Hans Niemann

[Rebel]

Imho, caught a cheater, always a cheater! Hang him out to dry!

No second chances for a 19 year old?

[rainhaus]

"The decision of the FIDE should actually be made shortly"
https://www.fide.com/news/2249

As feared by some, the final decision of FIDE, contrary to its own statement, is far away. In an e-mail to The Norwegian Broadcasting Corporation (NRK) Fide announces a delayed decision in the chess row between Carlsen and Niemann.

NORWAY POSTS
The International Chess Federation (FIDE) is taking a long time to conclude the investigation into the conflict between Magnus Carlsen and Hans Niemann.
A decision from the association’s ethics and disciplinary committee (EDC) was expected to come at the beginning of April, but it never happened. Now the chess community must be even more patient.
In an email to NRK, Fide states that the matter is still under consideration.
– Due to certain preliminary processes, a final decision from EDC is not expected soon, writes marketing and communications manager David Llada.
NRK’s ​​chess expert Torstein Bae thinks it is unfortunate that the case is dragging on.
– When a time is given, you should be able to deliver on it, he believes.
On 24 February, Fides’ commission for fair play announced that a 30-page report on the Carlsen/Niemann row had been sent to the EDC. It was then announced that a decision would be known within six weeks.

https://norway.postsen.com/sports/11105 ... emann.html

JM2C: The Carlsen/Niemann case is not just an internal chess affair, but one that has attracted worldwide attention. Well, I hope public pressure and the media interest will become great, too great, and FIDE must react. And the media are resourceful enough that the 30-page report of the special commission will definitely leak somehow and sometime.
.

[chrisw]

"The decision of the FIDE should actually be made shortly"
https://www.fide.com/news/2249

As feared by some, the final decision of FIDE, contrary to its own statement, is far away. In an e-mail to The Norwegian Broadcasting Corporation (NRK) Fide announces a delayed decision in the chess row between Carlsen and Niemann.

NORWAY POSTS
The International Chess Federation (FIDE) is taking a long time to conclude the investigation into the conflict between Magnus Carlsen and Hans Niemann.
A decision from the association’s ethics and disciplinary committee (EDC) was expected to come at the beginning of April, but it never happened. Now the chess community must be even more patient.
In an email to NRK, Fide states that the matter is still under consideration.
– Due to certain preliminary processes, a final decision from EDC is not expected soon, writes marketing and communications manager David Llada.
NRK’s ​​chess expert Torstein Bae thinks it is unfortunate that the case is dragging on.
– When a time is given, you should be able to deliver on it, he believes.
On 24 February, Fides’ commission for fair play announced that a 30-page report on the Carlsen/Niemann row had been sent to the EDC. It was then announced that a decision would be known within six weeks.

https://norway.postsen.com/sports/11105 ... emann.html

JM2C: The Carlsen/Niemann case is not just an internal chess affair, but one that has attracted worldwide attention. Well, I hope public pressure and the media interest will become great, too great, and FIDE must react. And the media are resourceful enough that the 30-page report of the special commission will definitely leak somehow and sometime.
.

That this complaining report originated in Norway chess indicates conflict between someone in Norway and FIDE. Parties can still write, question and make submissions to FIDE and EC at any time.

FIDE can’t sanction Hans for something he’s already been sanctioned for (double jeopardy), there’s no current unpunished cheating evidence, so that leaves chess.Com and Magnus in the frame for criticism. Chess.Com already are advertising for a new CEO.

[Robert Flesher]

Imho, caught a cheater, always a cheater! Hang him out to dry!

No second chances for a 19 year old?

I know what your saying Ed and perhaps my statement was more harsh than was needed. However, If the evidence that was reported is correct, there can be no doubt he has won many cash prized tournaments by cheating. Not only when he was 19. As a chess player who fought tooth and nail for every rating point I have, I have no pity or remorse for those who cheat.

[rainhaus]

"The decision of the FIDE should actually be made shortly"
https://www.fide.com/news/2249

As feared by some, the final decision of FIDE, contrary to its own statement, is far away. In an e-mail to The Norwegian Broadcasting Corporation (NRK) Fide announces a delayed decision in the chess row between Carlsen and Niemann.

NORWAY POSTS
The International Chess Federation (FIDE) is taking a long time to conclude the investigation into the conflict between Magnus Carlsen and Hans Niemann.
A decision from the association’s ethics and disciplinary committee (EDC) was expected to come at the beginning of April, but it never happened. Now the chess community must be even more patient.
In an email to NRK, Fide states that the matter is still under consideration.
– Due to certain preliminary processes, a final decision from EDC is not expected soon, writes marketing and communications manager David Llada.
NRK’s ​​chess expert Torstein Bae thinks it is unfortunate that the case is dragging on.
– When a time is given, you should be able to deliver on it, he believes.
On 24 February, Fides’ commission for fair play announced that a 30-page report on the Carlsen/Niemann row had been sent to the EDC. It was then announced that a decision would be known within six weeks.

https://norway.postsen.com/sports/11105 ... emann.html

JM2C: The Carlsen/Niemann case is not just an internal chess affair, but one that has attracted worldwide attention. Well, I hope public pressure and the media interest will become great, too great, and FIDE must react. And the media are resourceful enough that the 30-page report of the special commission will definitely leak somehow and sometime.
.

That this complaining report originated in Norway chess indicates conflict between someone in Norway and FIDE. Parties can still write, question and make submissions to FIDE and EC at any time.

FIDE can’t sanction Hans for something he’s already been sanctioned for (double jeopardy), there’s no current unpunished cheating evidence, so that leaves chess.Com and Magnus in the frame for criticism. Chess.Com already are advertising for a new CEO.

Interesting prospects and there is definitely some truth to your point of view, but then it would all be just noise from FIDE. Nevertheless, the curiosity remains on what exactly is in the report.
.
.

[rainhaus]

Imho, caught a cheater, always a cheater! Hang him out to dry!

No second chances for a 19 year old?

I know what your saying Ed and perhaps my statement was more harsh than was needed. However, If the evidence that was reported is correct, there can be no doubt he has won many cash prized tournaments by cheating. Not only when he was 19. As a chess player who fought tooth and nail for every rating point I have, I have no pity or remorse for those who cheat.

Your previous post sounds a lot like Wild West film, for example in Hang 'EM high with Clint Eastwood. Codex: For sure, hang him up, if he really did it, we'll find out later. Ok, that sounds much milder now.

But once a cheat, always a cheat is also a very radical and hardly tenable view, IMHO
.

[chrisw]

"The decision of the FIDE should actually be made shortly"
https://www.fide.com/news/2249

As feared by some, the final decision of FIDE, contrary to its own statement, is far away. In an e-mail to The Norwegian Broadcasting Corporation (NRK) Fide announces a delayed decision in the chess row between Carlsen and Niemann.

NORWAY POSTS
The International Chess Federation (FIDE) is taking a long time to conclude the investigation into the conflict between Magnus Carlsen and Hans Niemann.
A decision from the association’s ethics and disciplinary committee (EDC) was expected to come at the beginning of April, but it never happened. Now the chess community must be even more patient.
In an email to NRK, Fide states that the matter is still under consideration.
– Due to certain preliminary processes, a final decision from EDC is not expected soon, writes marketing and communications manager David Llada.
NRK’s ​​chess expert Torstein Bae thinks it is unfortunate that the case is dragging on.
– When a time is given, you should be able to deliver on it, he believes.
On 24 February, Fides’ commission for fair play announced that a 30-page report on the Carlsen/Niemann row had been sent to the EDC. It was then announced that a decision would be known within six weeks.

https://norway.postsen.com/sports/11105 ... emann.html

JM2C: The Carlsen/Niemann case is not just an internal chess affair, but one that has attracted worldwide attention. Well, I hope public pressure and the media interest will become great, too great, and FIDE must react. And the media are resourceful enough that the 30-page report of the special commission will definitely leak somehow and sometime.
.

That this complaining report originated in Norway chess indicates conflict between someone in Norway and FIDE. Parties can still write, question and make submissions to FIDE and EC at any time.

FIDE can’t sanction Hans for something he’s already been sanctioned for (double jeopardy), there’s no current unpunished cheating evidence, so that leaves chess.Com and Magnus in the frame for criticism. Chess.Com already are advertising for a new CEO.

Interesting prospects and there is definitely some truth to your point of view, but then it would all be just noise from FIDE. Nevertheless, the curiosity remains on what exactly is in the report.
.
.

It may of course be that the journalist doesn't understand the FIDE process? When we took ICGA to the FIDE Ethics Committee (case Rybka), I found them to be very professional and thorough but the process consumed much time. The first "decision", which may be what is being referred to here, is by the Ethics Committee who decide if the case is "answerable" or "acceptable", the latter being the word, IIRC. There's a period of time while they gather statements from the parties, a bit of to-ing and fro-ing of documents/letters, and then they decide on acceptability. If it passes that, then the case goes before the Ethics Committee which meets yearly to decide cases, IIRC.
Is there any special reason FIDE should step outside its normal timescales (the thing takes almost two years in practice) for this particular case? Apart from media noise it's not that special a big deal, is it?

The 30 page report is likely to be as factual and non-opinionated as FIDE can make it. My strong guess is that the "decision" is only going to be on "acceptable" status (or not) of going on for the Ethics Committee to make a ruling sometime in the future.

[rainhaus]

It may of course be that the journalist doesn't understand the FIDE process? When we took ICGA to the FIDE Ethics Committee (case Rybka), I found them to be very professional and thorough but the process consumed much time. The first "decision", which may be what is being referred to here, is by the Ethics Committee who decide if the case is "answerable" or "acceptable", the latter being the word, IIRC. There's a period of time while they gather statements from the parties, a bit of to-ing and fro-ing of documents/letters, and then they decide on acceptability. If it passes that, then the case goes before the Ethics Committee which meets yearly to decide cases, IIRC.
_________________________
Is there any special reason FIDE should step outside its normal timescales (the thing takes almost two years in practice) for this particular case? Apart from media noise it's not that special a big deal, is it?

A central question, but it must be said that FIDE has brought itself to this time pressure.
It was not only a big media spectacle, but the case also brought the international tournament scene up to speed with new security measures and regulations.
But perhaps a reversal process is now taking place at FIDE, just as you describe. The worldwide hysterical interest, mainly because of the piquant Morse code vibration highlight, has passed and consequently FIDE is returning to its usual working procedures.

[chrisw]

It may of course be that the journalist doesn't understand the FIDE process? When we took ICGA to the FIDE Ethics Committee (case Rybka), I found them to be very professional and thorough but the process consumed much time. The first "decision", which may be what is being referred to here, is by the Ethics Committee who decide if the case is "answerable" or "acceptable", the latter being the word, IIRC. There's a period of time while they gather statements from the parties, a bit of to-ing and fro-ing of documents/letters, and then they decide on acceptability. If it passes that, then the case goes before the Ethics Committee which meets yearly to decide cases, IIRC.
_________________________
Is there any special reason FIDE should step outside its normal timescales (the thing takes almost two years in practice) for this particular case? Apart from media noise it's not that special a big deal, is it?

A central question, but it must be said that FIDE has brought itself to this time pressure.
It was not only a big media spectacle, but the case also brought the international tournament scene up to speed with new security measures and regulations.
But perhaps a reversal process is now taking place at FIDE, just as you describe. The worldwide hysterical interest, mainly because of the piquant Morse code vibration highlight, has passed and consequently FIDE is returning to its usual working procedures.

FIDE seems to be behaving itself okay. It’s not putting out threatening and hysterical press releases as it goes along. It’s not run by a psychopath. It’s not seeking to publicly personal assassinate any of the parties either as it goes along or in preparation. I think we can assume a generally fair process, and fair processes, of necessity, take time. Come back in one year?

[dkappe]

FIDE seems to be behaving itself okay. It’s not putting out threatening and hysterical press releases as it goes along. It’s not run by a psychopath. It’s not seeking to publicly personal assassinate any of the parties either as it goes along or in preparation. I think we can assume a generally fair process, and fair processes, of necessity, take time. Come back in one year?

Is the Nieman lawsuit still active? If so, the activities and evidence of the FIDE investigation would be discoverable. One of those reasons why organizations often don’t initiate investigations while litigation is pending.