Houdini 3 Oct 10 Release??

[MM]

<...>there will be no room left for conspiracy theories

There always will be room left for conspiracy theories.
For example I have a few

Regards,
Geno

I prefer to keep silence but i have an idea and i will have much to say after the release.

Best Wishes to everyone

[Uri Blass]

According to that test Stockfish 2.3.1 is stronger than Houdini 2.0c !!

That just demonstrates once again that self-play (i.e. playing related engines) overstates rating differences.

The new Houdini is plus 40 Elo at best when in falls in the arms of the testers who are living in the real world........

Note that I wrote at best....
Dr.D

My opinion is different
My guess is that
houdini3 is going to be at least 41 elo better than houdini2 in the ipon rating list.

I am going to wait to the ipon rating list before deciding if to buy houdini3 and we are going to see who is right.

[lkaufman]

At CCRL at LTC 40/40, Houdini 1.5a and Houdini 2.0c scored 49% and 50 % Against Komodo5.
So Houdini3beta at LTC 62%(!) against Komodo 5 is almost incredible.
But we have the games for proof.

I wouldn't be surprised if the improvement is less than 60 ELO, but my strong guess is that it must be 40 ELO at least and "even" that would be a very great achievement.

grts Bram

Code: Select all

The 3 long TC matches have now finished.

Houdini 3 - Komodo 5 match: +43 -19 =58
72-48 (+68 Elo ± 42 Elo).

Houdini 3 - Stockfish 2.3.1 match: +44 -16 =60
74-46 (+82 Elo ± 42 Elo).

Houdini 3 - Houdini 2.0c match: +48 -15 =57
76.5-43.5 (+94 Elo ± 42 Elo).

Download All the Games: http://www.cruxis.com/download/Houdini3_LongTC_Matches.zip

Over-all result: Houdini 3 scored 61.8% (+81 Elo ± 24 Elo) against the average of Houdini 2.0c, Komodo 5 and Stockfish 2.3.1.

Well, having the games is no proof of anything, this could just be the best of three results for example. I'm not accusing anyone here(.....)just pointing out the need for independent tests. More likely Houdini 3 was just luckier(.....) than Houdini 2/1.5 against Komodo; what is the improvement if you do the same comparison for the Stockfish match? It looks like you picked out one of the two (non-self play) results to make a point.

http://www.husvankempen.de/nunn/40_40%2 ... ons/4.html
perhaps this will say someting more ? 49% and 55% for H15 and H2 against Stfish 2.3 at CEGT 40/20 and 61,6% for H3 against stfish2.3 !

Well that would imply a somewhat smaller gain than the Komodo data, but still an excellent one. Since elo gains are almost always larger at faster time limits, these results would predict an IPON gain of maybe 75 elo or more. If the actual IPON rating does show such a gain I will be quite impressed and will offer my congrats to Robert, but until then I just don't believe it. If Houdini 2 could only show around a ten elo gain for a year, it would be pretty remarkable if the next year showed a gain like 75.

[Uri Blass]

At CCRL at LTC 40/40, Houdini 1.5a and Houdini 2.0c scored 49% and 50 % Against Komodo5.
So Houdini3beta at LTC 62%(!) against Komodo 5 is almost incredible.
But we have the games for proof.

I wouldn't be surprised if the improvement is less than 60 ELO, but my strong guess is that it must be 40 ELO at least and "even" that would be a very great achievement.

grts Bram

Code: Select all

The 3 long TC matches have now finished.

Houdini 3 - Komodo 5 match: +43 -19 =58
72-48 (+68 Elo ± 42 Elo).

Houdini 3 - Stockfish 2.3.1 match: +44 -16 =60
74-46 (+82 Elo ± 42 Elo).

Houdini 3 - Houdini 2.0c match: +48 -15 =57
76.5-43.5 (+94 Elo ± 42 Elo).

Download All the Games: http://www.cruxis.com/download/Houdini3_LongTC_Matches.zip

Over-all result: Houdini 3 scored 61.8% (+81 Elo ± 24 Elo) against the average of Houdini 2.0c, Komodo 5 and Stockfish 2.3.1.

Well, having the games is no proof of anything, this could just be the best of three results for example. I'm not accusing anyone here(.....)just pointing out the need for independent tests. More likely Houdini 3 was just luckier(.....) than Houdini 2/1.5 against Komodo; what is the improvement if you do the same comparison for the Stockfish match? It looks like you picked out one of the two (non-self play) results to make a point.

http://www.husvankempen.de/nunn/40_40%2 ... ons/4.html
perhaps this will say someting more ? 49% and 55% for H15 and H2 against Stfish 2.3 at CEGT 40/20 and 61,6% for H3 against stfish2.3 !

Since elo gains are almost always larger at faster time limits, these results would predict an IPON gain of maybe 75 elo or more.

I do not think that the "almost always" is going to be correct for houdini and I think that it dependent on the type of the improvements that you do.

For example better order of moves may make the program 10% faster at blitz but more than 10% faster at longer time control.

My guess is that you are going to find out that houdini3 scales better than Current Komodo(not in the meaning of elo difference but in the meaning of time advantage that komodo needs for result of 50%).

[Zhu.Jianzhao]

facebook is blocked in China

[Sylwy]

facebook is blocked in China

Unblock it !


SilvianR

[velmarin]

I have searched all the piggy banks in the house,

I think there is not enough.

I'll stay with my 100 elo less.

Or maybe make a hack with fernando and Moron.

Wait I thought the MP for Don and Larry,
but maybe my grandchildren have children then.

[Carlos Ylich]

facebook is blocked in China

You are very lucky, are not losing anything good.

[Dr.Wael Deeb]

According to that test Stockfish 2.3.1 is stronger than Houdini 2.0c !!

That just demonstrates once again that self-play (i.e. playing related engines) overstates rating differences.

The new Houdini is plus 40 Elo at best when in falls in the arms of the testers who are living in the real world........

Note that I wrote at best....
Dr.D

My opinion is different
My guess is that
houdini3 is going to be at least 41 elo better than houdini2 in the ipon rating list.

I am going to wait to the ipon rating list before deciding if to buy houdini3 and we are going to see who is right.

Fair enough Uri

[lkaufman]

Larry I also read that Komodo MP will soon follow the release of Houdini 3.Is that true and how is the MP coming along?

Don is hard at work on it, but I don't know when it will be ready. I only work on the underlying engine myself, which is improving day by day.











FWCC