Ordo question

[Vinvin]

I'm eager to see your list with 6.3M games !
My latest list is here : http://www.talkchess.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=668208

After a lot of cleaning up and introducing a last minute error, which made it necessary to delete and reimport games of one player, the list is finally there.

The link is on the right side of the main index site. There is also a download for the (ordo) preprocessed pgn file together with the used batch file. (except the real number of simulations run)
It would be nice if you or someone else could run the file with the given batch (200 simuls) and send me the resulting file.
(I will add then those numbers - currently the error numbers are only run with a sparse 10 simuls due to lack of processor time here)

I combined as much entities as possible due to my longtime knowledge of all programs/program versions - in case of doubt I did nothing of course!.
It is still possible that there are a few double entries - please report them.

I also took the freedom to rename a few programs and marked all versions with less than 30 games and some 'others'...

If I should add something more to the introduction which references your idea and developing the list(s), just let me know.

Merry Christmas

http://rwbc-chess.de/

Hi Guenther,
very good news !
You should consider to create a new post, I only saw this message because I'd want to suggest you some interesting tournaments with older engines here : http://computerchessoldies.beepworld.de/downloads.htm

Games:
Battle of Legends 2014
Battle of Legends 2015
CCO-Tournament 2014-2015
CCO-A-Tournament 2015-2016

[Vinvin]

...
It would be nice if you or someone else could run the file with the given batch (200 simuls) and send me the resulting file.
(I will add then those numbers - currently the error numbers are only run with a sparse 10 simuls due to lack of processor time here)

I've started the .bat. How much time will it take ?

[Vinvin]

I also took the freedom to rename a few programs and marked all versions with less than 30 games and some 'others'...

1) For what I know :

Fritz 8 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 8 with 1 CPU.
Fritz 9 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 9 with 1 CPU.
....
same thing until Fritz 13.
For Fritz 14, I don't remember exactly.
For Fritz 15, it's the same engine as Deep Fritz 15.

2) Don't you think these 2 engines are the same one : "Junior 12" and "Junior 120" ?

[Vinvin]

I also took the freedom to rename a few programs and marked all versions with less than 30 games and some 'others'...

1) For what I know :

Fritz 8 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 8 with 1 CPU.
Fritz 9 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 9 with 1 CPU.
....
same thing until Fritz 13.
For Fritz 14, I don't remember exactly.
For Fritz 15, it's the same engine as Deep Fritz 15.

2) Don't you think these 2 engines are the same one : "Junior 12" and "Junior 120" ?

Some more remarks :

1) You merged 2 versions of Movei : "0.08.438" and "0.08.438 P10", but I think the "P10" version gave a remarkable Elo boost, this 2 versions shouldn't be merged.

2) For Shredder and Junior you can merge 32bit and 64bit versions as the 64bit compile doesn't give Elo boost.

3) What's the difference between "Rybka 4" and "Rybka 4*" ?

[Vinvin]

I also took the freedom to rename a few programs and marked all versions with less than 30 games and some 'others'...

1) For what I know :

Fritz 8 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 8 with 1 CPU.
Fritz 9 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 9 with 1 CPU.
....
same thing until Fritz 13.
For Fritz 14, I don't remember exactly.
For Fritz 15, it's the same engine as Deep Fritz 15.

2) Don't you think these 2 engines are the same one : "Junior 12" and "Junior 120" ?

Some more remarks :

1) You merged 2 versions of Movei : "0.08.438" and "0.08.438 P10", but I think the "P10" version gave a remarkable Elo boost, this 2 versions shouldn't be merged.

2) For Shredder and Junior you can merge 32bit and 64bit versions as the 64bit compile doesn't give Elo boost.

3) What's the difference between "Rybka 4" and "Rybka 4*" ?

1 more question about "Kallisto II", I see on your list it has only 20 games but on the SSDF list, I see it played 142 there :

177 Kallisto II 64MB P200 MMX, 2346
Fritz 5 P200X 11-14 Nimzo98 P200X 9,5-10,5 Rebel 9 P200X 18-22
Hiarcs6 P200X 18,5-18,5 Shred 2 P200X 7,5-12,5

[Vinvin]

I also took the freedom to rename a few programs and marked all versions with less than 30 games and some 'others'...

1) For what I know :

Fritz 8 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 8 with 1 CPU.
Fritz 9 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 9 with 1 CPU.
....
same thing until Fritz 13.
For Fritz 14, I don't remember exactly.
For Fritz 15, it's the same engine as Deep Fritz 15.

2) Don't you think these 2 engines are the same one : "Junior 12" and "Junior 120" ?

Some more remarks :

1) You merged 2 versions of Movei : "0.08.438" and "0.08.438 P10", but I think the "P10" version gave a remarkable Elo boost, this 2 versions shouldn't be merged.

2) For Shredder and Junior you can merge 32bit and 64bit versions as the 64bit compile doesn't give Elo boost.

3) What's the difference between "Rybka 4" and "Rybka 4*" ?

1 more question about "Kallisto II", I see on your list it has only 20 games but on the SSDF list, I see it played 142 there :

177 Kallisto II 64MB P200 MMX, 2346
Fritz 5 P200X 11-14 Nimzo98 P200X 9,5-10,5 Rebel 9 P200X 18-22
Hiarcs6 P200X 18,5-18,5 Shred 2 P200X 7,5-12,5

Same for Genius 3 P90 :

184 Genius 3.0 Pentium 90 MHz, 2312
Rebel 8.0 P90 8,5-11,5 MCPro 6.0 P90 4,5-15,5
MCPro 5.0 P90 7-13 Rebel 6.0 P90 9-11 Genius 4 P90 8-12
Rebel 7.0 P90 10,5-9,5 Hiarcs 4 P90 9,5-10,5 CM5000 P90 12,5-7,5
Nimzo 3.0 P90 13-7 Hiarcs 3 P90 14,5-5,5
MCPro 4.0 P90 13,5-6,5 Fritz 3.0 P90 14,5-5,5 Wchess P90 14-6
Fritz 4.0 P90 10-10 Kallis198 P90 14-6

1 more point : for me, WChess 1.06 and 1.6 are the same version.
Nobody succeeded to prove me wrong.

[Guenther]

I also took the freedom to rename a few programs and marked all versions with less than 30 games and some 'others'...

1) For what I know :

Fritz 8 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 8 with 1 CPU.
Fritz 9 is not the same engine as Deep Fritz 9 with 1 CPU.
....
same thing until Fritz 13.
For Fritz 14, I don't remember exactly.
For Fritz 15, it's the same engine as Deep Fritz 15.

2) Don't you think these 2 engines are the same one : "Junior 12" and "Junior 120" ?

Some more remarks :

1) You merged 2 versions of Movei : "0.08.438" and "0.08.438 P10", but I think the "P10" version gave a remarkable Elo boost, this 2 versions shouldn't be merged.

2) For Shredder and Junior you can merge 32bit and 64bit versions as the 64bit compile doesn't give Elo boost.

3) What's the difference between "Rybka 4" and "Rybka 4*" ?

Rybka 4* is 'Fritz' 15 (I thought I mentioned it somewhere)

I don't think P10 or whatever setting gave statistical relevant differences,
moreover it seems it was nearly always used - I just omitted it...
like 'contempt' settings.

For the SSDF question did you read the comment in the introduction?
SSDF could be only included for the games when both opponents played
the same hardware, otherwise it would falsify the results.
(and I started with a minimum hardware of P90 IIRC - and no arm/board
hardware etc.)
The SSDF games were all filtered therefore before.

[Guenther]

1 more point : for me, WChess 1.06 and 1.6 are the same version.
Nobody succeeded to prove me wrong.

It seems to me you are right and CCRL once introduced that numbering 1.06
by accident and keeps with it, when the rest of the world always named it 1.6.

http://www.computerchess.org.uk/ccrl/40 ... ess%201.06

Funny is even internally CCRL falls back to 1.6 sometimes.
http://kirill-kryukov.com/chess/discuss ... f=7&t=4494

Historical remarks ;-)
http://www.stmintz.com/ccc/index.php?id=449708

[Guenther]

1 more point : for me, WChess 1.06 and 1.6 are the same version.
Nobody succeeded to prove me wrong.

It seems to me you are right and CCRL once introduced that numbering 1.06
by accident and keeps with it, when the rest of the world always named it 1.6.

http://www.computerchess.org.uk/ccrl/40 ... ess%201.06

Funny is even internally CCRL falls back to 1.6 sometimes.
http://kirill-kryukov.com/chess/discuss ... f=7&t=4494

Historical remarks ;-)
http://www.stmintz.com/ccc/index.php?id=449708

Hmmm may be not according to this it is 1.06?
It is also still possible they are different versions :(

http://www.stmintz.com/ccc/index.php?id=450836

[Guenther]

...
It would be nice if you or someone else could run the file with the given batch (200 simuls) and send me the resulting file.
(I will add then those numbers - currently the error numbers are only run with a sparse 10 simuls due to lack of processor time here)

I've started the .bat. How much time will it take ?

Please run it again :)

After some research I finally merged WChess 1.6 and 1.06 to 1.6 and of course Junior 12 and 120 to 12.
The updated file is uploaded already.

(I will not merge 32/64 bit versions for some programs even if they show practically no difference - after all I separated the columns for bits/cores
to give that info)

For 50 simuls the time needed was once nearly 4 hours on 1 core on my 2009 quadcore.