Muller, Hyatt, Schroder and other elderly

[jefk]

being young and energetic is nice maybe, but is no
substitute for having experience. The highest ranking
in ICCF correspondence chess is still owned by
an 'old' guy btw, Joop van Oosterom.
Rather than bashing some people for being older,
you could better try to learn something from them
or at least from history and the body of knowledge which
has been built up sofar. Because those who do will for sure
get better results. In whatever area of life, i might add.
Although it's up to you ofcourse. And maybe you'll remember
these words year later, when it's already to late maybe.
jef

[kgburcham]

Well, so far I have not commented on it, but it seems to me the OP has a very strange and highly unrealistic image of the future.

Will future times abolish money and property, and will communism prevail after all? IMO, not very likely.
Will there no longer be any commercial engines in the future? Will the legal owners of copyright on such engines applaud when they are ripped off, and others start to hand out their product for free, just because they are young?
Would't there be young people that are not averse of a quick money grab in the future, who would not happily donate their idea for an improvement to the best open source program to the community, but instead close the source and market 'their' improved version?
Would those who did generously contribute to the open source be happy about that, just because they are young?

Young is not synonymous for 'completely stupid'. Greedy and immoral people are of all times and ages. As are honest and decent people. You don't have to be 'elderly' at all to be honest and decent. I don't think that will change.

good reading, thanks.

There are a few people in this world that when they decide to enter a competition, they will compete to win, obsessed with winning like no other competitor. If they have the knowledge, motivation, skill, energy, and open mindness (new ideas), and sometimes what some call no morals, then most of the time this person will win. In the future if this person shows up, he will be number one for a while and then disappear, and then some are standing around looking at each other saying, damn what happen.

kgburcham

[kgburcham]

clumsy bracketing together of Crafty and Stockfish with Houdini and Rybka

I assume you missed all of the posts about Crafty code being in a lot of programs.
kgburcham

[Sedat Canbaz]

Well, so far I have not commented on it, but it seems to me the OP has a very strange and highly unrealistic image of the future.

Will future times abolish money and property, and will communism prevail after all? IMO, not very likely.
Will there no longer be any commercial engines in the future? Will the legal owners of copyright on such engines applaud when they are ripped off, and others start to hand out their product for free, just because they are young?
Would't there be young people that are not averse of a quick money grab in the future, who would not happily donate their idea for an improvement to the best open source program to the community, but instead close the source and market 'their' improved version?
Would those who did generously contribute to the open source be happy about that, just because they are young?

Young is not synonymous for 'completely stupid'. Greedy and immoral people are of all times and ages. As are honest and decent people. You don't have to be 'elderly' at all to be honest and decent. I don't think that will change.

All of your questions: the time will show up...

But however, I think the sales of the commercial engines suffer due to Stockfish is available!

And it seems, there is a big competition between commercial and free engines and for right now the 'free' work is leading (based on top 20 standings):
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/?page_id=1049

Btw,
It makes me crazy, when I see X commercial engine is buggy (i mean crashes, freezing...and so on)

Best,
Sedat

[K I Hyams]

clumsy bracketing together of Crafty and Stockfish with Houdini and Rybka

I assume you missed all of the posts about Crafty code being in a lot of programs.
kgburcham

And your point is?

[Sedat Canbaz]

One thing more:

It makes me crazy too, when I see X commercial engine is without own book too

[Uri Blass]

being young and energetic is nice maybe, but is no
substitute for having experience. The highest ranking
in ICCF correspondence chess is still owned by
an 'old' guy btw, Joop van Oosterom.
Rather than bashing some people for being older,
you could better try to learn something from them
or at least from history and the body of knowledge which
has been built up sofar. Because those who do will for sure
get better results. In whatever area of life, i might add.
Although it's up to you ofcourse. And maybe you'll remember
these words year later, when it's already to late maybe.
jef

1)Joop van Oosterom does not play correspondence chess today and had bad results in his last tournaments

a)lees than 50% in a tournament from 2009-2012
http://www.iccf.com/event?id=19150

b)did not win the world championship in 2007-2010

http://www.iccf.com/event?id=13580

Other tournaments that he participated ended earlier than 2010

2)ICCF correspondence rating means nothing and today it is easy to get high correspondence rating thank to chess programs.

I can add that even before computers it was legal to consult in ICCF games with other players so the rating measured the ability of a team and not the ability of one person.

[kgburcham]

clumsy bracketing together of Crafty and Stockfish with Houdini and Rybka

I assume you missed all of the posts about Crafty code being in a lot of programs.
kgburcham

And your point is?

your being "clumsy" again
kgburcham

[jefk]

[quote="Uri Blass"]
Joop van Oosterom does not play correspondence chess today and had
bad results in his last tournaments
[/quote]

yes i know, it was just an example but anyway
he -or his 'team', ie Jeroen Piket have done well,
and he can be classified as someone who was
quite competent in computer chess as a 'user'.

some young kiddies could also classify Kasparov
as an 'old' guy, when he becomes Fide president.
but again, it's a guy with lots of experience in chess
and that matters in knowledge game like this.

for the rest i might comment later on things like
piracy, copyright, open source and so on, its obvious
that some things are gradually changing with
the internet, but its an evolution, not a revolution.

jef

[aturri]

But as a programmer, I don't like at all the idea to have a program contest full of clones or derivatives. And I prefer the lists where the clones or derivatives are reduced to the minimum possible. Nothing against the lists based on derivates, just I don't like them as more entrants you have in the list, more probability to get higher rating than the real deserved, and also because you are comparing programmers who worked a lot, with newbies that just changed some tens of lines or parameters.

Note that it is quite possible to organize tournaments in such a way that they are both fair and don't exclude anyone. If in a future World there is just 1 Komodo, 100 Stockfish derivatives, and 20 Ippolyt derivatives, you could start with a 9-round Swiss qualifiers in a Stockfish group and a 7-round qualifier in an Ippolyt group, and then let the winners of those compete with Komodo in a round-robin with, say, 10 games per pairing.

Sure. No problem with that, if at the end, there is only one program per engine family in the final.