I toast to LeelaqueenOdds and its creators. I raise my wine glass high and shout: Long live the queen. We have a queen!!

[Father]

Today IM Levy Rozman, the most popular chess streamer, played a five game match with LeelaQueenOdds at 5'3", winning by 3 to 2. Yesterday and today LQO is playing about 7000 games per day, maybe comparable to all the other bots on LiChess combined?! Just incredible interest. Meanwhile the knight odds bot defeated another top player, Alexei Sarana, by 12.5 to 0.5 in blitz (3'1"). Levy plans to play rook odds next.

A comet in the sky.
"It's a bird!!"
"It's a plane!!"
"Nooooo!!! It's IM wateenellende"
Superhuman sweeps LeelaQueenOdds 1-0!!

After a hundred games, he has dropped below 40%, but that is still far better than anyone else, I think the previous record was about 25%. But strangely, a Russian GM, Andrey Belozerov, FIDE 2400, playing the same bot at a leisurely 3'2" TC, lost by an astounding 14.5 to 0.5! I can't make any sense of that, it is absurd.

Good evening, Mr. Larry Kaufman. Expertise playing against chess machines seems to be one of the determining factors in obtaining certain desired results. Without a doubt, if you add being a Master to this, there will be more unbalancing elements. LeelaQueenOdds has dealt some beatings to advanced chess players with a bullet rating of 2303, where the machine beats the human 61.5 to 0.5 in CR 1+0. A few years ago, it seemed like pure and simple "science fiction." But no! It's reality in today's world.

Well, Leela can flag players at 1'0" so a shutout isn't so hard to imagine, but at 3'2" to win 14 games plus a draw out of 15 vs a GM still rated 2400 FIDE seems absolutely impossible. Anyway, today Hikaru joined the ranks of players taking on the Leela Queen Odds one minute challenge. He split 4 games alternating colors (so already not a fair comparison to the many top players who follow tradition and take Black), then gave himself White for a "tiebreaker" and won and called that a match win. Probably he didn't know that Leela was only trained to play White so only those games are relevant, so at 1 to 1 we don't know anything. He says he plans to play knight odds next, hopefully at a long enough time control to give him some chance.

D" Day.
We are witnessing the "D" day for the Grandmasters, who are taking the top spots in the standings.

LeelaQueenOdds Leaderboard

Next update in: 2m 10s
# Player Rating Games Last Game TC
1 SuperEasy 2890 152 2025-03-30 8+3
2 wateenellende 2834 154 2025-03-26 1+0
3 Former_Player 2761 288 2025-03-22 3+2
4 smeets 2622 27 2025-03-30 2+1
5 Orichess88 2597 68 2025-03-29 2+3
6 pozvonochek 2593 187 2025-03-13 1+0
7 jtcoach 2583 185 2025-03-22 3+2
8 pultis12 2565 251 2025-03-29 1+0
9 FinalSpot 2547 125 2025-03-29 3+2
10 Catecan 2545 800 2025-03-30 1+0
11 arturchix 2540 38 2025-03-27 2+1
12 Hissha 2518 38 2025-03-30 1+10

[Father]

Today IM Levy Rozman, the most popular chess streamer, played a five game match with LeelaQueenOdds at 5'3", winning by 3 to 2. Yesterday and today LQO is playing about 7000 games per day, maybe comparable to all the other bots on LiChess combined?! Just incredible interest. Meanwhile the knight odds bot defeated another top player, Alexei Sarana, by 12.5 to 0.5 in blitz (3'1"). Levy plans to play rook odds next.

A comet in the sky.
"It's a bird!!"
"It's a plane!!"
"Nooooo!!! It's IM wateenellende"
Superhuman sweeps LeelaQueenOdds 1-0!!

After a hundred games, he has dropped below 40%, but that is still far better than anyone else, I think the previous record was about 25%. But strangely, a Russian GM, Andrey Belozerov, FIDE 2400, playing the same bot at a leisurely 3'2" TC, lost by an astounding 14.5 to 0.5! I can't make any sense of that, it is absurd.

Good evening, Mr. Larry Kaufman. Expertise playing against chess machines seems to be one of the determining factors in obtaining certain desired results. Without a doubt, if you add being a Master to this, there will be more unbalancing elements. LeelaQueenOdds has dealt some beatings to advanced chess players with a bullet rating of 2303, where the machine beats the human 61.5 to 0.5 in CR 1+0. A few years ago, it seemed like pure and simple "science fiction." But no! It's reality in today's world.

Well, Leela can flag players at 1'0" so a shutout isn't so hard to imagine, but at 3'2" to win 14 games plus a draw out of 15 vs a GM still rated 2400 FIDE seems absolutely impossible. Anyway, today Hikaru joined the ranks of players taking on the Leela Queen Odds one minute challenge. He split 4 games alternating colors (so already not a fair comparison to the many top players who follow tradition and take Black), then gave himself White for a "tiebreaker" and won and called that a match win. Probably he didn't know that Leela was only trained to play White so only those games are relevant, so at 1 to 1 we don't know anything. He says he plans to play knight odds next, hopefully at a long enough time control to give him some chance.

D" Day.
We are witnessing the "D" day for the Grandmasters, who are taking the top spots in the standings.

LeelaQueenOdds Leaderboard

Next update in: 2m 10s
# Player Rating Games Last Game TC
1 SuperEasy 2890 152 2025-03-30 8+3
2 wateenellende 2834 154 2025-03-26 1+0
3 Former_Player 2761 288 2025-03-22 3+2
4 smeets 2622 27 2025-03-30 2+1
5 Orichess88 2597 68 2025-03-29 2+3
6 pozvonochek 2593 187 2025-03-13 1+0
7 jtcoach 2583 185 2025-03-22 3+2
8 pultis12 2565 251 2025-03-29 1+0
9 FinalSpot 2547 125 2025-03-29 3+2
10 Catecan 2545 800 2025-03-30 1+0
11 arturchix 2540 38 2025-03-27 2+1
12 Hissha 2518 38 2025-03-30 1+10

… One question please: Did GM Caruana, play against LeelaQueenOdds and LeelaKnightOdds? Thanks in advance.

[Father]

Today IM Levy Rozman, the most popular chess streamer, played a five game match with LeelaQueenOdds at 5'3", winning by 3 to 2. Yesterday and today LQO is playing about 7000 games per day, maybe comparable to all the other bots on LiChess combined?! Just incredible interest. Meanwhile the knight odds bot defeated another top player, Alexei Sarana, by 12.5 to 0.5 in blitz (3'1"). Levy plans to play rook odds next.

A comet in the sky.
"It's a bird!!"
"It's a plane!!"
"Nooooo!!! It's IM wateenellende"
Superhuman sweeps LeelaQueenOdds 1-0!!

After a hundred games, he has dropped below 40%, but that is still far better than anyone else, I think the previous record was about 25%. But strangely, a Russian GM, Andrey Belozerov, FIDE 2400, playing the same bot at a leisurely 3'2" TC, lost by an astounding 14.5 to 0.5! I can't make any sense of that, it is absurd.

Good evening, Mr. Larry Kaufman. Expertise playing against chess machines seems to be one of the determining factors in obtaining certain desired results. Without a doubt, if you add being a Master to this, there will be more unbalancing elements. LeelaQueenOdds has dealt some beatings to advanced chess players with a bullet rating of 2303, where the machine beats the human 61.5 to 0.5 in CR 1+0. A few years ago, it seemed like pure and simple "science fiction." But no! It's reality in today's world.

Well, Leela can flag players at 1'0" so a shutout isn't so hard to imagine, but at 3'2" to win 14 games plus a draw out of 15 vs a GM still rated 2400 FIDE seems absolutely impossible. Anyway, today Hikaru joined the ranks of players taking on the Leela Queen Odds one minute challenge. He split 4 games alternating colors (so already not a fair comparison to the many top players who follow tradition and take Black), then gave himself White for a "tiebreaker" and won and called that a match win. Probably he didn't know that Leela was only trained to play White so only those games are relevant, so at 1 to 1 we don't know anything. He says he plans to play knight odds next, hopefully at a long enough time control to give him some chance.

D" Day.
We are witnessing the "D" day for the Grandmasters, who are taking the top spots in the standings.

LeelaQueenOdds Leaderboard

Next update in: 2m 10s
# Player Rating Games Last Game TC
1 SuperEasy 2890 152 2025-03-30 8+3
2 wateenellende 2834 154 2025-03-26 1+0
3 Former_Player 2761 288 2025-03-22 3+2
4 smeets 2622 27 2025-03-30 2+1
5 Orichess88 2597 68 2025-03-29 2+3
6 pozvonochek 2593 187 2025-03-13 1+0
7 jtcoach 2583 185 2025-03-22 3+2
8 pultis12 2565 251 2025-03-29 1+0
9 FinalSpot 2547 125 2025-03-29 3+2
10 Catecan 2545 800 2025-03-30 1+0
11 arturchix 2540 38 2025-03-27 2+1
12 Hissha 2518 38 2025-03-30 1+10

… One question please: Did GM Caruana, play against LeelaQueenOdds and LeelaKnightOdds? Thanks in advance.

"Give to Caesar what is Caesar's and give to God what is God's." Upon reading this instruction or command, and observing the current top ten rankings, it can be deduced or observed that there are eight Masters on the list and only two in the top ten who do not hold the title of Master, numbers seven and ten. Will those who lack the title be able to maintain their position within the top ten? On the other hand, the overall ranking of the ranking is "increasing" to the point that the percentage above 2300 is very high, even above 2400 and increasingly above 2500, up to very close to 2900!! And when looking at the elo rating of the vast majority of the top 100, many of them are higher than 2300-2400 elo, up to 3000 elo or more. In short, "LeelaQueenOdds" is proving "true expertise." Seeing and not believing!' A Ginnes record!!

LeelaQueenOdds Leaderboard

Next update in: 10m 13s
# Player Rating Games Last Game TC
1 SuperEasy 2890 152 2025-03-30 8+3
2 wateenellende 2834 154 2025-03-26 1+0
3 Former_Player 2761 288 2025-03-22 3+2
4 Orichess88 2685 78 2025-03-30 2+3
5 smeets 2622 27 2025-03-30 2+1
6 pozvonochek 2593 187 2025-03-13 1+0
7 jtcoach 2583 185 2025-03-22 3+2
8 pultis12 2569 257 2025-03-30 1+0
9 Hissha 2568 48 2025-03-30 1+10
10 Catecan 2550 840 2025-03-31

[lkaufman]

… One question please: Did GM Caruana, play against LeelaQueenOdds and LeelaKnightOdds? Thanks in advance.

Caruana (handle Bombegranate) played 13 games of 3'2" blitz with LeelaKnightOdds a couple months ago, losing twelve and drawing just one. Someone said that he played LeelaQueenOdds, but unless he used a different handle this appears to be a mistake. Wei Yi, Ding Liren, and now Nakamura have played vs. LeelaQueenOdds, I don't know of any other really top super-GMs who have so far.

[M ANSARI]

I actually watched Hikaru play Queen Odds against SF at highest level, and while at longer time controls he crushed SF, he barely managed to win 3-2 at 1-0 time controls. I also saw a few games on Youtube where a GM got crushed playing Queen odds at 5-0 time control. That was impressive as hell !!! So I figured I would try it and see how that goes. I mean a Queen is a Queen after all, and watching the Youtube games of GM's and IM's getting crushed was scary !!! I am assuming that Lichess highest computer rating is Level 8 ??? I mean I tried at longer time controls and really it was too easy. I then went to 3-0 also very easy wins and not a single loss. Then I tried 1-0 ... and I beat it 10-0 ???!!! In some games I even won by mate with 37 seconds remaining for my time?? How is everyone else struggling with this? I consider myself an extremely slow "mouser" at Bullet and my rating is probably around 2200 to 2300... Hikaru is like over 3300 !!! I think I am playing the wrong SF as it says "Fairy SF 14 Level 8" ... how do I get to try this with full non "Fairy" SF at full strength like in the Youtube videos??
I tried looking for a Queen Odds bot but couldn't find it. I am guessing there is a special SF with a custom NN for playing Queen Odds?

[lkaufman]

I actually watched Hikaru play Queen Odds against SF at highest level, and while at longer time controls he crushed SF, he barely managed to win 3-2 at 1-0 time controls. I also saw a few games on Youtube where a GM got crushed playing Queen odds at 5-0 time control. That was impressive as hell !!! So I figured I would try it and see how that goes. I mean a Queen is a Queen after all, and watching the Youtube games of GM's and IM's getting crushed was scary !!! I am assuming that Lichess highest computer rating is Level 8 ??? I mean I tried at longer time controls and really it was too easy. I then went to 3-0 also very easy wins and not a single loss. Then I tried 1-0 ... and I beat it 10-0 ???!!! In some games I even won by mate with 37 seconds remaining for my time?? How is everyone else struggling with this? I consider myself an extremely slow "mouser" at Bullet and my rating is probably around 2200 to 2300... Hikaru is like over 3300 !!! I think I am playing the wrong SF as it says "Fairy SF 14 Level 8" ... how do I get to try this with full non "Fairy" SF at full strength like in the Youtube videos??
I tried looking for a Queen Odds bot but couldn't find it. I am guessing there is a special SF with a custom NN for playing Queen Odds?

Please post link to Hikaru video vs. Stockfish. That is news to me. No special Sf bot for queen odds, but current Sf is much better at odds play than Sf 14, also lichess level 8 uses just 1 thread and has a depth limit, 22 plies I think.

[M ANSARI]

I found out that the way to do it is to search for LeelaQueenOdds on Lichess and then press the links to either play black or white. I can tell you that the difference in play is NIGHT AND DAY ... !!! I played 5 games at 5 minutes blitz and lost 4 and drew 1 !!! That is with a full Queen advantage. Holy crap ... how is that possible! I felt like a total patzer. The way it plays is alien like and really very very humbling and very very annoying (saying that as a compliment to the BOT). Like someone disrespecting you and making fun of you and slapping you around ... and nothing you can do about it! I never knew after so many years of playing chess that I suck so much !!! I tried to play more games but was blocked ... I am sure I can find a system to beat it easily ... but it somehow only allows 5 games to be played and then just declines any more challenges. This shows you just how rich chess is ... and just how incredibly strong these new NN engines are!

Here is Hikaru playing against the Queen Odds Bot.

[M ANSARI]

Here is another video of a strong player trying the QueenOddsBot

What is certain is that this BOT is NOT playing just with the SF NN. It annoyingly avoids trading down even when the trade is to the advantage of the BOT and seems forced. Unlike the normal NN from SF ... which quickly allows trading when it is advantageous ... this one will hold on to material even if it means that it is detrimental to the position. It just avoids trades to keep as many pieces on the board as possible ... and that way us humans will have more chances of making mistakes.

I do wish that playing this BOT is easier as you have to do quite a bit just to play a game and you cannot rematch it. Once that happens, most likely systems can be developed to easily beat it. I mean a Queen is a Queen after all. But then again maybe the NN can also change and create more challenges.

[lkaufman]

Here is another video of a strong player trying the QueenOddsBot

What is certain is that this BOT is NOT playing just with the SF NN. It annoyingly avoids trading down even when the trade is to the advantage of the BOT and seems forced. Unlike the normal NN from SF ... which quickly allows trading when it is advantageous ... this one will hold on to material even if it means that it is detrimental to the position. It just avoids trades to keep as many pieces on the board as possible ... and that way us humans will have more chances of making mistakes.

I do wish that playing this BOT is easier as you have to do quite a bit just to play a game and you cannot rematch it. Once that happens, most likely systems can be developed to easily beat it. I mean a Queen is a Queen after all. But then again maybe the NN can also change and create more challenges.

I thought you were knowledgeable about computer chess, based on past posts, so I am shocked that you don't know the difference between Stockfish and Leela. They are completely different engines, Stockfish is CPU based and does normal Alpha-beta search, while Leela is GPU based and uses a version of Monte-Carlo search. Your question asked about playing Stockfish, so that's what I answered. The Leela odds bots are trained specifically for odds chess, so they are vastly superior to Stockfish at doing this.
Rematch is being worked on, may be available soon. The problem is that normally rematch flips colors. It is true that with experience good players do learn and improve their results, but it's not really "systems", just learning to be careful, how to simplify, etc. The bot does get upgraded frequently and becomes more challenging each time, but of course there are limits, with enough time strong players can win with an extra queen. At the present time, the level needed to exceed 50% in blitz (5'0" or 3'2") with queen odds (Leela White) is strong FM level, maybe 2350 FIDE or so. At 1'1" it is good GM level, about 2550 FIDE. At 1'0" it is Hikaru Nakamura level, no one else has reached 40% (and he hasn't played enough to prove that he can score 50% or more).

[Uri Blass]

Here is another video of a strong player trying the QueenOddsBot

What is certain is that this BOT is NOT playing just with the SF NN. It annoyingly avoids trading down even when the trade is to the advantage of the BOT and seems forced. Unlike the normal NN from SF ... which quickly allows trading when it is advantageous ... this one will hold on to material even if it means that it is detrimental to the position. It just avoids trades to keep as many pieces on the board as possible ... and that way us humans will have more chances of making mistakes.

I do wish that playing this BOT is easier as you have to do quite a bit just to play a game and you cannot rematch it. Once that happens, most likely systems can be developed to easily beat it. I mean a Queen is a Queen after all. But then again maybe the NN can also change and create more challenges.

I thought you were knowledgeable about computer chess, based on past posts, so I am shocked that you don't know the difference between Stockfish and Leela. They are completely different engines, Stockfish is CPU based and does normal Alpha-beta search, while Leela is GPU based and uses a version of Monte-Carlo search. Your question asked about playing Stockfish, so that's what I answered. The Leela odds bots are trained specifically for odds chess, so they are vastly superior to Stockfish at doing this.
Rematch is being worked on, may be available soon. The problem is that normally rematch flips colors. It is true that with experience good players do learn and improve their results, but it's not really "systems", just learning to be careful, how to simplify, etc. The bot does get upgraded frequently and becomes more challenging each time, but of course there are limits, with enough time strong players can win with an extra queen. At the present time, the level needed to exceed 50% in blitz (5'0" or 3'2") with queen odds (Leela White) is strong FM level, maybe 2350 FIDE or so. At 1'1" it is good GM level, about 2550 FIDE. At 1'0" it is Hikaru Nakamura level, no one else has reached 40% (and he hasn't played enough to prove that he can score 50% or more).

Orichess88 won the last 9 games against the queen odds bot at 2+3 and he is only FM so I guess weaker players than him can exceed 50% in blitz.

Orichess88's fide rating is 2340

I think that it is not exactly chess so it may be possible that some players with fide rating below 2200 can get more than 50% at blitz and at the same time some players with fide rating above 2400 do not get more than 50%