CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Discussion of computer chess matches and engine tournaments.

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Christopher Conkie
Posts: 6074
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2006 9:34 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by Christopher Conkie »

Sven Schüle wrote:I think a5 is a loser against a computer. You can't give him an advantage of a pawn which is also a passer, without getting any counterplay. There is nothing to gain on the queen side. You would have to prepare a5 by Qa3 at least.

I also believe that after Bg4, e6 does no harm. We could just play Qa3 and after exd5 answer exd5.

And yes, Nd2 is passive but Bc7 is passive, too.

One hidden power of black is the pair of bishops which can pop up in the endgame unless we exchange one of them.

So I still keep up my vote for Bg4.

Sven
I really cannot decide between a5 and Bg4. Really I should stick to my original thought of a5. For now, I abstain.

:)

Christopher
Steve B
Posts: 3697
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:26 pm

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by Steve B »

gerold wrote:
Spock wrote:I think we have so far

Bg4 - Sven, Matthias, Graham
Qc3 - Tano, Steve

About another 5 hrs to go on the vote

I vote for Qc3.

I prefer a5 but no one is voting for it yet.

Best.

Gerold.

P.S.
If a couple votes would come in for a5 i will change my vote
for a5.

if i switch to a5 we would then have a tie between a5-3 votes and Bg4-3 votes(assuming you also switch Gerold)

rather then a tie between Qc3-3 votes and Bg4-3 votes which is the situation now
so the question then becomes..what would a "Swami Tiebreaker" bring us?

im guessing he would opt for Qc3 over Bg4 and Bg4 over a5 so ill stick with Qc3

Deep Analysis Regards
Steve
Spock

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by Spock »

This time, lesson learnt, I'll wait till the voting deadline has actually passed before calling in a tie breaker :wink:
Sven
Posts: 4052
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 9:57 pm
Location: Berlin, Germany
Full name: Sven Schüle

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by Sven »

Christopher Conkie wrote:
Sven Schüle wrote:I think a5 is a loser against a computer. You can't give him an advantage of a pawn which is also a passer, without getting any counterplay. There is nothing to gain on the queen side. You would have to prepare a5 by Qa3 at least.

I also believe that after Bg4, e6 does no harm. We could just play Qa3 and after exd5 answer exd5.

And yes, Nd2 is passive but Bc7 is passive, too.

One hidden power of black is the pair of bishops which can pop up in the endgame unless we exchange one of them.

So I still keep up my vote for Bg4.

Sven
I really cannot decide between a5 and Bg4. Really I should stick to my original thought of a5. For now, I abstain.

:)

Christopher
So who of the a5 promoters can explain, please, why he thinks that a5 is *not* a losing move? It's a pawn sac, at least ...

The answer to my question could already be the tie-breaker :-)

Note that I don't use an engine and assume the others don't, too.

Sven
gerold
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:57 am
Location: van buren,missouri

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by gerold »

Steve B wrote:
gerold wrote:
Spock wrote:I think we have so far

Bg4 - Sven, Matthias, Graham
Qc3 - Tano, Steve

About another 5 hrs to go on the vote

I vote for Qc3.

I prefer a5 but no one is voting for it yet.

Best.

Gerold.

P.S.
If a couple votes would come in for a5 i will change my vote
for a5.

if i switch to a5 we would then have a tie between a5-3 votes and Bg4-3 votes(assuming you also switch Gerold)

rather then a tie between Qc3-3 votes and Bg4-3 votes which is the situation now
so the question then becomes..what would a "Swami Tiebreaker" bring us?

im guessing he would opt for Qc3 over Bg4 and Bg4 over a5 so ill stick with Qc3

Deep Analysis Regards
Steve
Ok Steve i will stick with Qc3.
Qc3 will help Q side and give the Q a chance to move to King side.

I change my mind on playing the a5 as it would weaken
the Q side to much. To trade the white B at this time
would also weaken our King side which is already weak.

Qc3. and than Bf3 for more support in the middle and
King Side.

Best.

Gerold.
Steve B
Posts: 3697
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:26 pm

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by Steve B »

gerold wrote:
Ok Steve i will stick with Qc3.
Qc3 will help Q side and give the Q a chance to move to King side.
Very good Gerold
Qc3 is certainly not a bad move and actually its about time we brought the Q into play

now its all up to the Tiebreaker..

Fingers Crossed Regards
Steve
playjunior
Posts: 338
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:53 am

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by playjunior »

Sven Schüle wrote:
Christopher Conkie wrote:
Sven Schüle wrote:I think a5 is a loser against a computer. You can't give him an advantage of a pawn which is also a passer, without getting any counterplay. There is nothing to gain on the queen side. You would have to prepare a5 by Qa3 at least.

I also believe that after Bg4, e6 does no harm. We could just play Qa3 and after exd5 answer exd5.

And yes, Nd2 is passive but Bc7 is passive, too.

One hidden power of black is the pair of bishops which can pop up in the endgame unless we exchange one of them.

So I still keep up my vote for Bg4.

Sven
I really cannot decide between a5 and Bg4. Really I should stick to my original thought of a5. For now, I abstain.

:)

Christopher
So who of the a5 promoters can explain, please, why he thinks that a5 is *not* a losing move? It's a pawn sac, at least ...

The answer to my question could already be the tie-breaker :-)

Note that I don't use an engine and assume the others don't, too.

Sven
1. a5 ba? 2.Rb1!
a) Bb6 (or Qa8) Q:e5

I believe this would be +/- at least, if not +-. I mean black gets totally ripped off in 2 moves.

[d] 1qbr1rk1/p3p1pp/1b1n4/p1pPQ3/2P1P3/4N2P/3NBPP1/1R3RK1 b - - 0 3
playjunior
Posts: 338
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:53 am

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by playjunior »

Btw I think Bg4 is also a very good move, not sure about Qc3. It is either a waste of time or a good move, don't know which.
Christopher Conkie
Posts: 6074
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2006 9:34 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by Christopher Conkie »

playjunior wrote:Btw I think Bg4 is also a very good move, not sure about Qc3. It is either a waste of time or a good move, don't know which.
You have persuaded me a5 it is for me then.

Christopher
Sven
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Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 9:57 pm
Location: Berlin, Germany
Full name: Sven Schüle

Re: CCC Forum vs BigLion chess960

Post by Sven »

playjunior wrote: 1. a5 ba? 2.Rb1!
a) Bb6 (or Qa8) Q:e5

I believe this would be +/- at least, if not +-. I mean black gets totally ripped off in 2 moves.
1.a5 bxa5 2.Rb1 Bb7 and black defends e5, correct? 3.Qb2 may pose problems in this position since Bb7 and Nd6 can't move. But what I mean is that a computer would probably defeat us with a pawn up in such a position if we can't destroy him immediately.

Also after 3.Qb2 I think that black might play 3...Qc8 followed by 4...Ba6 and play against our c4 pawn.

I'm not using any chessboard, so I may be blind.

Sven