universal engine standards

kranium · Post by **kranium** » Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:31 pm

a high level of scrutiny should be applied rigorously to all tournaments and engines.

the source code of each and every engine should be made avaiable to an independant expert/arbiter before each and every tournament. (Dann Corbit, Jim Ablett, for example...i.e someone who's expertise is not questioned, and has experience with most or all of the source code).

many tournament rules specify that in the event of a clone accusation, the source code must be given to the TD. rybka has been accused of being a clone by many, although as far as i know, the source code has never been demanded and inspected.

it seems that the chess community has put rybka on a pedestal. it has been number one for so long, and is so strong, that it has reached almost legendary stature, and an unassailable height. i know that a strong engine deserves admiration, but hypothetically, what if it were true? i.e. ...that rybka was based on fruit.

what a tradgedy and injustice for the chess engine community!

this is my last post about rybka, i've said enough. thanks for reading.

Norm

Zach Wegner · Post by **Zach Wegner** » Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:42 pm

kranium wrote:what a tradgedy and injustice for the chess engine community!

I'll say!

It would be nice if you actually followed the standards you set for others.

Albert Silver · Post by **Albert Silver** » Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:33 pm

kranium wrote:a high level of scrutiny should be applied rigorously to all tournaments and engines.

the source code of each and every engine should be made avaiable to an independant expert/arbiter before each and every tournament. (Dann Corbit, Jim Ablett, for example...i.e someone who's expertise is not questioned, and has experience with most or all of the source code).

many tournament rules specify that in the event of a clone accusation, the source code must be given to the TD. rybka has been accused of being a clone by many, although as far as i know, the source code has never been demanded and inspected.

it seems that the chess community has put rybka on a pedestal. it has been number one for so long, and is so strong, that it has reached almost legendary stature, and an unassailable height. i know that a strong engine deserves admiration, but hypothetically, what if it were true? i.e. ...that rybka was based on fruit.

what a tradgedy and injustice for the chess engine community!

this is my last post about rybka, i've said enough. thanks for reading.

Norm

McCarthy would have been proud.

Albert

CRoberson · Post by **CRoberson** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 12:09 am

Such rules pertain to a person entered in the tournament accusing.
Sense these are author tournaments, then an author of another engine
has to make the accusation. Accusations from people on the side lines
don't count.

Dr.Wael Deeb · Post by **Dr.Wael Deeb** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 12:50 am

CRoberson wrote:Such rules pertain to a person entered in the tournament accusing.
Sense these are author tournaments, then an author of another engine
has to make the accusation. Accusations from people on the side lines
don't count.

Correct,this is the practice that is going on till now....

GenoM · Post by **GenoM** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 10:24 am

Come on, guys, all of us know how Rybka began. Now Rybka looks like completely different animal but, you know, when one is growing up, he's changing in some way.
There is DOUBLE standards and all of us know that's a fact.

swami · Post by **swami** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:02 pm

Norman,

There are complaints about one of your Rybka threads, thread you created was just a baseless accusation and was deleted as a result. You could have just chosen a proper title when posting something about Rybka, instead you chose something of an accusation without any proofs and widely accepted beliefs. If the engine is proven to be a clone, then posts wouldn't get deleted as long as there is no personal attacks involved.

If someone starts a thread "Xyz is a clone" all of a sudden, then it is likely to get deleted unless he posts with acceptable thread title first and argue to prove it.

kranium · Post by **kranium** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:11 pm

swami,
i understand.

the evidence seems clearcut to me...but i do accept your decison.

norm

slobo · Post by **slobo** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:44 pm

kranium wrote:a high level of scrutiny should be applied rigorously to all tournaments and engines.

the source code of each and every engine should be made avaiable to an independant expert/arbiter before each and every tournament. (Dann Corbit, Jim Ablett, for example...i.e someone who's expertise is not questioned, and has experience with most or all of the source code).

many tournament rules specify that in the event of a clone accusation, the source code must be given to the TD. rybka has been accused of being a clone by many, although as far as i know, the source code has never been demanded and inspected.

it seems that the chess community has put rybka on a pedestal. it has been number one for so long, and is so strong, that it has reached almost legendary stature, and an unassailable height. i know that a strong engine deserves admiration, but hypothetically, what if it were true? i.e. ...that rybka was based on fruit.

what a tradgedy and injustice for the chess engine community!

this is my last post about rybka, i've said enough. thanks for reading.

Norm

As I said, Norman,

you should have worked hard, turned your program at the Rybka level, or better, and then almost no one would dare to challenge you.

A human society works this way, unfortunately.

universal engine standards

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