Computer Chess Openings: Modern defense

[Graham Banks]

There is a reason that the Elite GMs regularly play 1...e5 against each other and almost never 1...g6. It is a better move. But in my opinion not nearly as much better as the above evals imply.
Both Komodo and Stockfish are tuned for best results, and these results are achieved with evals that wildly overstate transitory positional factors. I don't fully uonderstand why this is so or what if anything we can do about it, but I'm open to good ideas.

Hi Larry,

in the online Chessbase database, 1...g6 almost has the best success rate against e4, narrowly edged by only the Sicilian. The result percentage in the table below refers to White's success rate against each move.
Of course, other online databases may differ.

Perhaps you're right about it not being preferred so much by elite GMs - not sure.

Graham.

[Sven]

in the online Chessbase database, 1...g6 almost has the best success rate against e4

For training I use a database containing only games where both players have a rating >= 2400. There 1...g6 has a much higher success rate for white (about 58%) compared to 1...e5, 1...c5, 1...e6 or other standard openings which are usually in the range of 54% .. 55%. A higher success rate (for white) does not necessarily mean that it is a "losing" move for black, or that black has already a disadvantage. For me it just says that the move might increase the probability of playing positions that are difficult for black and can already be lost by playing one "suboptimal" move.

Also, success rates suffer from including an unknown portion of "bad moves" from the past that were preferred for some time until someone found a refutation. And finally, in some cases success rates suffer from losing won (or drawn) positions later in the game due to other reasons (blunder, time, ...).

Therefore I never really trust success rates.

[jdart]

I think of the Modern as being A41-A42, while you are including Pirc lines too.

IMO among the more difficult lines for Black are those in which White gets in an early h3, so that Black does not have .. Bg4.

Some GMs even go h3 as early as move 4, for example:

1. d4 g6 2. Nf3 Bg7 3. e4 d6 4. h3

--Jon

[carldaman]

I think of the Modern as being A41-A42, while you are including Pirc lines too.

IMO among the more difficult lines for Black are those in which White gets in an early h3, so that Black does not have .. Bg4.

Some GMs even go h3 as early as move 4, for example:

1. d4 g6 2. Nf3 Bg7 3. e4 d6 4. h3

--Jon

A41-42 and also B06 are the usual ECO codes assigned to the Modern Defense.
B07-B09 is the Pirc Defense.

[Henk]

End conclusion: modern defense is perfectly playable.

[d] r1bqk1nr/pppnppbp/3p2p1/8/2BPP3/5N2/PPP2PPP/RNBQK2R w KQkq - 2 5

[jdart]

Ok, but 1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. f3 Nf6 4. c4 Bg7 5. Ne2 (which a bunch of Graham's line begin with) is a Saemisch King's Indian (E83).

--Jon

[Nordlandia]

Why is that Carlsen never plays or face najdorf variation?

[carldaman]

Ok, but 1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. f3 Nf6 4. c4 Bg7 5. Ne2 (which a bunch of Graham's line begin with) is a Saemisch King's Indian (E83).

--Jon

Yes, playing an early Nf6 usually transposes to other openings -- and thus no longer called the Modern.

CL

[Graham Banks]

Ok, but 1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. f3 Nf6 4. c4 Bg7 5. Ne2 (which a bunch of Graham's line begin with) is a Saemisch King's Indian (E83).

--Jon

Yes, playing an early Nf6 usually transposes to other openings -- and thus no longer called the Modern.

CL

Having some Pirc lines and KID lines thrown in amongst the Modern Defense lines is a bonus.

[carldaman]

Ok, but 1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. f3 Nf6 4. c4 Bg7 5. Ne2 (which a bunch of Graham's line begin with) is a Saemisch King's Indian (E83).

--Jon

Yes, playing an early Nf6 usually transposes to other openings -- and thus no longer called the Modern.

CL

Having some Pirc lines and KID lines thrown in amongst the Modern Defense lines is a bonus.

The more the merrier!