Carlsen or Nepomniachtchi – Who will win?

[Eduard]

Maybe I am too spoiled? The fact is that engines will win against every world champion with only 5 minutes, even if the WCh gets 3 hours to think. Our Blitz games on the server are two categories better.

For Game 2: Badly played by both sides, that's a fact! If the resulting position on move 20 is too complicated for a WCh, then I no longer watch such human games.

An artist at the board found himself in a situation where he chose to give up a rook and bishop - neither of which had moved, for two minor pieces which had spent 6 moves just getting to 18...Nac5 and were the most powerfully placed pieces in Blacks army…and gets a ‘forever knight’ in on d6 and the better light squared bishop to boot…and you find some, I guess, ‘computer eval’ fault with this decision?

Spoiled may not be the right word, but yes, perhaps you should go back to your engines, that’s clearly where your heart is. Carlsen uses his brain to engage in alchemy at the board, while you push around engines.

Actually, you seem to be criticizing the very kind of play you would champion from matches of yesteryear.

I can play chess a little too. The fact is that Carlsen has clearly exceeded the position in game 2, and both players then lost the overview. It's a joke that Carlsen finds game 2 fascinating. It is time we got a new world champion, there are some new young talents, they will play better.

[Cornfed]

Maybe I am too spoiled? The fact is that engines will win against every world champion with only 5 minutes, even if the WCh gets 3 hours to think. Our Blitz games on the server are two categories better.

For Game 2: Badly played by both sides, that's a fact! If the resulting position on move 20 is too complicated for a WCh, then I no longer watch such human games.

An artist at the board found himself in a situation where he chose to give up a rook and bishop - neither of which had moved, for two minor pieces which had spent 6 moves just getting to 18...Nac5 and were the most powerfully placed pieces in Blacks army…and gets a ‘forever knight’ in on d6 and the better light squared bishop to boot…and you find some, I guess, ‘computer eval’ fault with this decision?

Spoiled may not be the right word, but yes, perhaps you should go back to your engines, that’s clearly where your heart is. Carlsen uses his brain to engage in alchemy at the board, while you push around engines.

Actually, you seem to be criticizing the very kind of play you would champion from matches of yesteryear.

I can play chess a little too. The fact is that Carlsen has clearly exceeded the position in game 2, and both players then lost the overview. It's a joke that Carlsen finds game 2 fascinating. It is time we got a new world champion, there are some new young talents, they will play better.

I don't know that he found game 2 'fascinating'...I certainly did though.

Anyway, I like to think I know when to keep my mouth shut so...adios.

[Chessqueen]

I don't know exactly, but I think Fischer got $ 200,000 against Spassky (24 games) in the first match 1972. The price money for these 14 games in Dubai is 2 million euros.

I could not resist to make a comparison In 1972 Bobby Fischer $200,000 is equal to $1,308,915 in today's Money Adjusted for inflation. Annual inflation over this period was 3.83%. Value of a dollar. https://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/i ... a%20dollar.
And Bobby Fischer in 1992, over 29 years ago won 3.35 Millions which is 1.5 more than the winner of this match. which is equal to over 5 millions in todays money https://www.upi.com/Archives/1992/11/05 ... 720939600/

Note: 1 million back in 1992 is worth about 1.8 million today which makes the 3.35 million that Fischer won back in 1992 equal to a little bit over 5 million in today's money. Adjusted for inflation, $1,000,000 in 1992 is equal to $1,888,861 in 2021. Annual inflation over this period was 2.22%. https://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/i ... %202.22%25.

[Cornfed]

I don't know exactly, but I think Fischer got $ 200,000 against Spassky (24 games) in the first match 1972. The price money for these 14 games in Dubai is 2 million euros.

I could not resist to make a comparison In 1972 Bobby Fischer $200,000 is equal to $1,308,915 in today's Money Adjusted for inflation. Annual inflation over this period was 3.83%. Value of a dollar. https://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/i ... a%20dollar.
And Bobby Fischer in 1992, over 29 years ago won 3.35 Millions which is 1.5 more than the winner of this match. which is equal to over 5 millions in todays money https://www.upi.com/Archives/1992/11/05 ... 720939600/

Note: 1 million back in 1992 is worth about 1.8 million today which makes the 3.35 million that Fischer won back in 1992 equal to a little bit over 5 million in today's money. Adjusted for inflation, $1,000,000 in 1992 is equal to $1,888,861 in 2021. Annual inflation over this period was 2.22%. https://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/i ... %202.22%25.

Do remember the person footing the prize fund was a flim-flam artist guilty of a Ponzi scheme...stole $130 million from his 'bank'...crony of the war criminal Milosevic...
Kind of not fair to even throw that into the mix...

[jdart]

[So the same as how Kasparov lost to Kramnik in 2000? He underestimated Kramnik, who came to the board much better prepared.

Kasparov was famous for his deep preparation. In all his previous matches he was the more prepared player. For example, when he prepared the Scotch Game for his match with Karpov, or the Evans Gambit for his match with Anand. For the Kramnik match, for whatever reason, he did not have a second and he was not as well prepared. But more importantly, I think he was spooked by Kramnik. He regarded Kramnik as his most dangerous challenger, he had had trouble winning against him before the match, and he was not confident.

[Chessqueen]

I don't know exactly, but I think Fischer got $ 200,000 against Spassky (24 games) in the first match 1972. The price money for these 14 games in Dubai is 2 million euros.

I could not resist to make a comparison In 1972 Bobby Fischer $200,000 is equal to $1,308,915 in today's Money Adjusted for inflation, and 30% of the proceeds from television and film rights, 30% of the box-office receipts. Annual inflation over this period was 3.83%. Value of a dollar. https://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/i ... a%20dollar.
And Bobby Fischer in 1992, over 29 years ago won 3.35 Millions which is 1.5 more than the winner of this match. which is equal to over 5 millions in todays money https://www.upi.com/Archives/1992/11/05 ... 720939600/

Note: 1 million back in 1992 is worth about 1.8 million today which makes the 3.35 million that Fischer won back in 1992 equal to a little bit over 5 million in today's money. Adjusted for inflation, $1,000,000 in 1992 is equal to $1,888,861 in 2021. Annual inflation over this period was 2.22%. https://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/i ... %202.22%25.

Do remember the person footing the prize fund was a flim-flam artist guilty of a Ponzi scheme...stole $130 million from his 'bank'...crony of the war criminal Milosevic...
Kind of not fair to even throw that into the mix...

I do Remember, but still he made in 1992 29 years ago much more money than Carlsen is making for this Match. Which make me think how much Money are these Magnate Oil producers making after they raise the Oil price due to Covi19. Therefore, when we all purchase Gasoline and other derivative we are the one paying for this Championship.

[Eduard]

One last word from me about the game in Dubai, in German I say it like this:

I will not be fooled!

The fact is, Game 2 was very bad. To call such a game fascinating (ChessBase homepage) is dumbing down the people!

The same goes for an article in which a GM shows an analysis with Fat Fritz 2. FF2 is long out of date. Both the new Stockfish network and the new Stockfish engine are significantly better than FF2. The fact that something like this is deliberately concealed from the readers is also dumbing down the people.

[amanjpro]

One last word from me about the game in Dubai, in German I say it like this:

I will not be fooled!

The fact is, Game 2 was very bad. To call such a game fascinating (ChessBase homepage) is dumbing down the people!

The same goes for an article in which a GM shows an analysis with Fat Fritz 2. FF2 is long out of date. Both the new Stockfish network and the new Stockfish engine are significantly better than FF2. The fact that something like this is deliberately concealed from the readers is also dumbing down the people.

Well, any human player is also long overdue, they were born at leat 20 years ago.... now can you please leave room for other ideas to be circulated, your point is made, and whoever agrees with you has already done so, the rest don't care much about your opinion.

[Eduard]

Do you want to forbid me to write my opinion here? Who are you that you are allowed to do that? Do not read my posts, thank you!

[dkappe]

One last word from me about the game in Dubai, in German I say it like this:

I will not be fooled!

The fact is, Game 2 was very bad. To call such a game fascinating (ChessBase homepage) is dumbing down the people!

Well, any human player is also long overdue, they were born at leat 20 years ago.... now can you please leave room for other ideas to be circulated, your point is made, and whoever agrees with you has already done so, the rest don't care much about your opinion.

I am actually quite interested in the effect that engines have on the appreciation of chess. I guess I’d also say it in German: deine Schach Ästhetik is durch die Schach Computer verstümmelt worden. (“Your Chess aesthetic has been mutilated by chess computers.”)