one final thread on robolito....in all fairness

[Rolf]

Graham Banks got the point somewhere else:

Every time a strong new engine appears, these are invariably the first words
that are uttered. "Is it a clone?"
Not getting at you personally Eduard as you're just the first to ask on this
occasion.
Must be really sickening to the program author though. You'd expect some praise
I would think for developing such a monster.

Regards, Graham.

There is a big difference this time.
First of all, there is no genuinely named author (unsurprising that a thief doesn't want to give his real name though).
Secondly the Rybka author indicated early that the code posted was stolen code (before any working compiles were put out, from memory).

It's amazing that you have such a large range of my quotes or posts from long ago at your fingertips and so readily. Who's been providing them for you?

Cheers,
Graham.

You ask questions!

The whole anti-Vas campaign stinks after this same strong smoke. Those who allegedly programmed (= robbed) remain anonymous. Those who argue here in public are anonymous. But behind all that there are people who are real but they want to remain completely invisible. Why? Because they know that the whole campaign stinks.

Now the secret for the reasons of the whole stinking campaign:

is it because these behind staying interested want to compete on official level with these new engines? NOPE!

is it because they doubt that Vas is better than they themselves? NOPE!

So, what is the secret?

The secret is that Vas has found out something that all others couldnt find till now. That causes envy. And rage because they feel fooled.

So, the secret goes like this. BTW it was openly declared by Norman S. before he was thrown out after another clone case where he tried to sell a clone!

The secret is that you create a clone that is nothing but a clone and then the propaganda runs this way.

If Vas had nothing to hide and would seriously say that it's a clone THEN he must open his code and prove his claim. And that would be payday for the cloner family. Because they want to know the secrets. If howeever Vas remains silent THEN the propaganda is continuing with the same tune all over again, that NOTHING has been proven and therefore innocence and the clone should be allowed as a fair participant in the next Wch.

In all fairness...

Now I am a lay. So, certain programming details could be wrong, but that doesnt change the whole scenario that much.

Look, the most scandalous detail here is that all the other commercial authors remain silent and dont show solidarity with Vas. On the background that they all could also use stolen code but with them nobody of the RobinHood like revolutionaries declares war. That alone proves that the cloners are evil. They scapegoat a single commercial programmer and want to destroy his living. I miss a clear word from Schroder and also Whittington, both retired ex-programmers. Why dont they defend Vas?

In all fairness...

Computerchess has lost its innocence.[/i]

[Terry McCracken]

Too much static, no information. I can't hear anything in here anymore.

[Graham Banks]

I assume Vasik told you how the stealth had taken place. Care to reveal?

I don't know Gabor, but to me that is the key question.
Some prefer to believe Vas that the code was stolen, some prefer to think that he leaked it on purpose, others prefer to accuse Vas of wanting to destroy any competition.
I do know more than I can reveal, but of course, that means nothing to others.

Cheers,
Graham.

[Alexander Schmidt]

Secondly the Rybka author indicated early that the code posted was stolen code (nearly six months before any working compiles were put out).

I missed that one. Could you provide a link?

When was the code stolen?

Why do we argue about Ippolit to be a Rybka 3 or Rybka 4 clone while VR said when his code was stolen...

[Rolf]

when Chris Wittington was moderator, did he not say 'discussion is allowed, libel not'?

Yes, but he meant it the other way round. The point was that certain members insulted Vas for having created a clone in parts. And the clone epidemy has the single goal, that is, to force or seduce Vas to prove something by opening his code. But this isnt all. Alone the insulting against Vas has that goal. It's a sort of public blackmail. Tell us your secrets and we will stop insulting and torturing you. Motif for that kind of ugliness: when Vas was new here we spoke with him told him all kind of little secrets, then, when he had digested enough he left us and went commercial. This is what we call evil. Bob is arguing along this line.

The fac that Vas didnt leave at all, but just was begged to leave with his Rybka fans and therefore created his own room, that is the proof that Bob is wrong with his suggestion.

[Rolf]

I do know more than I can reveal, but of course, that means nothing to others.

That means I can quote you in future that you know certain stuff that is for your critical eyes enough to conclude that the things we are talking about are in fact sort of clones with stolen material intended to harm Vas, which is the only goal because nobody there is dreaming of a careeer in the Wch cycles. Is that correct, Graham? Could you confirm that this is more or less true?

[Graham Banks]

Secondly the Rybka author indicated early that the code posted was stolen code (nearly six months before any working compiles were put out).

I missed that one. Could you provide a link?

When was the code stolen?

Why do we argue about Ippolit to be a Rybka 3 or Rybka 4 clone while VR said when his code was stolen...

Here was the May page of the Ippolit code:
http://www.chesskb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/c ... IT-release
I emailed Vas on the 10th May to ask him if he was aware of this page, because I'd been reliably informed that it was stolen Rybka code.
Vas replied that he was aware and confirmed that it was stolen code.

Cheers,
Graham.

[Graham Banks]

I do know more than I can reveal, but of course, that means nothing to others.

That means I can quote you in future that you know certain stuff that is for your critical eyes enough to conclude that the things we are talking about are in fact sort of clones with stolen material intended to harm Vas, which is the only goal because nobody there is dreaming of a careeer in the Wch cycles. Is that correct, Graham? Could you confirm that this is more or less true?

I am not an expert Rolf (and certainly no programmer), but I do sometimes get entrusted with information that I can't share.
However, this is irrelevant because it means little or nothing to anybody else.

Cheers,
Graham.

[Dr.Wael Deeb]

when Chris Wittington was moderator, did he not say 'discussion is allowed, libel not'?

Yes, but he meant it the other way round. The point was that certain members insulted Vas for having created a clone in parts. And the clone epidemy has the single goal, that is, to force or seduce Vas to prove something by opening his code. But this isnt all. Alone the insulting against Vas has that goal. It's a sort of public blackmail. Tell us your secrets and we will stop insulting and torturing you. Motif for that kind of ugliness: when Vas was new here we spoke with him told him all kind of little secrets, then, when he had digested enough he left us and went commercial. This is what we call evil. Bob is arguing along this line.

The fac that Vas didnt leave at all, but just was begged to leave with his Rybka fans and therefore created his own room, that is the proof that Bob is wrong with his suggestion.

First bold statement = Absolutely true
Second bold statement = Absolutely untrue
Dr.D

[Rolf]

when Chris Wittington was moderator, did he not say 'discussion is allowed, libel not'?

Yes, but he meant it the other way round. The point was that certain members insulted Vas for having created a clone in parts. And the clone epidemy has the single goal, that is, to force or seduce Vas to prove something by opening his code. But this isnt all. Alone the insulting against Vas has that goal. It's a sort of public blackmail. Tell us your secrets and we will stop insulting and torturing you. Motif for that kind of ugliness: when Vas was new here we spoke with him told him all kind of little secrets, then, when he had digested enough he left us and went commercial. This is what we call evil. Bob is arguing along this line.

The fac that Vas didnt leave at all, but just was begged to leave with his Rybka fans and therefore created his own room, that is the proof that Bob is wrong with his suggestion.

First bold statement = Absolutely true
Second bold statement = Absolutely untrue
Dr.D

No, even Bob himself created a new forum to discuss Crafty issues. Vas didnt do anything different but he didnt leave. He could be asked where he is right now. How could someone leave who had to manage hundreds of supporters for Rybka? Against what you say I remember well how Vas was discriminated for allegedly monopolizing the forum for his Rybka questions.