everything.
And this was also the same positions repeating. And mistakes were made in the games. Unlike chessqueen who made ZERO!

So now you want to throw out data of the match, and cherry pick.....

This supports Centipawn analysis.

And you are clueless here. This is not a comparison of players of this match. One has nothing to do with the other. This is determining if a players precision is above expected human norms. Based on the stats of the best players in the world. Everything else is just a bonus. Who played better, and who is the stronger and more accurate player.

GM Smerdon played within humans norms as shown by the results. Chessqueen did not and played way outside expected human norms of a GM Player. And Chessqueen is not a GM.

More results coming.

I wonder what is the average error rate in the following game of both opponents
I took extreme case when I knew I can win easily.

If my error rate is smaller than stockfish when I did not find the fastest mates then it proves my point

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-7QE6S12"]
[Date "2020.12.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "àåøé"]
[Black "Stockfish_20112916_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2200"]
[Time "08:56:25"]
[WhiteElo "2400"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "1nb1kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 g6 {(g7-g6 Ng1-e2 b7-b6 d2-d3 Nb8-c6 g2-g4 e7-e6 Bf1-g2 Bf8-g7 O-O
Ng8-e7 g4-g5 Ke8-f8 Qd1-d2 Bc8-a6 c2-c3 Nc6-e5 Ne2-f4 d7-d5 Rf1-d1 d5xe4
d3xe4 Kf8-g8 h2-h4) -22.78/29 12} 2. d4 e6 {(e7-e6 c2-c3 b7-b6 Bc1-f4
Bf8-d6 Bf4-e3 f7-f5 e4-e5 Bd6-f8 Qd1-a4 a7-a5 Nb1-d2 Ng8-e7 c3-c4 Ne7-c6
Nd2-f3 Bc8-b7 a2-a3 Nc6-e7 O-O-O Bb7-c6 Qa4-b3 Bc6xf3 Ng1xf3 Ne7-c6 h2-h4
Bf8-g7 h4-h5 Ke8-f7 Nf3-d2 Kf7-g8 h5xg6 h7xg6) -22.67/27 4} 3. Nf3 d6
{(d7-d6 Bc1-g5 f7-f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Nb1-c3 Bf8-e7 Bg5-c1 a7-a6 d4-d5 Ng8-f6
Qd1-d4 c7-c5 Qd4-a4+ b7-b5 Qa4-b3 c5-c4 Bf1xc4 Nf6-e4 Nc3xb5 a6xb5 Qb3xb5+
Nb8-d7) -22.63/23 2} 4. Bc4 Nc6 {(Nb8-c6 c2-c3 Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ng8-f6 Bc4-d3
Ke8-f8 O-O Kf8-g7 Rf1-e1 Bh6xd2 Bc1xd2 a7-a6 Qd1-a4 Nc6-e7 h2-h3 h7-h5
Qa4-b3 Ne7-c6 Re1-e2 Nc6-e7 a2-a3 Ne7-c6 c3-c4 e6-e5 d4-d5 Nc6-e7)
-22.37/26 1} 5. O-O Bh6 {(Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ke8-f8 c2-c3 Kf8-g7 Bc4-d3 Bh6xd2
Bc1xd2 b7-b6 Qd1-e2 Bc8-b7 g2-g4 Nc6-e7 g4-g5 d6-d5 e4-e5 a7-a6 a2-a4
Ne7-c6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 b4-b5 a6xb5 a4xb5 Nc6-d8) -22.44/25 2 Black resigns} 6.
Bxh6 Nxh6 {(Ng8xh6 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8 Qd2-c3 h7-h6 d4-d5 Nc6-e7 d5xe6 f7xe6
Bc4-b3 c7-c6 Rf1-d1 d6-d5 Qc3-g7 b7-b5 Nf3-e5 Bc8-d7 Nb1-c3 a7-a5 Qg7-f7+
Ke8-d8 a2-a4 b5-b4 Nc3-e2 Kd8-c7 f2-f3 g6-g5 Qf7-h5 Kc7-d8 c2-c3 b4xc3
Ne2xc3 Kd8-c8) -22.59/28 3 Black resigns} 7. d5 Ne5 {(Nc6-e5 Nf3xe5)
-23.99/29 18 Black resigns} 8. Nxe5 a6 {(a7-a6 Ne5-f3 e6-e5 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8
Qd2-a5 b7-b6 Qa5-c3 f7-f6 Nf3-d2 Ke8-d8 Qc3-e3 Kd8-e7 Nb1-c3 a6-a5 Bc4-b3
Bc8-d7 a2-a4 h7-h5 Qe3-e2 Ke7-d8 Qe2-a6 Bd7-c8 Qa6-c4 Bc8-d7 Ra1-e1 Kd8-c8
f2-f3 Ng8-e7) -24.80/27 7 Black resigns} 9. dxe6 Bxe6 {(Bc8xe6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Ke8-d7 Qg4-h4 h7-h6 Qh4-f6 Nf7-d8 Qf6-g7+ Kd7-c8
Qg7xh6 b7-b5 Qh6xg6 Kc8-b7 Qg6-g8 Nd8-c6 Qg8xe6 Nc6-a5 Qe6-d5+ Kb7-b6
Nb1-c3 Na5-c6 Qd5-f7 Kb6-b7 a2-a3) -24.40/20 1 Black resigns} 10. Bxe6 fxe6
{(f7xe6 Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Nf7-d8 Qg4-h3 e6-e5 Qh3xh7 Nd8-e6 Qh7xg6+
Ke8-e7 Qg6xe6+ Ke7xe6 g2-g3 a6-a5 Nb1-c3 c7-c6 Kg1-g2 Ke6-f7 a2-a4 Kf7-f6
Kg2-f3 Kf6-g7 h2-h3 Kg7-g6 h3-h4 b7-b6) -25.03/24 4 Black resigns} 11. Nf3
Nf7 {(Nh6-f7 Qd1-d4) -26.02/24 16 Black resigns} 12. Qd2 c5 {(c7-c5 Qd2-f4
b7-b5 Qf4-f6 b5-b4 Qf6xe6+ Ke8-f8 Qe6xf7+ Kf8xf7 Nb1-d2 Kf7-e6 Nf3-g5+
Ke6-e7 Ng5xh7 d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke7-d6 Nh7-f6 Kd6-e5 Nd2-e4 c5-c4 h2-h4 c4-c3
b2xc3 b4xc3 g2-g4) -24.94/22 3 Black resigns} 13. Ng5 a5 {(a6-a5 Ng5xf7
d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke8xf7 d5xe6+ Kf7-e7 Rf1-e1 a5-a4 Qd2-f4 c5-c4 Re1-d1 Ke7xe6
Rd1-d6+ Ke6-e7 Qf4-f6+ Ke7-e8 Rd6-d8+) -M9/24 4 Black resigns} 14. Nxf7 d5
{(d6-d5 Qd2-f4 Ke8-e7 Qf4-c7+ Ke7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Nf7xg5 Kf6-g6 Qc7xh7+
Kg6-f6 Qh7-f7+) -M6/51 1 Black resigns} 15. Ng5 d4 {(d5-d4 Qd2-f4 Ke8-d7
Nb1-c3 d4xc3 Rf1-d1+ Kd7-c6 Qf4-d6+ Kc6-b5 a2-a4+ Kb5-c4 Qd6xe6+ Kc4-b4
Qe6-b3+) -M7/48 1 Black resigns} 16. Nxe6 Kf7 {(Ke8-f7 Ne6-c7 g6-g5 Qd2xg5
h7-h6 Qg5-f5+ Kf7-e7 Qf5-e6+ Ke7-f8 Qe6-f6+ Kf8-g8 Nc7-e6 d4-d3 Qf6-g7+)
-M7/46 1 Black resigns} 17. Nxc5 b6 {(b7-b6 Qd2xd4 b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6
Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4 Qe5-f5+) -M6/54 1 Black resigns}
18. Qxd4 bxc5 {(b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6 Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4
Qe5-f5+) -M5/145 1 Black resigns} 19. Qd6 c4 {(c5-c4 Rf1-d1 a5-a4 Qd6-c7+
Kf7-e6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns} 20. Re1 h5 {(h7-h5
Re1-d1 h5-h4 Qd6-c7+ Kf7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns}
21. Re3 Kg7 {(Kf7-g7 Re3-f3 Kg7-h7 Qd6-e7+ Kh7-h6 Qe7-f8+ Kh6-g5 Qf8-f4+)
-M4/245 0 Black resigns} 22. Rg3 h4 {(h5-h4 Rg3xg6+ Kg7-h7 Qd6-f6 a5-a4
Qf6-g7+) -M3/245 0 Black resigns} 23. Rxg6+ Kh8 {(Kg7-h8 Qd6-f8+ Kh8-h7
Rg6-h6+) -M2/245 0 Black resigns} 24. Qf8+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7 Rg6-h6+) -M1/245 0
Black resigns} 25. Qg7# 1-0[/pgn]

I will look at the game later today. And post the results. I hope you realize this is a statistical measurement. And any one game even without odds can show anything. That is why you can not cherry pick data. All the matches we are looking at have many games. And the match as a whole is what you look at for the data.

Meaning it is not really the game that is the most important. It is a meaningful number of moves.

And remember we are not comparing the players in the match.

We are comparing the strong side only. Or the player that starts with all his material. In the odds games. To see if your theory stands. Will that human player ever look like a computer play. As chessqueen.

I have analyzed most of the odds games on Larry's site, and so far the answer is no.

[JJJ]

In the meantime, Did Penguin say yes for a match ?

No, I didn't get a reply from him.

Maybe he doesn't know you enough ? Maybe someone knowing him well should ask him instead because he might received thousands of messages everyday ?

Could be, no way to tell. If someone who knows him well wants to ask him, that's fine with me.

I asked on lichess forums. Sometimes he gets around.

[Chessqueen]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It does not support your theory. A score of 15 or higher is expected from a GM player. You just ignored everything.
And this was also the same positions repeating. And mistakes were made in the games. Unlike chessqueen who made ZERO!

So now you want to throw out data of the match, and cherry pick.....

This supports Centipawn analysis.

And you are clueless here. This is not a comparison of players of this match. One has nothing to do with the other. This is determining if a players precision is above expected human norms. Based on the stats of the best players in the world. Everything else is just a bonus. Who played better, and who is the stronger and more accurate player.

GM Smerdon played within humans norms as shown by the results. Chessqueen did not and played way outside expected human norms of a GM Player. And Chessqueen is not a GM.

More results coming.

I wonder what is the average error rate in the following game of both opponents
I took extreme case when I knew I can win easily.

If my error rate is smaller than stockfish when I did not find the fastest mates then it proves my point

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-7QE6S12"]
[Date "2020.12.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "àåøé"]
[Black "Stockfish_20112916_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2200"]
[Time "08:56:25"]
[WhiteElo "2400"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "1nb1kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 g6 {(g7-g6 Ng1-e2 b7-b6 d2-d3 Nb8-c6 g2-g4 e7-e6 Bf1-g2 Bf8-g7 O-O
Ng8-e7 g4-g5 Ke8-f8 Qd1-d2 Bc8-a6 c2-c3 Nc6-e5 Ne2-f4 d7-d5 Rf1-d1 d5xe4
d3xe4 Kf8-g8 h2-h4) -22.78/29 12} 2. d4 e6 {(e7-e6 c2-c3 b7-b6 Bc1-f4
Bf8-d6 Bf4-e3 f7-f5 e4-e5 Bd6-f8 Qd1-a4 a7-a5 Nb1-d2 Ng8-e7 c3-c4 Ne7-c6
Nd2-f3 Bc8-b7 a2-a3 Nc6-e7 O-O-O Bb7-c6 Qa4-b3 Bc6xf3 Ng1xf3 Ne7-c6 h2-h4
Bf8-g7 h4-h5 Ke8-f7 Nf3-d2 Kf7-g8 h5xg6 h7xg6) -22.67/27 4} 3. Nf3 d6
{(d7-d6 Bc1-g5 f7-f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Nb1-c3 Bf8-e7 Bg5-c1 a7-a6 d4-d5 Ng8-f6
Qd1-d4 c7-c5 Qd4-a4+ b7-b5 Qa4-b3 c5-c4 Bf1xc4 Nf6-e4 Nc3xb5 a6xb5 Qb3xb5+
Nb8-d7) -22.63/23 2} 4. Bc4 Nc6 {(Nb8-c6 c2-c3 Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ng8-f6 Bc4-d3
Ke8-f8 O-O Kf8-g7 Rf1-e1 Bh6xd2 Bc1xd2 a7-a6 Qd1-a4 Nc6-e7 h2-h3 h7-h5
Qa4-b3 Ne7-c6 Re1-e2 Nc6-e7 a2-a3 Ne7-c6 c3-c4 e6-e5 d4-d5 Nc6-e7)
-22.37/26 1} 5. O-O Bh6 {(Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ke8-f8 c2-c3 Kf8-g7 Bc4-d3 Bh6xd2
Bc1xd2 b7-b6 Qd1-e2 Bc8-b7 g2-g4 Nc6-e7 g4-g5 d6-d5 e4-e5 a7-a6 a2-a4
Ne7-c6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 b4-b5 a6xb5 a4xb5 Nc6-d8) -22.44/25 2 Black resigns} 6.
Bxh6 Nxh6 {(Ng8xh6 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8 Qd2-c3 h7-h6 d4-d5 Nc6-e7 d5xe6 f7xe6
Bc4-b3 c7-c6 Rf1-d1 d6-d5 Qc3-g7 b7-b5 Nf3-e5 Bc8-d7 Nb1-c3 a7-a5 Qg7-f7+
Ke8-d8 a2-a4 b5-b4 Nc3-e2 Kd8-c7 f2-f3 g6-g5 Qf7-h5 Kc7-d8 c2-c3 b4xc3
Ne2xc3 Kd8-c8) -22.59/28 3 Black resigns} 7. d5 Ne5 {(Nc6-e5 Nf3xe5)
-23.99/29 18 Black resigns} 8. Nxe5 a6 {(a7-a6 Ne5-f3 e6-e5 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8
Qd2-a5 b7-b6 Qa5-c3 f7-f6 Nf3-d2 Ke8-d8 Qc3-e3 Kd8-e7 Nb1-c3 a6-a5 Bc4-b3
Bc8-d7 a2-a4 h7-h5 Qe3-e2 Ke7-d8 Qe2-a6 Bd7-c8 Qa6-c4 Bc8-d7 Ra1-e1 Kd8-c8
f2-f3 Ng8-e7) -24.80/27 7 Black resigns} 9. dxe6 Bxe6 {(Bc8xe6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Ke8-d7 Qg4-h4 h7-h6 Qh4-f6 Nf7-d8 Qf6-g7+ Kd7-c8
Qg7xh6 b7-b5 Qh6xg6 Kc8-b7 Qg6-g8 Nd8-c6 Qg8xe6 Nc6-a5 Qe6-d5+ Kb7-b6
Nb1-c3 Na5-c6 Qd5-f7 Kb6-b7 a2-a3) -24.40/20 1 Black resigns} 10. Bxe6 fxe6
{(f7xe6 Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Nf7-d8 Qg4-h3 e6-e5 Qh3xh7 Nd8-e6 Qh7xg6+
Ke8-e7 Qg6xe6+ Ke7xe6 g2-g3 a6-a5 Nb1-c3 c7-c6 Kg1-g2 Ke6-f7 a2-a4 Kf7-f6
Kg2-f3 Kf6-g7 h2-h3 Kg7-g6 h3-h4 b7-b6) -25.03/24 4 Black resigns} 11. Nf3
Nf7 {(Nh6-f7 Qd1-d4) -26.02/24 16 Black resigns} 12. Qd2 c5 {(c7-c5 Qd2-f4
b7-b5 Qf4-f6 b5-b4 Qf6xe6+ Ke8-f8 Qe6xf7+ Kf8xf7 Nb1-d2 Kf7-e6 Nf3-g5+
Ke6-e7 Ng5xh7 d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke7-d6 Nh7-f6 Kd6-e5 Nd2-e4 c5-c4 h2-h4 c4-c3
b2xc3 b4xc3 g2-g4) -24.94/22 3 Black resigns} 13. Ng5 a5 {(a6-a5 Ng5xf7
d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke8xf7 d5xe6+ Kf7-e7 Rf1-e1 a5-a4 Qd2-f4 c5-c4 Re1-d1 Ke7xe6
Rd1-d6+ Ke6-e7 Qf4-f6+ Ke7-e8 Rd6-d8+) -M9/24 4 Black resigns} 14. Nxf7 d5
{(d6-d5 Qd2-f4 Ke8-e7 Qf4-c7+ Ke7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Nf7xg5 Kf6-g6 Qc7xh7+
Kg6-f6 Qh7-f7+) -M6/51 1 Black resigns} 15. Ng5 d4 {(d5-d4 Qd2-f4 Ke8-d7
Nb1-c3 d4xc3 Rf1-d1+ Kd7-c6 Qf4-d6+ Kc6-b5 a2-a4+ Kb5-c4 Qd6xe6+ Kc4-b4
Qe6-b3+) -M7/48 1 Black resigns} 16. Nxe6 Kf7 {(Ke8-f7 Ne6-c7 g6-g5 Qd2xg5
h7-h6 Qg5-f5+ Kf7-e7 Qf5-e6+ Ke7-f8 Qe6-f6+ Kf8-g8 Nc7-e6 d4-d3 Qf6-g7+)
-M7/46 1 Black resigns} 17. Nxc5 b6 {(b7-b6 Qd2xd4 b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6
Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4 Qe5-f5+) -M6/54 1 Black resigns}
18. Qxd4 bxc5 {(b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6 Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4
Qe5-f5+) -M5/145 1 Black resigns} 19. Qd6 c4 {(c5-c4 Rf1-d1 a5-a4 Qd6-c7+
Kf7-e6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns} 20. Re1 h5 {(h7-h5
Re1-d1 h5-h4 Qd6-c7+ Kf7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns}
21. Re3 Kg7 {(Kf7-g7 Re3-f3 Kg7-h7 Qd6-e7+ Kh7-h6 Qe7-f8+ Kh6-g5 Qf8-f4+)
-M4/245 0 Black resigns} 22. Rg3 h4 {(h5-h4 Rg3xg6+ Kg7-h7 Qd6-f6 a5-a4
Qf6-g7+) -M3/245 0 Black resigns} 23. Rxg6+ Kh8 {(Kg7-h8 Qd6-f8+ Kh8-h7
Rg6-h6+) -M2/245 0 Black resigns} 24. Qf8+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7 Rg6-h6+) -M1/245 0
Black resigns} 25. Qg7# 1-0[/pgn]

I will look at the game later today. And post the results. I hope you realize this is a statistical measurement. And any one game even without odds can show anything. That is why you can not cherry pick data. All the matches we are looking at have many games. And the match as a whole is what you look at for the data.

Meaning it is not really the game that is the most important. It is a meaningful number of moves.

And remember we are not comparing the players in the match.

We are comparing the strong side only. Or the player that starts with all his material. In the odds games. To see if your theory stands. Will that human player ever look like a computer play. As chessqueen.

I have analyzed most of the odds games on Larry's site, and so far the answer is no.

I do NOT know why you are accusing me of using an engine when the advantage is clearly close to a Rook, and my online trainer who constantly tell me that I think very precise when I am ahead in material even to nickname me Capa and always telling me that I am advancing fast, but anyway I decided to set upu another position where the advantage is close to a Rook Anyway I used Komodo Free Version this time. mwyoung, If you live in the USA I would pay for 1/3 of the plane ticket if you can bring your computer and I will replay some of these Odds, but I would like to bet $300.00 for each game using some of the Odds that I have posted here. On this game Komodo resigned because after exchanging the pawns White bishop can NOT take because I would fork both Bishops by placing my Queen on d5 !

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site "MyTown"]
[Date "2020.09.12"]
[Round "7"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "ChessQueen"]
[Result "0-1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "3qkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PP1PPPPP/1NB1KBNR w Kk - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[TimeControl "1200+10"]

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qf5 4. d3 Nf6 5. Nf3 g6 6. Be2 Bg7 7. O-O O-O 8.
d4 Nd5 9. Nxd5 Qxd5 10. b3 Bxd4 11. Nxd4 Qxd4 12. a4 Rd8 13. Bc4 Qe4 14. Be3
Qc2 15. h3 Rd1 16. Rxd1 Qxd1+ 17. Kh2 Kg7 18. Kg3 a6 19. Kh2 g5 20. Bxg5 b5 0-1[/pgn]

[mwyoung]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It does not support your theory. A score of 15 or higher is expected from a GM player. You just ignored everything.
And this was also the same positions repeating. And mistakes were made in the games. Unlike chessqueen who made ZERO!

So now you want to throw out data of the match, and cherry pick.....

This supports Centipawn analysis.

And you are clueless here. This is not a comparison of players of this match. One has nothing to do with the other. This is determining if a players precision is above expected human norms. Based on the stats of the best players in the world. Everything else is just a bonus. Who played better, and who is the stronger and more accurate player.

GM Smerdon played within humans norms as shown by the results. Chessqueen did not and played way outside expected human norms of a GM Player. And Chessqueen is not a GM.

More results coming.

I wonder what is the average error rate in the following game of both opponents
I took extreme case when I knew I can win easily.

If my error rate is smaller than stockfish when I did not find the fastest mates then it proves my point

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-7QE6S12"]
[Date "2020.12.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "àåøé"]
[Black "Stockfish_20112916_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2200"]
[Time "08:56:25"]
[WhiteElo "2400"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "1nb1kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 g6 {(g7-g6 Ng1-e2 b7-b6 d2-d3 Nb8-c6 g2-g4 e7-e6 Bf1-g2 Bf8-g7 O-O
Ng8-e7 g4-g5 Ke8-f8 Qd1-d2 Bc8-a6 c2-c3 Nc6-e5 Ne2-f4 d7-d5 Rf1-d1 d5xe4
d3xe4 Kf8-g8 h2-h4) -22.78/29 12} 2. d4 e6 {(e7-e6 c2-c3 b7-b6 Bc1-f4
Bf8-d6 Bf4-e3 f7-f5 e4-e5 Bd6-f8 Qd1-a4 a7-a5 Nb1-d2 Ng8-e7 c3-c4 Ne7-c6
Nd2-f3 Bc8-b7 a2-a3 Nc6-e7 O-O-O Bb7-c6 Qa4-b3 Bc6xf3 Ng1xf3 Ne7-c6 h2-h4
Bf8-g7 h4-h5 Ke8-f7 Nf3-d2 Kf7-g8 h5xg6 h7xg6) -22.67/27 4} 3. Nf3 d6
{(d7-d6 Bc1-g5 f7-f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Nb1-c3 Bf8-e7 Bg5-c1 a7-a6 d4-d5 Ng8-f6
Qd1-d4 c7-c5 Qd4-a4+ b7-b5 Qa4-b3 c5-c4 Bf1xc4 Nf6-e4 Nc3xb5 a6xb5 Qb3xb5+
Nb8-d7) -22.63/23 2} 4. Bc4 Nc6 {(Nb8-c6 c2-c3 Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ng8-f6 Bc4-d3
Ke8-f8 O-O Kf8-g7 Rf1-e1 Bh6xd2 Bc1xd2 a7-a6 Qd1-a4 Nc6-e7 h2-h3 h7-h5
Qa4-b3 Ne7-c6 Re1-e2 Nc6-e7 a2-a3 Ne7-c6 c3-c4 e6-e5 d4-d5 Nc6-e7)
-22.37/26 1} 5. O-O Bh6 {(Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ke8-f8 c2-c3 Kf8-g7 Bc4-d3 Bh6xd2
Bc1xd2 b7-b6 Qd1-e2 Bc8-b7 g2-g4 Nc6-e7 g4-g5 d6-d5 e4-e5 a7-a6 a2-a4
Ne7-c6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 b4-b5 a6xb5 a4xb5 Nc6-d8) -22.44/25 2 Black resigns} 6.
Bxh6 Nxh6 {(Ng8xh6 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8 Qd2-c3 h7-h6 d4-d5 Nc6-e7 d5xe6 f7xe6
Bc4-b3 c7-c6 Rf1-d1 d6-d5 Qc3-g7 b7-b5 Nf3-e5 Bc8-d7 Nb1-c3 a7-a5 Qg7-f7+
Ke8-d8 a2-a4 b5-b4 Nc3-e2 Kd8-c7 f2-f3 g6-g5 Qf7-h5 Kc7-d8 c2-c3 b4xc3
Ne2xc3 Kd8-c8) -22.59/28 3 Black resigns} 7. d5 Ne5 {(Nc6-e5 Nf3xe5)
-23.99/29 18 Black resigns} 8. Nxe5 a6 {(a7-a6 Ne5-f3 e6-e5 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8
Qd2-a5 b7-b6 Qa5-c3 f7-f6 Nf3-d2 Ke8-d8 Qc3-e3 Kd8-e7 Nb1-c3 a6-a5 Bc4-b3
Bc8-d7 a2-a4 h7-h5 Qe3-e2 Ke7-d8 Qe2-a6 Bd7-c8 Qa6-c4 Bc8-d7 Ra1-e1 Kd8-c8
f2-f3 Ng8-e7) -24.80/27 7 Black resigns} 9. dxe6 Bxe6 {(Bc8xe6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Ke8-d7 Qg4-h4 h7-h6 Qh4-f6 Nf7-d8 Qf6-g7+ Kd7-c8
Qg7xh6 b7-b5 Qh6xg6 Kc8-b7 Qg6-g8 Nd8-c6 Qg8xe6 Nc6-a5 Qe6-d5+ Kb7-b6
Nb1-c3 Na5-c6 Qd5-f7 Kb6-b7 a2-a3) -24.40/20 1 Black resigns} 10. Bxe6 fxe6
{(f7xe6 Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Nf7-d8 Qg4-h3 e6-e5 Qh3xh7 Nd8-e6 Qh7xg6+
Ke8-e7 Qg6xe6+ Ke7xe6 g2-g3 a6-a5 Nb1-c3 c7-c6 Kg1-g2 Ke6-f7 a2-a4 Kf7-f6
Kg2-f3 Kf6-g7 h2-h3 Kg7-g6 h3-h4 b7-b6) -25.03/24 4 Black resigns} 11. Nf3
Nf7 {(Nh6-f7 Qd1-d4) -26.02/24 16 Black resigns} 12. Qd2 c5 {(c7-c5 Qd2-f4
b7-b5 Qf4-f6 b5-b4 Qf6xe6+ Ke8-f8 Qe6xf7+ Kf8xf7 Nb1-d2 Kf7-e6 Nf3-g5+
Ke6-e7 Ng5xh7 d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke7-d6 Nh7-f6 Kd6-e5 Nd2-e4 c5-c4 h2-h4 c4-c3
b2xc3 b4xc3 g2-g4) -24.94/22 3 Black resigns} 13. Ng5 a5 {(a6-a5 Ng5xf7
d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke8xf7 d5xe6+ Kf7-e7 Rf1-e1 a5-a4 Qd2-f4 c5-c4 Re1-d1 Ke7xe6
Rd1-d6+ Ke6-e7 Qf4-f6+ Ke7-e8 Rd6-d8+) -M9/24 4 Black resigns} 14. Nxf7 d5
{(d6-d5 Qd2-f4 Ke8-e7 Qf4-c7+ Ke7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Nf7xg5 Kf6-g6 Qc7xh7+
Kg6-f6 Qh7-f7+) -M6/51 1 Black resigns} 15. Ng5 d4 {(d5-d4 Qd2-f4 Ke8-d7
Nb1-c3 d4xc3 Rf1-d1+ Kd7-c6 Qf4-d6+ Kc6-b5 a2-a4+ Kb5-c4 Qd6xe6+ Kc4-b4
Qe6-b3+) -M7/48 1 Black resigns} 16. Nxe6 Kf7 {(Ke8-f7 Ne6-c7 g6-g5 Qd2xg5
h7-h6 Qg5-f5+ Kf7-e7 Qf5-e6+ Ke7-f8 Qe6-f6+ Kf8-g8 Nc7-e6 d4-d3 Qf6-g7+)
-M7/46 1 Black resigns} 17. Nxc5 b6 {(b7-b6 Qd2xd4 b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6
Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4 Qe5-f5+) -M6/54 1 Black resigns}
18. Qxd4 bxc5 {(b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6 Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4
Qe5-f5+) -M5/145 1 Black resigns} 19. Qd6 c4 {(c5-c4 Rf1-d1 a5-a4 Qd6-c7+
Kf7-e6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns} 20. Re1 h5 {(h7-h5
Re1-d1 h5-h4 Qd6-c7+ Kf7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns}
21. Re3 Kg7 {(Kf7-g7 Re3-f3 Kg7-h7 Qd6-e7+ Kh7-h6 Qe7-f8+ Kh6-g5 Qf8-f4+)
-M4/245 0 Black resigns} 22. Rg3 h4 {(h5-h4 Rg3xg6+ Kg7-h7 Qd6-f6 a5-a4
Qf6-g7+) -M3/245 0 Black resigns} 23. Rxg6+ Kh8 {(Kg7-h8 Qd6-f8+ Kh8-h7
Rg6-h6+) -M2/245 0 Black resigns} 24. Qf8+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7 Rg6-h6+) -M1/245 0
Black resigns} 25. Qg7# 1-0[/pgn]

I will look at the game later today. And post the results. I hope you realize this is a statistical measurement. And any one game even without odds can show anything. That is why you can not cherry pick data. All the matches we are looking at have many games. And the match as a whole is what you look at for the data.

Meaning it is not really the game that is the most important. It is a meaningful number of moves.

And remember we are not comparing the players in the match.

We are comparing the strong side only. Or the player that starts with all his material. In the odds games. To see if your theory stands. Will that human player ever look like a computer play. As chessqueen.

I have analyzed most of the odds games on Larry's site, and so far the answer is no.

I do NOT know why you are accusing me of using an engine when the advantage is clearly close to a Rook, and my online trainer who constantly tell me that I think very precise when I am ahead in material even to nickname me Capa and always telling me that I am advancing fast, but anyway I decided to set upu another position where the advantage is close to a Rook Anyway I used Komodo Free Version this time. mwyoung, If you live in the USA I would pay for 1/3 of the plane ticket if you can bring your computer and I will replay some of these Odds, but I would like to bet $300.00 for each game using some of the Odds that I have posted here. On this game Komodo resigned because after exchanging the pawns White bishop can NOT take because I would fork both Bishops by placing my Queen on d5 !

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site "MyTown"]
[Date "2020.09.12"]
[Round "7"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "ChessQueen"]
[Result "0-1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "3qkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PP1PPPPP/1NB1KBNR w Kk - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[TimeControl "1200+10"]

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qf5 4. d3 Nf6 5. Nf3 g6 6. Be2 Bg7 7. O-O O-O 8.
d4 Nd5 9. Nxd5 Qxd5 10. b3 Bxd4 11. Nxd4 Qxd4 12. a4 Rd8 13. Bc4 Qe4 14. Be3
Qc2 15. h3 Rd1 16. Rxd1 Qxd1+ 17. Kh2 Kg7 18. Kg3 a6 19. Kh2 g5 20. Bxg5 b5 0-1[/pgn]

You were tricking us. You only cheated yourself.

[Chessqueen]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It does not support your theory. A score of 15 or higher is expected from a GM player. You just ignored everything.
And this was also the same positions repeating. And mistakes were made in the games. Unlike chessqueen who made ZERO!

So now you want to throw out data of the match, and cherry pick.....

This supports Centipawn analysis.

And you are clueless here. This is not a comparison of players of this match. One has nothing to do with the other. This is determining if a players precision is above expected human norms. Based on the stats of the best players in the world. Everything else is just a bonus. Who played better, and who is the stronger and more accurate player.

GM Smerdon played within humans norms as shown by the results. Chessqueen did not and played way outside expected human norms of a GM Player. And Chessqueen is not a GM.

More results coming.

I wonder what is the average error rate in the following game of both opponents
I took extreme case when I knew I can win easily.

If my error rate is smaller than stockfish when I did not find the fastest mates then it proves my point

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-7QE6S12"]
[Date "2020.12.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "àåøé"]
[Black "Stockfish_20112916_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2200"]
[Time "08:56:25"]
[WhiteElo "2400"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "1nb1kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 g6 {(g7-g6 Ng1-e2 b7-b6 d2-d3 Nb8-c6 g2-g4 e7-e6 Bf1-g2 Bf8-g7 O-O
Ng8-e7 g4-g5 Ke8-f8 Qd1-d2 Bc8-a6 c2-c3 Nc6-e5 Ne2-f4 d7-d5 Rf1-d1 d5xe4
d3xe4 Kf8-g8 h2-h4) -22.78/29 12} 2. d4 e6 {(e7-e6 c2-c3 b7-b6 Bc1-f4
Bf8-d6 Bf4-e3 f7-f5 e4-e5 Bd6-f8 Qd1-a4 a7-a5 Nb1-d2 Ng8-e7 c3-c4 Ne7-c6
Nd2-f3 Bc8-b7 a2-a3 Nc6-e7 O-O-O Bb7-c6 Qa4-b3 Bc6xf3 Ng1xf3 Ne7-c6 h2-h4
Bf8-g7 h4-h5 Ke8-f7 Nf3-d2 Kf7-g8 h5xg6 h7xg6) -22.67/27 4} 3. Nf3 d6
{(d7-d6 Bc1-g5 f7-f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Nb1-c3 Bf8-e7 Bg5-c1 a7-a6 d4-d5 Ng8-f6
Qd1-d4 c7-c5 Qd4-a4+ b7-b5 Qa4-b3 c5-c4 Bf1xc4 Nf6-e4 Nc3xb5 a6xb5 Qb3xb5+
Nb8-d7) -22.63/23 2} 4. Bc4 Nc6 {(Nb8-c6 c2-c3 Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ng8-f6 Bc4-d3
Ke8-f8 O-O Kf8-g7 Rf1-e1 Bh6xd2 Bc1xd2 a7-a6 Qd1-a4 Nc6-e7 h2-h3 h7-h5
Qa4-b3 Ne7-c6 Re1-e2 Nc6-e7 a2-a3 Ne7-c6 c3-c4 e6-e5 d4-d5 Nc6-e7)
-22.37/26 1} 5. O-O Bh6 {(Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ke8-f8 c2-c3 Kf8-g7 Bc4-d3 Bh6xd2
Bc1xd2 b7-b6 Qd1-e2 Bc8-b7 g2-g4 Nc6-e7 g4-g5 d6-d5 e4-e5 a7-a6 a2-a4
Ne7-c6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 b4-b5 a6xb5 a4xb5 Nc6-d8) -22.44/25 2 Black resigns} 6.
Bxh6 Nxh6 {(Ng8xh6 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8 Qd2-c3 h7-h6 d4-d5 Nc6-e7 d5xe6 f7xe6
Bc4-b3 c7-c6 Rf1-d1 d6-d5 Qc3-g7 b7-b5 Nf3-e5 Bc8-d7 Nb1-c3 a7-a5 Qg7-f7+
Ke8-d8 a2-a4 b5-b4 Nc3-e2 Kd8-c7 f2-f3 g6-g5 Qf7-h5 Kc7-d8 c2-c3 b4xc3
Ne2xc3 Kd8-c8) -22.59/28 3 Black resigns} 7. d5 Ne5 {(Nc6-e5 Nf3xe5)
-23.99/29 18 Black resigns} 8. Nxe5 a6 {(a7-a6 Ne5-f3 e6-e5 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8
Qd2-a5 b7-b6 Qa5-c3 f7-f6 Nf3-d2 Ke8-d8 Qc3-e3 Kd8-e7 Nb1-c3 a6-a5 Bc4-b3
Bc8-d7 a2-a4 h7-h5 Qe3-e2 Ke7-d8 Qe2-a6 Bd7-c8 Qa6-c4 Bc8-d7 Ra1-e1 Kd8-c8
f2-f3 Ng8-e7) -24.80/27 7 Black resigns} 9. dxe6 Bxe6 {(Bc8xe6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Ke8-d7 Qg4-h4 h7-h6 Qh4-f6 Nf7-d8 Qf6-g7+ Kd7-c8
Qg7xh6 b7-b5 Qh6xg6 Kc8-b7 Qg6-g8 Nd8-c6 Qg8xe6 Nc6-a5 Qe6-d5+ Kb7-b6
Nb1-c3 Na5-c6 Qd5-f7 Kb6-b7 a2-a3) -24.40/20 1 Black resigns} 10. Bxe6 fxe6
{(f7xe6 Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Nf7-d8 Qg4-h3 e6-e5 Qh3xh7 Nd8-e6 Qh7xg6+
Ke8-e7 Qg6xe6+ Ke7xe6 g2-g3 a6-a5 Nb1-c3 c7-c6 Kg1-g2 Ke6-f7 a2-a4 Kf7-f6
Kg2-f3 Kf6-g7 h2-h3 Kg7-g6 h3-h4 b7-b6) -25.03/24 4 Black resigns} 11. Nf3
Nf7 {(Nh6-f7 Qd1-d4) -26.02/24 16 Black resigns} 12. Qd2 c5 {(c7-c5 Qd2-f4
b7-b5 Qf4-f6 b5-b4 Qf6xe6+ Ke8-f8 Qe6xf7+ Kf8xf7 Nb1-d2 Kf7-e6 Nf3-g5+
Ke6-e7 Ng5xh7 d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke7-d6 Nh7-f6 Kd6-e5 Nd2-e4 c5-c4 h2-h4 c4-c3
b2xc3 b4xc3 g2-g4) -24.94/22 3 Black resigns} 13. Ng5 a5 {(a6-a5 Ng5xf7
d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke8xf7 d5xe6+ Kf7-e7 Rf1-e1 a5-a4 Qd2-f4 c5-c4 Re1-d1 Ke7xe6
Rd1-d6+ Ke6-e7 Qf4-f6+ Ke7-e8 Rd6-d8+) -M9/24 4 Black resigns} 14. Nxf7 d5
{(d6-d5 Qd2-f4 Ke8-e7 Qf4-c7+ Ke7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Nf7xg5 Kf6-g6 Qc7xh7+
Kg6-f6 Qh7-f7+) -M6/51 1 Black resigns} 15. Ng5 d4 {(d5-d4 Qd2-f4 Ke8-d7
Nb1-c3 d4xc3 Rf1-d1+ Kd7-c6 Qf4-d6+ Kc6-b5 a2-a4+ Kb5-c4 Qd6xe6+ Kc4-b4
Qe6-b3+) -M7/48 1 Black resigns} 16. Nxe6 Kf7 {(Ke8-f7 Ne6-c7 g6-g5 Qd2xg5
h7-h6 Qg5-f5+ Kf7-e7 Qf5-e6+ Ke7-f8 Qe6-f6+ Kf8-g8 Nc7-e6 d4-d3 Qf6-g7+)
-M7/46 1 Black resigns} 17. Nxc5 b6 {(b7-b6 Qd2xd4 b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6
Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4 Qe5-f5+) -M6/54 1 Black resigns}
18. Qxd4 bxc5 {(b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6 Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4
Qe5-f5+) -M5/145 1 Black resigns} 19. Qd6 c4 {(c5-c4 Rf1-d1 a5-a4 Qd6-c7+
Kf7-e6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns} 20. Re1 h5 {(h7-h5
Re1-d1 h5-h4 Qd6-c7+ Kf7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns}
21. Re3 Kg7 {(Kf7-g7 Re3-f3 Kg7-h7 Qd6-e7+ Kh7-h6 Qe7-f8+ Kh6-g5 Qf8-f4+)
-M4/245 0 Black resigns} 22. Rg3 h4 {(h5-h4 Rg3xg6+ Kg7-h7 Qd6-f6 a5-a4
Qf6-g7+) -M3/245 0 Black resigns} 23. Rxg6+ Kh8 {(Kg7-h8 Qd6-f8+ Kh8-h7
Rg6-h6+) -M2/245 0 Black resigns} 24. Qf8+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7 Rg6-h6+) -M1/245 0
Black resigns} 25. Qg7# 1-0[/pgn]

I will look at the game later today. And post the results. I hope you realize this is a statistical measurement. And any one game even without odds can show anything. That is why you can not cherry pick data. All the matches we are looking at have many games. And the match as a whole is what you look at for the data.

Meaning it is not really the game that is the most important. It is a meaningful number of moves.

And remember we are not comparing the players in the match.

We are comparing the strong side only. Or the player that starts with all his material. In the odds games. To see if your theory stands. Will that human player ever look like a computer play. As chessqueen.

I have analyzed most of the odds games on Larry's site, and so far the answer is no.

I do NOT know why you are accusing me of using an engine when the advantage is clearly close to a Rook, and my online trainer who constantly tell me that I think very precise when I am ahead in material even to nickname me Capa and always telling me that I am advancing fast, but anyway I decided to set upu another position where the advantage is close to a Rook Anyway I used Komodo Free Version this time. mwyoung, If you live in the USA I would pay for 1/3 of the plane ticket if you can bring your computer and I will replay some of these Odds, but I would like to bet $300.00 for each game using some of the Odds that I have posted here. On this game Komodo resigned because after exchanging the pawns White bishop can NOT take because I would fork both Bishops by placing my Queen on d5 !

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site "MyTown"]
[Date "2020.09.12"]
[Round "7"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "ChessQueen"]
[Result "0-1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "3qkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PP1PPPPP/1NB1KBNR w Kk - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[TimeControl "1200+10"]

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qf5 4. d3 Nf6 5. Nf3 g6 6. Be2 Bg7 7. O-O O-O 8.
d4 Nd5 9. Nxd5 Qxd5 10. b3 Bxd4 11. Nxd4 Qxd4 12. a4 Rd8 13. Bc4 Qe4 14. Be3
Qc2 15. h3 Rd1 16. Rxd1 Qxd1+ 17. Kh2 Kg7 18. Kg3 a6 19. Kh2 g5 20. Bxg5 b5 0-1[/pgn]

You were tricking us. You only cheated yourself.

Uri is correct the more pieced you take the less you can blunder, I wonder what is the average error rate in the following position setup, so can you beat Komodo 9 with Black, mwyoung

[d]rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQK3 w Qkq - 0 1']

[mwyoung]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It does not support your theory. A score of 15 or higher is expected from a GM player. You just ignored everything.
And this was also the same positions repeating. And mistakes were made in the games. Unlike chessqueen who made ZERO!

So now you want to throw out data of the match, and cherry pick.....

This supports Centipawn analysis.

And you are clueless here. This is not a comparison of players of this match. One has nothing to do with the other. This is determining if a players precision is above expected human norms. Based on the stats of the best players in the world. Everything else is just a bonus. Who played better, and who is the stronger and more accurate player.

GM Smerdon played within humans norms as shown by the results. Chessqueen did not and played way outside expected human norms of a GM Player. And Chessqueen is not a GM.

More results coming.

I wonder what is the average error rate in the following game of both opponents
I took extreme case when I knew I can win easily.

If my error rate is smaller than stockfish when I did not find the fastest mates then it proves my point

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-7QE6S12"]
[Date "2020.12.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "àåøé"]
[Black "Stockfish_20112916_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2200"]
[Time "08:56:25"]
[WhiteElo "2400"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "1nb1kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 g6 {(g7-g6 Ng1-e2 b7-b6 d2-d3 Nb8-c6 g2-g4 e7-e6 Bf1-g2 Bf8-g7 O-O
Ng8-e7 g4-g5 Ke8-f8 Qd1-d2 Bc8-a6 c2-c3 Nc6-e5 Ne2-f4 d7-d5 Rf1-d1 d5xe4
d3xe4 Kf8-g8 h2-h4) -22.78/29 12} 2. d4 e6 {(e7-e6 c2-c3 b7-b6 Bc1-f4
Bf8-d6 Bf4-e3 f7-f5 e4-e5 Bd6-f8 Qd1-a4 a7-a5 Nb1-d2 Ng8-e7 c3-c4 Ne7-c6
Nd2-f3 Bc8-b7 a2-a3 Nc6-e7 O-O-O Bb7-c6 Qa4-b3 Bc6xf3 Ng1xf3 Ne7-c6 h2-h4
Bf8-g7 h4-h5 Ke8-f7 Nf3-d2 Kf7-g8 h5xg6 h7xg6) -22.67/27 4} 3. Nf3 d6
{(d7-d6 Bc1-g5 f7-f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Nb1-c3 Bf8-e7 Bg5-c1 a7-a6 d4-d5 Ng8-f6
Qd1-d4 c7-c5 Qd4-a4+ b7-b5 Qa4-b3 c5-c4 Bf1xc4 Nf6-e4 Nc3xb5 a6xb5 Qb3xb5+
Nb8-d7) -22.63/23 2} 4. Bc4 Nc6 {(Nb8-c6 c2-c3 Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ng8-f6 Bc4-d3
Ke8-f8 O-O Kf8-g7 Rf1-e1 Bh6xd2 Bc1xd2 a7-a6 Qd1-a4 Nc6-e7 h2-h3 h7-h5
Qa4-b3 Ne7-c6 Re1-e2 Nc6-e7 a2-a3 Ne7-c6 c3-c4 e6-e5 d4-d5 Nc6-e7)
-22.37/26 1} 5. O-O Bh6 {(Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ke8-f8 c2-c3 Kf8-g7 Bc4-d3 Bh6xd2
Bc1xd2 b7-b6 Qd1-e2 Bc8-b7 g2-g4 Nc6-e7 g4-g5 d6-d5 e4-e5 a7-a6 a2-a4
Ne7-c6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 b4-b5 a6xb5 a4xb5 Nc6-d8) -22.44/25 2 Black resigns} 6.
Bxh6 Nxh6 {(Ng8xh6 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8 Qd2-c3 h7-h6 d4-d5 Nc6-e7 d5xe6 f7xe6
Bc4-b3 c7-c6 Rf1-d1 d6-d5 Qc3-g7 b7-b5 Nf3-e5 Bc8-d7 Nb1-c3 a7-a5 Qg7-f7+
Ke8-d8 a2-a4 b5-b4 Nc3-e2 Kd8-c7 f2-f3 g6-g5 Qf7-h5 Kc7-d8 c2-c3 b4xc3
Ne2xc3 Kd8-c8) -22.59/28 3 Black resigns} 7. d5 Ne5 {(Nc6-e5 Nf3xe5)
-23.99/29 18 Black resigns} 8. Nxe5 a6 {(a7-a6 Ne5-f3 e6-e5 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8
Qd2-a5 b7-b6 Qa5-c3 f7-f6 Nf3-d2 Ke8-d8 Qc3-e3 Kd8-e7 Nb1-c3 a6-a5 Bc4-b3
Bc8-d7 a2-a4 h7-h5 Qe3-e2 Ke7-d8 Qe2-a6 Bd7-c8 Qa6-c4 Bc8-d7 Ra1-e1 Kd8-c8
f2-f3 Ng8-e7) -24.80/27 7 Black resigns} 9. dxe6 Bxe6 {(Bc8xe6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Ke8-d7 Qg4-h4 h7-h6 Qh4-f6 Nf7-d8 Qf6-g7+ Kd7-c8
Qg7xh6 b7-b5 Qh6xg6 Kc8-b7 Qg6-g8 Nd8-c6 Qg8xe6 Nc6-a5 Qe6-d5+ Kb7-b6
Nb1-c3 Na5-c6 Qd5-f7 Kb6-b7 a2-a3) -24.40/20 1 Black resigns} 10. Bxe6 fxe6
{(f7xe6 Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Nf7-d8 Qg4-h3 e6-e5 Qh3xh7 Nd8-e6 Qh7xg6+
Ke8-e7 Qg6xe6+ Ke7xe6 g2-g3 a6-a5 Nb1-c3 c7-c6 Kg1-g2 Ke6-f7 a2-a4 Kf7-f6
Kg2-f3 Kf6-g7 h2-h3 Kg7-g6 h3-h4 b7-b6) -25.03/24 4 Black resigns} 11. Nf3
Nf7 {(Nh6-f7 Qd1-d4) -26.02/24 16 Black resigns} 12. Qd2 c5 {(c7-c5 Qd2-f4
b7-b5 Qf4-f6 b5-b4 Qf6xe6+ Ke8-f8 Qe6xf7+ Kf8xf7 Nb1-d2 Kf7-e6 Nf3-g5+
Ke6-e7 Ng5xh7 d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke7-d6 Nh7-f6 Kd6-e5 Nd2-e4 c5-c4 h2-h4 c4-c3
b2xc3 b4xc3 g2-g4) -24.94/22 3 Black resigns} 13. Ng5 a5 {(a6-a5 Ng5xf7
d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke8xf7 d5xe6+ Kf7-e7 Rf1-e1 a5-a4 Qd2-f4 c5-c4 Re1-d1 Ke7xe6
Rd1-d6+ Ke6-e7 Qf4-f6+ Ke7-e8 Rd6-d8+) -M9/24 4 Black resigns} 14. Nxf7 d5
{(d6-d5 Qd2-f4 Ke8-e7 Qf4-c7+ Ke7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Nf7xg5 Kf6-g6 Qc7xh7+
Kg6-f6 Qh7-f7+) -M6/51 1 Black resigns} 15. Ng5 d4 {(d5-d4 Qd2-f4 Ke8-d7
Nb1-c3 d4xc3 Rf1-d1+ Kd7-c6 Qf4-d6+ Kc6-b5 a2-a4+ Kb5-c4 Qd6xe6+ Kc4-b4
Qe6-b3+) -M7/48 1 Black resigns} 16. Nxe6 Kf7 {(Ke8-f7 Ne6-c7 g6-g5 Qd2xg5
h7-h6 Qg5-f5+ Kf7-e7 Qf5-e6+ Ke7-f8 Qe6-f6+ Kf8-g8 Nc7-e6 d4-d3 Qf6-g7+)
-M7/46 1 Black resigns} 17. Nxc5 b6 {(b7-b6 Qd2xd4 b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6
Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4 Qe5-f5+) -M6/54 1 Black resigns}
18. Qxd4 bxc5 {(b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6 Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4
Qe5-f5+) -M5/145 1 Black resigns} 19. Qd6 c4 {(c5-c4 Rf1-d1 a5-a4 Qd6-c7+
Kf7-e6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns} 20. Re1 h5 {(h7-h5
Re1-d1 h5-h4 Qd6-c7+ Kf7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns}
21. Re3 Kg7 {(Kf7-g7 Re3-f3 Kg7-h7 Qd6-e7+ Kh7-h6 Qe7-f8+ Kh6-g5 Qf8-f4+)
-M4/245 0 Black resigns} 22. Rg3 h4 {(h5-h4 Rg3xg6+ Kg7-h7 Qd6-f6 a5-a4
Qf6-g7+) -M3/245 0 Black resigns} 23. Rxg6+ Kh8 {(Kg7-h8 Qd6-f8+ Kh8-h7
Rg6-h6+) -M2/245 0 Black resigns} 24. Qf8+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7 Rg6-h6+) -M1/245 0
Black resigns} 25. Qg7# 1-0[/pgn]

I will look at the game later today. And post the results. I hope you realize this is a statistical measurement. And any one game even without odds can show anything. That is why you can not cherry pick data. All the matches we are looking at have many games. And the match as a whole is what you look at for the data.

Meaning it is not really the game that is the most important. It is a meaningful number of moves.

And remember we are not comparing the players in the match.

We are comparing the strong side only. Or the player that starts with all his material. In the odds games. To see if your theory stands. Will that human player ever look like a computer play. As chessqueen.

I have analyzed most of the odds games on Larry's site, and so far the answer is no.

I do NOT know why you are accusing me of using an engine when the advantage is clearly close to a Rook, and my online trainer who constantly tell me that I think very precise when I am ahead in material even to nickname me Capa and always telling me that I am advancing fast, but anyway I decided to set upu another position where the advantage is close to a Rook Anyway I used Komodo Free Version this time. mwyoung, If you live in the USA I would pay for 1/3 of the plane ticket if you can bring your computer and I will replay some of these Odds, but I would like to bet $300.00 for each game using some of the Odds that I have posted here. On this game Komodo resigned because after exchanging the pawns White bishop can NOT take because I would fork both Bishops by placing my Queen on d5 !

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site "MyTown"]
[Date "2020.09.12"]
[Round "7"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "ChessQueen"]
[Result "0-1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "3qkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PP1PPPPP/1NB1KBNR w Kk - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[TimeControl "1200+10"]

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qf5 4. d3 Nf6 5. Nf3 g6 6. Be2 Bg7 7. O-O O-O 8.
d4 Nd5 9. Nxd5 Qxd5 10. b3 Bxd4 11. Nxd4 Qxd4 12. a4 Rd8 13. Bc4 Qe4 14. Be3
Qc2 15. h3 Rd1 16. Rxd1 Qxd1+ 17. Kh2 Kg7 18. Kg3 a6 19. Kh2 g5 20. Bxg5 b5 0-1[/pgn]

You were tricking us. You only cheated yourself.

Uri is correct the more pieced you take the less you can blunder, I wonder what is the average error rate in the following position setup, so can you beat Komodo 9 with Black, mwyoung[/size] ?

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site " mwyoung "]
[Date "????.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "Chess, Queen"]
[Result "1-0"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQK3 w Qkq - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "1"]

1. d4 1-0[/pgn]

Uri is not correct. And Uri has done no testing. Uri is not even clear what or how centipawn analysis works. And the same can be said for you.

I have tested it, and in no case did it show a human as playing like a computer. Because the games was played with odds.

Now if you guys have data show it, and stop making up fact with motive.

[Chessqueen]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It does not support your theory. A score of 15 or higher is expected from a GM player. You just ignored everything.
And this was also the same positions repeating. And mistakes were made in the games. Unlike chessqueen who made ZERO!

So now you want to throw out data of the match, and cherry pick.....

This supports Centipawn analysis.

And you are clueless here. This is not a comparison of players of this match. One has nothing to do with the other. This is determining if a players precision is above expected human norms. Based on the stats of the best players in the world. Everything else is just a bonus. Who played better, and who is the stronger and more accurate player.

GM Smerdon played within humans norms as shown by the results. Chessqueen did not and played way outside expected human norms of a GM Player. And Chessqueen is not a GM.

More results coming.

I wonder what is the average error rate in the following game of both opponents
I took extreme case when I knew I can win easily.

If my error rate is smaller than stockfish when I did not find the fastest mates then it proves my point

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-7QE6S12"]
[Date "2020.12.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "àåøé"]
[Black "Stockfish_20112916_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2200"]
[Time "08:56:25"]
[WhiteElo "2400"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "1nb1kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 g6 {(g7-g6 Ng1-e2 b7-b6 d2-d3 Nb8-c6 g2-g4 e7-e6 Bf1-g2 Bf8-g7 O-O
Ng8-e7 g4-g5 Ke8-f8 Qd1-d2 Bc8-a6 c2-c3 Nc6-e5 Ne2-f4 d7-d5 Rf1-d1 d5xe4
d3xe4 Kf8-g8 h2-h4) -22.78/29 12} 2. d4 e6 {(e7-e6 c2-c3 b7-b6 Bc1-f4
Bf8-d6 Bf4-e3 f7-f5 e4-e5 Bd6-f8 Qd1-a4 a7-a5 Nb1-d2 Ng8-e7 c3-c4 Ne7-c6
Nd2-f3 Bc8-b7 a2-a3 Nc6-e7 O-O-O Bb7-c6 Qa4-b3 Bc6xf3 Ng1xf3 Ne7-c6 h2-h4
Bf8-g7 h4-h5 Ke8-f7 Nf3-d2 Kf7-g8 h5xg6 h7xg6) -22.67/27 4} 3. Nf3 d6
{(d7-d6 Bc1-g5 f7-f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Nb1-c3 Bf8-e7 Bg5-c1 a7-a6 d4-d5 Ng8-f6
Qd1-d4 c7-c5 Qd4-a4+ b7-b5 Qa4-b3 c5-c4 Bf1xc4 Nf6-e4 Nc3xb5 a6xb5 Qb3xb5+
Nb8-d7) -22.63/23 2} 4. Bc4 Nc6 {(Nb8-c6 c2-c3 Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ng8-f6 Bc4-d3
Ke8-f8 O-O Kf8-g7 Rf1-e1 Bh6xd2 Bc1xd2 a7-a6 Qd1-a4 Nc6-e7 h2-h3 h7-h5
Qa4-b3 Ne7-c6 Re1-e2 Nc6-e7 a2-a3 Ne7-c6 c3-c4 e6-e5 d4-d5 Nc6-e7)
-22.37/26 1} 5. O-O Bh6 {(Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ke8-f8 c2-c3 Kf8-g7 Bc4-d3 Bh6xd2
Bc1xd2 b7-b6 Qd1-e2 Bc8-b7 g2-g4 Nc6-e7 g4-g5 d6-d5 e4-e5 a7-a6 a2-a4
Ne7-c6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 b4-b5 a6xb5 a4xb5 Nc6-d8) -22.44/25 2 Black resigns} 6.
Bxh6 Nxh6 {(Ng8xh6 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8 Qd2-c3 h7-h6 d4-d5 Nc6-e7 d5xe6 f7xe6
Bc4-b3 c7-c6 Rf1-d1 d6-d5 Qc3-g7 b7-b5 Nf3-e5 Bc8-d7 Nb1-c3 a7-a5 Qg7-f7+
Ke8-d8 a2-a4 b5-b4 Nc3-e2 Kd8-c7 f2-f3 g6-g5 Qf7-h5 Kc7-d8 c2-c3 b4xc3
Ne2xc3 Kd8-c8) -22.59/28 3 Black resigns} 7. d5 Ne5 {(Nc6-e5 Nf3xe5)
-23.99/29 18 Black resigns} 8. Nxe5 a6 {(a7-a6 Ne5-f3 e6-e5 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8
Qd2-a5 b7-b6 Qa5-c3 f7-f6 Nf3-d2 Ke8-d8 Qc3-e3 Kd8-e7 Nb1-c3 a6-a5 Bc4-b3
Bc8-d7 a2-a4 h7-h5 Qe3-e2 Ke7-d8 Qe2-a6 Bd7-c8 Qa6-c4 Bc8-d7 Ra1-e1 Kd8-c8
f2-f3 Ng8-e7) -24.80/27 7 Black resigns} 9. dxe6 Bxe6 {(Bc8xe6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Ke8-d7 Qg4-h4 h7-h6 Qh4-f6 Nf7-d8 Qf6-g7+ Kd7-c8
Qg7xh6 b7-b5 Qh6xg6 Kc8-b7 Qg6-g8 Nd8-c6 Qg8xe6 Nc6-a5 Qe6-d5+ Kb7-b6
Nb1-c3 Na5-c6 Qd5-f7 Kb6-b7 a2-a3) -24.40/20 1 Black resigns} 10. Bxe6 fxe6
{(f7xe6 Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Nf7-d8 Qg4-h3 e6-e5 Qh3xh7 Nd8-e6 Qh7xg6+
Ke8-e7 Qg6xe6+ Ke7xe6 g2-g3 a6-a5 Nb1-c3 c7-c6 Kg1-g2 Ke6-f7 a2-a4 Kf7-f6
Kg2-f3 Kf6-g7 h2-h3 Kg7-g6 h3-h4 b7-b6) -25.03/24 4 Black resigns} 11. Nf3
Nf7 {(Nh6-f7 Qd1-d4) -26.02/24 16 Black resigns} 12. Qd2 c5 {(c7-c5 Qd2-f4
b7-b5 Qf4-f6 b5-b4 Qf6xe6+ Ke8-f8 Qe6xf7+ Kf8xf7 Nb1-d2 Kf7-e6 Nf3-g5+
Ke6-e7 Ng5xh7 d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke7-d6 Nh7-f6 Kd6-e5 Nd2-e4 c5-c4 h2-h4 c4-c3
b2xc3 b4xc3 g2-g4) -24.94/22 3 Black resigns} 13. Ng5 a5 {(a6-a5 Ng5xf7
d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke8xf7 d5xe6+ Kf7-e7 Rf1-e1 a5-a4 Qd2-f4 c5-c4 Re1-d1 Ke7xe6
Rd1-d6+ Ke6-e7 Qf4-f6+ Ke7-e8 Rd6-d8+) -M9/24 4 Black resigns} 14. Nxf7 d5
{(d6-d5 Qd2-f4 Ke8-e7 Qf4-c7+ Ke7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Nf7xg5 Kf6-g6 Qc7xh7+
Kg6-f6 Qh7-f7+) -M6/51 1 Black resigns} 15. Ng5 d4 {(d5-d4 Qd2-f4 Ke8-d7
Nb1-c3 d4xc3 Rf1-d1+ Kd7-c6 Qf4-d6+ Kc6-b5 a2-a4+ Kb5-c4 Qd6xe6+ Kc4-b4
Qe6-b3+) -M7/48 1 Black resigns} 16. Nxe6 Kf7 {(Ke8-f7 Ne6-c7 g6-g5 Qd2xg5
h7-h6 Qg5-f5+ Kf7-e7 Qf5-e6+ Ke7-f8 Qe6-f6+ Kf8-g8 Nc7-e6 d4-d3 Qf6-g7+)
-M7/46 1 Black resigns} 17. Nxc5 b6 {(b7-b6 Qd2xd4 b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6
Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4 Qe5-f5+) -M6/54 1 Black resigns}
18. Qxd4 bxc5 {(b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6 Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4
Qe5-f5+) -M5/145 1 Black resigns} 19. Qd6 c4 {(c5-c4 Rf1-d1 a5-a4 Qd6-c7+
Kf7-e6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns} 20. Re1 h5 {(h7-h5
Re1-d1 h5-h4 Qd6-c7+ Kf7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns}
21. Re3 Kg7 {(Kf7-g7 Re3-f3 Kg7-h7 Qd6-e7+ Kh7-h6 Qe7-f8+ Kh6-g5 Qf8-f4+)
-M4/245 0 Black resigns} 22. Rg3 h4 {(h5-h4 Rg3xg6+ Kg7-h7 Qd6-f6 a5-a4
Qf6-g7+) -M3/245 0 Black resigns} 23. Rxg6+ Kh8 {(Kg7-h8 Qd6-f8+ Kh8-h7
Rg6-h6+) -M2/245 0 Black resigns} 24. Qf8+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7 Rg6-h6+) -M1/245 0
Black resigns} 25. Qg7# 1-0[/pgn]

I will look at the game later today. And post the results. I hope you realize this is a statistical measurement. And any one game even without odds can show anything. That is why you can not cherry pick data. All the matches we are looking at have many games. And the match as a whole is what you look at for the data.

Meaning it is not really the game that is the most important. It is a meaningful number of moves.

And remember we are not comparing the players in the match.

We are comparing the strong side only. Or the player that starts with all his material. In the odds games. To see if your theory stands. Will that human player ever look like a computer play. As chessqueen.

I have analyzed most of the odds games on Larry's site, and so far the answer is no.

I do NOT know why you are accusing me of using an engine when the advantage is clearly close to a Rook, and my online trainer who constantly tell me that I think very precise when I am ahead in material even to nickname me Capa and always telling me that I am advancing fast, but anyway I decided to set upu another position where the advantage is close to a Rook Anyway I used Komodo Free Version this time. mwyoung, If you live in the USA I would pay for 1/3 of the plane ticket if you can bring your computer and I will replay some of these Odds, but I would like to bet $300.00 for each game using some of the Odds that I have posted here. On this game Komodo resigned because after exchanging the pawns White bishop can NOT take because I would fork both Bishops by placing my Queen on d5 !

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site "MyTown"]
[Date "2020.09.12"]
[Round "7"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "ChessQueen"]
[Result "0-1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "3qkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PP1PPPPP/1NB1KBNR w Kk - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[TimeControl "1200+10"]

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qf5 4. d3 Nf6 5. Nf3 g6 6. Be2 Bg7 7. O-O O-O 8.
d4 Nd5 9. Nxd5 Qxd5 10. b3 Bxd4 11. Nxd4 Qxd4 12. a4 Rd8 13. Bc4 Qe4 14. Be3
Qc2 15. h3 Rd1 16. Rxd1 Qxd1+ 17. Kh2 Kg7 18. Kg3 a6 19. Kh2 g5 20. Bxg5 b5 0-1[/pgn]

You were tricking us. You only cheated yourself.

Uri is correct the more pieced you take the less you can blunder, I wonder what is the average error rate in the following position setup, so can you beat Komodo 9 with Black, mwyoung[/size] ?

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site " mwyoung "]
[Date "????.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "Chess, Queen"]
[Result "1-0"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQK3 w Qkq - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "1"]

1. d4 1-0[/pgn]

Uri is not correct. And Uri has done no testing. Uri is not even clear what or how centipawn analysis works. And the same can be said for you.

I have tested it, and in no case did it show a human as playing like a computer. Because the games was played with odds.

Now if you guys have data show it, and stop making up fact with motive.

I know you already tried but you are embarrassed to post your losing game,I know if you try hard you can beat this position in less than 30 moves
Uri is correct the more pieced you take the less you can blunder, I wonder what is the average error rate in the following position setup, so can you beat Komodo 9 with Black, mwyoung

[d]rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQK3 w Qkq - 0 1']
[/quote]

[mwyoung]

I see that the average error of smerdon was the same as komodo and it is clear that komodo is stronger than smerdon.

It supports my theory that the winner tend to do less mistakes so if you give the human material odd that is big enough for him to usually win then he is going to do less mistakes.

chessqueen is not a GM but he played with odds that are bigger than knight odds.
I do not claim that chessqueen did not cheat but only that you can expect lower average for odd matches when the human win every game(in the case of smerdon it was almost every game because smerdon lost the first game).

My point is that if you want to prove cheating then you need to show that humans who are at a level when they win in similiar conditions have a bigger average.

I do not think that you need to be a GM to win all games in similiar conditions(more than knight odd when you do not play against dragon but only against weaker komodo)

Edit:Note that I see that smerdon won the centi-pawn race in every game when he won.
The average is the same only because of the single game that he lost because the handicap was not enough for 6-0 score for him.

It does not support your theory. A score of 15 or higher is expected from a GM player. You just ignored everything.
And this was also the same positions repeating. And mistakes were made in the games. Unlike chessqueen who made ZERO!

So now you want to throw out data of the match, and cherry pick.....

This supports Centipawn analysis.

And you are clueless here. This is not a comparison of players of this match. One has nothing to do with the other. This is determining if a players precision is above expected human norms. Based on the stats of the best players in the world. Everything else is just a bonus. Who played better, and who is the stronger and more accurate player.

GM Smerdon played within humans norms as shown by the results. Chessqueen did not and played way outside expected human norms of a GM Player. And Chessqueen is not a GM.

More results coming.

I wonder what is the average error rate in the following game of both opponents
I took extreme case when I knew I can win easily.

If my error rate is smaller than stockfish when I did not find the fastest mates then it proves my point

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "DESKTOP-7QE6S12"]
[Date "2020.12.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "àåøé"]
[Black "Stockfish_20112916_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2200"]
[Time "08:56:25"]
[WhiteElo "2400"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "1nb1kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 g6 {(g7-g6 Ng1-e2 b7-b6 d2-d3 Nb8-c6 g2-g4 e7-e6 Bf1-g2 Bf8-g7 O-O
Ng8-e7 g4-g5 Ke8-f8 Qd1-d2 Bc8-a6 c2-c3 Nc6-e5 Ne2-f4 d7-d5 Rf1-d1 d5xe4
d3xe4 Kf8-g8 h2-h4) -22.78/29 12} 2. d4 e6 {(e7-e6 c2-c3 b7-b6 Bc1-f4
Bf8-d6 Bf4-e3 f7-f5 e4-e5 Bd6-f8 Qd1-a4 a7-a5 Nb1-d2 Ng8-e7 c3-c4 Ne7-c6
Nd2-f3 Bc8-b7 a2-a3 Nc6-e7 O-O-O Bb7-c6 Qa4-b3 Bc6xf3 Ng1xf3 Ne7-c6 h2-h4
Bf8-g7 h4-h5 Ke8-f7 Nf3-d2 Kf7-g8 h5xg6 h7xg6) -22.67/27 4} 3. Nf3 d6
{(d7-d6 Bc1-g5 f7-f5 e4xf5 g6xf5 Nb1-c3 Bf8-e7 Bg5-c1 a7-a6 d4-d5 Ng8-f6
Qd1-d4 c7-c5 Qd4-a4+ b7-b5 Qa4-b3 c5-c4 Bf1xc4 Nf6-e4 Nc3xb5 a6xb5 Qb3xb5+
Nb8-d7) -22.63/23 2} 4. Bc4 Nc6 {(Nb8-c6 c2-c3 Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ng8-f6 Bc4-d3
Ke8-f8 O-O Kf8-g7 Rf1-e1 Bh6xd2 Bc1xd2 a7-a6 Qd1-a4 Nc6-e7 h2-h3 h7-h5
Qa4-b3 Ne7-c6 Re1-e2 Nc6-e7 a2-a3 Ne7-c6 c3-c4 e6-e5 d4-d5 Nc6-e7)
-22.37/26 1} 5. O-O Bh6 {(Bf8-h6 Nb1-d2 Ke8-f8 c2-c3 Kf8-g7 Bc4-d3 Bh6xd2
Bc1xd2 b7-b6 Qd1-e2 Bc8-b7 g2-g4 Nc6-e7 g4-g5 d6-d5 e4-e5 a7-a6 a2-a4
Ne7-c6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 b4-b5 a6xb5 a4xb5 Nc6-d8) -22.44/25 2 Black resigns} 6.
Bxh6 Nxh6 {(Ng8xh6 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8 Qd2-c3 h7-h6 d4-d5 Nc6-e7 d5xe6 f7xe6
Bc4-b3 c7-c6 Rf1-d1 d6-d5 Qc3-g7 b7-b5 Nf3-e5 Bc8-d7 Nb1-c3 a7-a5 Qg7-f7+
Ke8-d8 a2-a4 b5-b4 Nc3-e2 Kd8-c7 f2-f3 g6-g5 Qf7-h5 Kc7-d8 c2-c3 b4xc3
Ne2xc3 Kd8-c8) -22.59/28 3 Black resigns} 7. d5 Ne5 {(Nc6-e5 Nf3xe5)
-23.99/29 18 Black resigns} 8. Nxe5 a6 {(a7-a6 Ne5-f3 e6-e5 Qd1-d2 Nh6-g8
Qd2-a5 b7-b6 Qa5-c3 f7-f6 Nf3-d2 Ke8-d8 Qc3-e3 Kd8-e7 Nb1-c3 a6-a5 Bc4-b3
Bc8-d7 a2-a4 h7-h5 Qe3-e2 Ke7-d8 Qe2-a6 Bd7-c8 Qa6-c4 Bc8-d7 Ra1-e1 Kd8-c8
f2-f3 Ng8-e7) -24.80/27 7 Black resigns} 9. dxe6 Bxe6 {(Bc8xe6 Bc4xe6 f7xe6
Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Ke8-d7 Qg4-h4 h7-h6 Qh4-f6 Nf7-d8 Qf6-g7+ Kd7-c8
Qg7xh6 b7-b5 Qh6xg6 Kc8-b7 Qg6-g8 Nd8-c6 Qg8xe6 Nc6-a5 Qe6-d5+ Kb7-b6
Nb1-c3 Na5-c6 Qd5-f7 Kb6-b7 a2-a3) -24.40/20 1 Black resigns} 10. Bxe6 fxe6
{(f7xe6 Ne5-d3 Nh6-f7 Qd1-g4 Nf7-d8 Qg4-h3 e6-e5 Qh3xh7 Nd8-e6 Qh7xg6+
Ke8-e7 Qg6xe6+ Ke7xe6 g2-g3 a6-a5 Nb1-c3 c7-c6 Kg1-g2 Ke6-f7 a2-a4 Kf7-f6
Kg2-f3 Kf6-g7 h2-h3 Kg7-g6 h3-h4 b7-b6) -25.03/24 4 Black resigns} 11. Nf3
Nf7 {(Nh6-f7 Qd1-d4) -26.02/24 16 Black resigns} 12. Qd2 c5 {(c7-c5 Qd2-f4
b7-b5 Qf4-f6 b5-b4 Qf6xe6+ Ke8-f8 Qe6xf7+ Kf8xf7 Nb1-d2 Kf7-e6 Nf3-g5+
Ke6-e7 Ng5xh7 d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke7-d6 Nh7-f6 Kd6-e5 Nd2-e4 c5-c4 h2-h4 c4-c3
b2xc3 b4xc3 g2-g4) -24.94/22 3 Black resigns} 13. Ng5 a5 {(a6-a5 Ng5xf7
d6-d5 e4xd5 Ke8xf7 d5xe6+ Kf7-e7 Rf1-e1 a5-a4 Qd2-f4 c5-c4 Re1-d1 Ke7xe6
Rd1-d6+ Ke6-e7 Qf4-f6+ Ke7-e8 Rd6-d8+) -M9/24 4 Black resigns} 14. Nxf7 d5
{(d6-d5 Qd2-f4 Ke8-e7 Qf4-c7+ Ke7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Nf7xg5 Kf6-g6 Qc7xh7+
Kg6-f6 Qh7-f7+) -M6/51 1 Black resigns} 15. Ng5 d4 {(d5-d4 Qd2-f4 Ke8-d7
Nb1-c3 d4xc3 Rf1-d1+ Kd7-c6 Qf4-d6+ Kc6-b5 a2-a4+ Kb5-c4 Qd6xe6+ Kc4-b4
Qe6-b3+) -M7/48 1 Black resigns} 16. Nxe6 Kf7 {(Ke8-f7 Ne6-c7 g6-g5 Qd2xg5
h7-h6 Qg5-f5+ Kf7-e7 Qf5-e6+ Ke7-f8 Qe6-f6+ Kf8-g8 Nc7-e6 d4-d3 Qf6-g7+)
-M7/46 1 Black resigns} 17. Nxc5 b6 {(b7-b6 Qd2xd4 b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6
Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4 Qe5-f5+) -M6/54 1 Black resigns}
18. Qxd4 bxc5 {(b6xc5 Qd4-e5 h7-h6 Rf1-d1 g6-g5 Rd1-d7+ Kf7-g6 g2-g4 c5-c4
Qe5-f5+) -M5/145 1 Black resigns} 19. Qd6 c4 {(c5-c4 Rf1-d1 a5-a4 Qd6-c7+
Kf7-e6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns} 20. Re1 h5 {(h7-h5
Re1-d1 h5-h4 Qd6-c7+ Kf7-f6 f2-f4 g6-g5 Rd1-d6+) -M4/245 0 Black resigns}
21. Re3 Kg7 {(Kf7-g7 Re3-f3 Kg7-h7 Qd6-e7+ Kh7-h6 Qe7-f8+ Kh6-g5 Qf8-f4+)
-M4/245 0 Black resigns} 22. Rg3 h4 {(h5-h4 Rg3xg6+ Kg7-h7 Qd6-f6 a5-a4
Qf6-g7+) -M3/245 0 Black resigns} 23. Rxg6+ Kh8 {(Kg7-h8 Qd6-f8+ Kh8-h7
Rg6-h6+) -M2/245 0 Black resigns} 24. Qf8+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7 Rg6-h6+) -M1/245 0
Black resigns} 25. Qg7# 1-0[/pgn]

I will look at the game later today. And post the results. I hope you realize this is a statistical measurement. And any one game even without odds can show anything. That is why you can not cherry pick data. All the matches we are looking at have many games. And the match as a whole is what you look at for the data.

Meaning it is not really the game that is the most important. It is a meaningful number of moves.

And remember we are not comparing the players in the match.

We are comparing the strong side only. Or the player that starts with all his material. In the odds games. To see if your theory stands. Will that human player ever look like a computer play. As chessqueen.

I have analyzed most of the odds games on Larry's site, and so far the answer is no.

I do NOT know why you are accusing me of using an engine when the advantage is clearly close to a Rook, and my online trainer who constantly tell me that I think very precise when I am ahead in material even to nickname me Capa and always telling me that I am advancing fast, but anyway I decided to set upu another position where the advantage is close to a Rook Anyway I used Komodo Free Version this time. mwyoung, If you live in the USA I would pay for 1/3 of the plane ticket if you can bring your computer and I will replay some of these Odds, but I would like to bet $300.00 for each game using some of the Odds that I have posted here. On this game Komodo resigned because after exchanging the pawns White bishop can NOT take because I would fork both Bishops by placing my Queen on d5 !

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site "MyTown"]
[Date "2020.09.12"]
[Round "7"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "ChessQueen"]
[Result "0-1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "3qkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PP1PPPPP/1NB1KBNR w Kk - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[TimeControl "1200+10"]

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qf5 4. d3 Nf6 5. Nf3 g6 6. Be2 Bg7 7. O-O O-O 8.
d4 Nd5 9. Nxd5 Qxd5 10. b3 Bxd4 11. Nxd4 Qxd4 12. a4 Rd8 13. Bc4 Qe4 14. Be3
Qc2 15. h3 Rd1 16. Rxd1 Qxd1+ 17. Kh2 Kg7 18. Kg3 a6 19. Kh2 g5 20. Bxg5 b5 0-1[/pgn]

You were tricking us. You only cheated yourself.

Uri is correct the more pieced you take the less you can blunder, I wonder what is the average error rate in the following position setup, so can you beat Komodo 9 with Black, mwyoung[/size] ?

[pgn][Event "Blitz:20'+10""]
[Site " mwyoung "]
[Date "????.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Komodo 12.1.1 64-bit"]
[Black "Chess, Queen"]
[Result "1-0"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQK3 w Qkq - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "1"]

1. d4 1-0[/pgn]

Uri is not correct. And Uri has done no testing. Uri is not even clear what or how centipawn analysis works. And the same can be said for you.

I have tested it, and in no case did it show a human as playing like a computer. Because the games was played with odds.

Now if you guys have data show it, and stop making up fact with motive.

I know you already tried but you are embarrassed to post your losing game,I know if you try hard you can beat this position in less than 30 moves
Uri is correct the more pieced you take the less you can blunder, I wonder what is the average error rate in the following position setup, so can you beat Komodo 9 with Black, mwyoung

[d]rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQK3 w Qkq - 0 1']

[/quote]


I will post the unbiased data from Larry's site. Since you and Uri are good at making up facts. I want to see you produce any data without the program.... I suggest that if you have data then show it.