Look who's number 1 at 40/2 on CEGT!

[ThatsIt]

+1

Please keep in mind we've only 2 machines for the 40/120-list.

And respective the Critter 1.4 tests, please have a look at:
http://cegt.siteboard.eu/f4t213-40-120- ... 4-x64.html

Best wishes,
G.S.

[pichy]

No, Critter 1.4 and SF 2.2.2 came out after Komodo 4. Also note that Komodo 3 was skipped. As for Houdini 2.0, yes it was before Komodo 4, but it got a lower rating on their 40/20 list than Houdini 1.5, so they had no compelling reason to test it at 40/2. I would say Critter 1.4 is the most deserving of being tested next, considering its large gain over Critter 0.9 based on 40/20 list. I think they are rightly following the policy of only testing new versions at 40/2 when the version has shown a substantial gain at 40/20. Otherwise they'll never have decent samples of any engine.

Larry have you also programmed a shogi engine, or planning to do it in the near future?

http://shogi-usa.81squareuniverse.com/?p=233

[lkaufman]

Yes, Don and I did make a Komodo shogi engine, but we only spent a short time on it so it is not competitive with top engines, it's only the level of a lower-Dan amateur. Apparently in shogi everyone starts now with an open-source version of "Bonanza" (just as has happened with Ippolit), although in this case it is with the express approval of the author. We didn't do that, we just started from scratch. If we want to get serious about shogi we'll have to study Bonanza and either start with it like everyone else or else just use certain parts (probably the eval, which is super-critical in shogi). Maybe once we've passed Houdini in chess we can go back to shogi.

[HiTech2]

Next list as per January 29th, 2012
Code:
Program Elo + - Games Score Av.Op. Draws
1 Komodo

Could this mean that a royalty or tribute check will presently be on its way to the author who kicked off the revolution?
C.Berliner
http://www.nacgm.org
Redondo Beach, CA and elsewhere.

[lkaufman]

I'm not sure which author you have in mind, although in my opinion it is clearly Vasik Rajlich who deserves most of the credit for the explosion in engine strength in recent years, Fruit-controversy notwithstanding. I think that my contribution to Rybka 3 was sufficient "payment" for this. The one other person who really deserves credit is Prof. David McCallister of M.I.T., whose ideas were fundamental to Rybka and all the later strong programs. Don Dailey and I met with him around twenty years ago, and implemented one idea based on his writings, but Rajlich was the first to make substantial use of McCallister's theories.

[Robert Flesher]

I'm not sure which author you have in mind, although in my opinion it is clearly Vasik Rajlich who deserves most of the credit for the explosion in engine strength in recent years, Fruit-controversy notwithstanding. I think that my contribution to Rybka 3 was sufficient "payment" for this. The one other person who really deserves credit is Prof. David McCallister of M.I.T., whose ideas were fundamental to Rybka and all the later strong programs. Don Dailey and I met with him around twenty years ago, and implemented one idea based on his writings, but Rajlich was the first to make substantial use of McCallister's theories.

Heya Larry,

I find the above enlarged statement very interesting, could you please elaborate.

[lkaufman]

Prof. McCallister published a couple of papers about twenty years ago on "Conspiracy Search". The basic idea was that you look for several moves to "conspire" to prove that a move is no good. His proposal was not a very practical one and did not lead to any engines of note at the time, but the concept was sound. Rajlich credited McCallister (to me at least) as his inspiration for the tapered search that looks at just a few moves on the last few plies. This idea is the common thread among all the top programs on the rating lists now.

[pichy]

Yes, Don and I did make a Komodo shogi engine, but we only spent a short time on it so it is not competitive with top engines, it's only the level of a lower-Dan amateur. Apparently in shogi everyone starts now with an open-source version of "Bonanza" (just as has happened with Ippolit), although in this case it is with the express approval of the author. We didn't do that, we just started from scratch. If we want to get serious about shogi we'll have to study Bonanza and either start with it like everyone else or else just use certain parts (probably the eval, which is super-critical in shogi). Maybe once we've passed Houdini in chess we can go back to shogi.

In how many years a Shogi Engine would beat the male World Champion?



http://www.alafista.com/2010/10/13/shog ... -champion/

[lkaufman]

Well, one answer might be zero years, because just a couple weeks ago the top rated computer won a very serious, high-stakes, high-profile game with a long time limit ( three hours plus a minute a move per side) from former Grand Champion Yonenaga. However the key word in that sentence is "former". Yonenaga is in his upper 60s and retired from professional competitive play, although undoubtedly still a very strong player. The question is how much further improvement is needed to defeat a current champ (Habu or Watanabe). My guess is that the computer will reach their level sometime in 2012, though whether a match will be held to prove that is questionable.

[pichy]

Well, one answer might be zero years, because just a couple weeks ago the top rated computer won a very serious, high-stakes, high-profile game with a long time limit ( three hours plus a minute a move per side) from former Grand Champion Yonenaga. However the key word in that sentence is "former". Yonenaga is in his upper 60s and retired from professional competitive play, although undoubtedly still a very strong player. The question is how much further improvement is needed to defeat a current champ (Habu or Watanabe). My guess is that the computer will reach their level sometime in 2012, though whether a match will be held to prove that is questionable.

Larry I respect your opinion, but according to the current World Champion Watanabe back in 2007 he stated that he could possibly beat a computer for the next 10 years which would be in 2017. If your assumption is correct and they allow him to play versus Bonkras, Watanabe will have a tough challenger to beat. But of course Mr. Watanabe was referring to being able to beat Bonanza in the next 10 years NOT Bonkras
http://www.businesswireindia.com/PressR ... 2mid=29804

" The Japan Shogi Association (JSA) gave reigning Ryuo Champion Watanabe permission to compete against the reigning World Computer Shogi Champion Bonanza on 21 March 2007. Daiwa Securities sponsored the match. Hoki Kunihito wrote Bonanza. The computer was an Intel Xeon 2.66 GHz 8 core with 8 gigabytes of memory and 160-gigabyte hard drive. The game was played with 2 hours each and 1 minute byo-yomi per move after that. Those conditions favor Watanabe because longer time limits mean there are fewer mistakes from time pressure. Longer playing time also means human players can make long-term plans beyond the computer’s calculating horizon. The 2 players were not at the same playing level. Watanabe was 2006 Ryuo Champion and Bonanza was at the level of 2 dan shoreikai.[1] Bonanza was a little stronger than before due to program improvements and a faster computer. Watanabe prepared for a weaker Bonanza as Watanabe studied old Bonanza game records.
Bonanza moved first and played fourth file rook anaguma as Watanabe expected. Watanabe thought some of Bonanza’s moves were inferior. However, Watanabe deeply analyzed these moves thinking that maybe the computer saw something that Watanabe did not see.[5] Watanabe commented after the game that he could have lost if Bonanza had played defensive moves before entering the endgame. But the computer choose to attack immediately instead of taking its time (and using its impressive endgame strategies) which cost it the match. Bonanza resigned after move 112. Hidetchi reviews this game.[6]
After Bonanza’s loss Watanabe commented on computers in his blog, “I thought they still had quite a way to go, but now we have to recognize that they’ve reached the point where they are getting to be a match for professionals.” Ryuo champion Akira Watanabe clarifies his position on computers playing shogi. Yomiuri Shimbun newspaper quoted Akira Watanabe on June 27, 2008. Watanabe said "I think I'll be able to defeat shogi software for the next 10 years "