New Shredder 14 Released...

[Uri Blass]

I do not see more details but I do not believe it is 3751 elo ccrl when stockfish is only 3649 elo based on the CCRL rating list.
do not see source for Estimated strength improvement of >425 ELO in the link of the first post in this thread.

Look at this page and the "New In This Version" section:

https://www.shredderchess.com/windows/d ... er-14.html

I'm skeptical too, but let's see. Stefan hasn't claimed it's better than Stockfish. I'm infering that from the CCRL list and the +425 ELO claim.

— Steve

Stefan also did not say +425 in which list

In the blitz CCRL rating list I see
1 Stockfish 17.1 64-bit 8CPU 3789 +10 −10 62.2% −76.5 74.8% 3086
Stockfish 17 64-bit 3779 +9 −9 62.2% −75.9 73.4% 5597
Stockfish 18 64-bit 3775 +10 −10 57.9% −46.6 82.6% 4047
Deep Shredder 13 64-bit 4CPU 3337 +70 −70 41.0% +59.0 50.0% 50
172 Shredder 13 64-bit 3280 +7 −7 46.2% +29.0 46.9% 8193

In the FRC CCRL rating list I see
1 Reckless 0.9.0 4101 +8 −8 61.1% −66.9 74.1% 6418
2 Stockfish 18 4094 +9 −9 57.6% −45.3 78.4% 5897
72 Shredder 13 3392 +5 −5 41.0% +67.1 32.5% 21927

[Ajedrecista]

Hello:

It is too early to know about that +425 Elo claim... In single core, where scaling up faces diminishing returns? In ultra bullet TC, that exaggerates differences? In a direct match instead of a pool of engines, that usually inflates the difference a bit?

FWIW, the claim for Shredder 13 vs. Shredder 12 was +330 Elo (link of 26th November, 2016), when Stefan announced the release on 30th October, 2016 and Ingo claimed +334 Elo 20 minutes later, while Adam warned about Bayeselo vs. Ordo and the own Stefan funnily foresaw that Shredder 14 would not need that much time.

You can compare the +330 figure (Sh13 vs Sh12) against CCRL or CEGT now and try to make educated guesses about Sh14. I visited the single-CPU list of CCRL 40/2 archive (link) and saw the following:

Code: Select all

                                Rating
Name                       Elo     +     -     Score    Avg. Opp.    Draws    Games
Shredder 13 64-bit         3271    +8    −8    48.8%       +6.9      46.8%     6970
Deep Shredder 12 64-bit    2955    +8    −8    49.8%       +2.0      36.3%     5795
Shredder 12 32-bit         2952   +20   −20    59.0%      −62.4      38.1%      897

A bit above +310 Elo (without considering error bars) and fairly close to +330 Elo claim, so +400 Elo could be feasible after all? Going through current single-CPU CCRL 40/2 (link) and mainly agreeing with Gabor, probably a bit short of 3700 Elo in that list, in the range of Fritz 21 64-bit or Ethereal 14.25 64-bit, to give some known names. We will see.

Regards from Spain.

Ajedrecista.

[mar]

I mean who cares if it's #30 we have a massively improved original oldie engine coming from SMK himself, that's all that matters. go Shredder!

[mclane]

Whats the difference between the normal 14 and the deep version ?

Is the normal version only using 1 core and the deep version all cores ?
And the MAC Version runs on Intel macs or also on ARM Macs ?

[mehmet123]

Selling a program that can only use a single CPU core for €50 has to be some kind of April Fools’ joke. It’s basically a program made for a handful of collectors.

Moderation.

Mehmet Karaman, take note your signature has been deleted, links to an escort website are forbidden.

[royb]

Whats the difference between the normal 14 and the deep version ?

Is the normal version only using 1 core and the deep version all cores ?
And the MAC Version runs on Intel macs or also on ARM Macs ?

The biggest question about the Mac version is this: Is the app a native apple silicon version or is it an Intel version that would run today via Rosetta 2, but will break on MacOS 28 when that ships in fall of 2027. That's when Rostetta 2 is removed from MacOS by Apple.

[Werewolf]

Whats the difference between the normal 14 and the deep version ?

Is the normal version only using 1 core and the deep version all cores ?
And the MAC Version runs on Intel macs or also on ARM Macs ?

The biggest question about the Mac version is this: Is the app a native apple silicon version or is it an Intel version that would run today via Rosetta 2, but will break on MacOS 28 when that ships in fall of 2027. That's when Rostetta 2 is removed from MacOS by Apple.

And does the Mac version have the same feature set as the PC version. Previous versions didn’t.

[chessica]

Is "Shredder Classic 6" the stripped-down version of Shredder 14?

Code: Select all

    Program                          Elo    +   -   Games   Score   Av.Op.  Draws

  1 Stockfish 18                   : 3550   24  23   483    79.8 %   3311   40.4 %
  2 Cool Iris 16                   : 3548   21  20   609    79.1 %   3316   41.7 %
  3 Reckless 0.9.0                 : 3548   24  23   483    79.6 %   3311   40.8 %
  4 Revolution-5.90-140626         : 3547   24  23   485    79.5 %   3312   40.6 %
  5 Rems M-091024                  : 3529   23  22   482    77.8 %   3311   44.0 %
  6 Obsidian dev-16.08             : 3525   24  23   485    77.3 %   3312   42.9 %
  7 PlentyChess 7.0.26             : 3522   21  20   610    76.5 %   3317   44.1 %
  8 PlentyChess 8.0.0              : 3520   27  25   380    78.9 %   3291   42.1 %
  9 Tarnished v6.0 (Eternal)       : 3508   23  23   483    75.6 %   3312   43.9 %
 10 Berserk 14                     : 3505   23  22   485    75.2 %   3313   45.6 %
 11 Rebel 16.3a                    : 3482   35  34   231    66.5 %   3363   42.0 %
 12 Viridithas 20.0.0-dev          : 3479   24  24   482    72.3 %   3312   41.3 %
 13 RubiChess 20240817 (avx512)    : 3476   22  22   555    71.7 %   3315   43.2 %
 14 Chess System Tal 2.06 E1019    : 3445   24  24   485    67.9 %   3314   41.4 %
 15 RubiChess 20240817 (avx2)      : 3440   21  21   595    66.6 %   3321   42.7 %
 16 Maverick NNUE 1.0a             : 3402   22  22   612    61.4 %   3321   39.9 %
 17 Alexander 7                    : 3391   25  24   482    60.8 %   3315   38.6 %
 18 Shredder Classic 6             : 3373   29  28   380    61.1 %   3295   35.3 %
 19 Willow 4.0                     : 3361   25  25   482    56.5 %   3315   34.6 %
 20 Winter 4.0 JA BMI2             : 3353   23  23   614    54.4 %   3323   32.9 %
 21 Cheng 4.48a (bundled)          : 3326   26  26   485    51.3 %   3317   31.3 %
 22 Houdidit 6.03 Pro x64          : 3315   30  30   380    52.8 %   3296   27.1 %
 23 Komodo 14.1 64-bit             : 3314   26  26   485    49.5 %   3317   30.5 %
 24 EveAnn 5.0 64-bit (bundled)    : 3257   27  27   483    41.3 %   3318   24.2 %
 25 Myrddin 0.96                   : 3247   28  28   483    39.9 %   3319   23.0 %
 26 IsaBB NN 4.5 (avx2, bundled)   : 3221   28  28   482    36.3 %   3319   22.8 %
 27 Sable 1.6                      : 3198   30  30   483    33.2 %   3320   15.1 %
 28 Equinox 3.30 x64mp             : 3190   32  33   380    34.7 %   3300   20.0 %
 29 Critter 1.6a 64-bit            : 3179   30  31   482    30.8 %   3320   15.1 %
 30 monty 1.0.0                    : 3133   33  33   485    25.3 %   3322   10.9 %
 31 ECE 26.8 Intuition HBuP        : 3128   36  37   380    27.0 %   3301   10.3 %
 32 Spike 1.4.1                    : 3100   34  35   482    21.8 %   3322   10.0 %
 33 Colossus Chess 2026a           : 3062   40  41   380    20.0 %   3303    8.9 %
 34 Crafty 25.2.1                  : 3060   57  59   232    13.8 %   3378   10.3 %
 35 Rybka 1.0 Beta                 : 3056   40  41   380    19.5 %   3303   10.0 %
 36 Colossus 2025b                 : 3043   37  38   482    16.6 %   3323   10.4 %
 37 Pharaon 3.5.1                  : 2909   50  52   483     8.3 %   3327    5.4 %
 38 SOS 5 for Arena                : 2865   62  66   380     7.2 %   3308    3.4 %
 39 Quark v2.35Paderborn           : 2836   66  71   380     6.2 %   3309    2.9 %
 40 Yace 0.99.87                   : 2825   67  71   380     5.8 %   3309    3.7 %
 41 PatzerUCI/FRC                  : 2768   79  57   380     4.2 %   3311    2.1 %

[Roland Chastain]

Selling a program that can only use a single CPU core for €50 has to be some kind of April Fools’ joke. It’s basically a program made for a handful of collectors.

You really have a link to an escort girls page in your signature? Moderation accepts it?

[cpeters]

SMK, a software engineer, has released in the past for iphone and ipad and even linux (x86-64 and arm64). The demo (shredder6 classic) is a universal binary with two architectures (x86-64 and arm64). So yes, I don't think rosetta2 will be needed for the shredder 14.

greetings