Christopher Conkie - Strelka...

[ArmoredGuns]

Hi

How is the Strelka engine? Have you found anything worth sharing yet?



Best


Chris

My opinion is that Strelka is too fat.
I changed strelka to have a smaller source that produce the same output.

I deleted some thousands lines from part of the tables that strelka use and wrote few hundreds of lines to calculate the tables in order to make strelka significantly smaller.

Uri

Hi Uri,

If you can, can you please share the executable?

[Christopher Conkie]

Has Vas said he wants to see the code? I have never seen him say that.
Can you provide a link where he has made that request?

Do you think he would such a thing in public? Please just trust me on this. I would not lie to you about this. It is a very good solution however.

Fabian does have the code and he has spent some time going over it. I am not sure what the hold-up is on his offering his opinion. I guess that it is not simple or perhaps just that he is very busy right now.

Probably busy (but then again....) I'm sure Vas has the time. It would solve the real issue here.

If it were found that it did contain Rybka things, GPL would be out of the question unless he wanted it that way. He has expressed such a view in his own forum. It would depend although on how much Rybka and the significance of that "how much".

Of course everything could be ok in which case no need for gpl unless the Strelka author wanted that. Of course it depends on how much Fruit is in it as well.....

I think your best bet is Vas.



Christopher

If Vas wants to see the code, why wouldn't he ask? I can see no reason for it whatsoever.

Am I missing something here? Most people think Strelka is like Rybka. Mr Osipov said it was a Fruit base with disassembled Rybka in it. Did Fabien ask for the code or was it offered to him to check? Regardless of that surely Vas would be the person who would know if Rybka was in there.

I can't imagine that Vas would not want to help in the same way that Fabien has (but not yet of course).

Vas said the following.....

"I will think a little bit about this. Maybe what I should do is get the Strelka 1.8 source code, claim it as my own, and release it under GPL."

Not an altogether bad solution but we will never know if he never gets to see it. I would have thought that the following statement might even make him out to be the obvious choice.

"At this point we don't know how Strelka was made. If I had to bet, I'd put my money on straight decompile with changes."

http://rybkaforum.net/cgi-bin/rybkaforu ... =1655;pg=3

You might get a GPL Strelka yet. What might happen instead is that every commercial engine get disassembled. I wonder if commercial authors would like that?

I do find it strange that only Fabien is reviewing the code considering this concerns both Fruit and Rybka.

Christopher

[Dann Corbit]

Has Vas said he wants to see the code? I have never seen him say that.
Can you provide a link where he has made that request?

Do you think he would such a thing in public? Please just trust me on this. I would not lie to you about this. It is a very good solution however.

Fabian does have the code and he has spent some time going over it. I am not sure what the hold-up is on his offering his opinion. I guess that it is not simple or perhaps just that he is very busy right now.

Probably busy (but then again....) I'm sure Vas has the time. It would solve the real issue here.

If it were found that it did contain Rybka things, GPL would be out of the question unless he wanted it that way. He has expressed such a view in his own forum. It would depend although on how much Rybka and the significance of that "how much".

Of course everything could be ok in which case no need for gpl unless the Strelka author wanted that. Of course it depends on how much Fruit is in it as well.....

I think your best bet is Vas.



Christopher

If Vas wants to see the code, why wouldn't he ask? I can see no reason for it whatsoever.

Am I missing something here?

Yes, an answer to my question.

Most people think Strelka is like Rybka. Mr Osipov said it was a Fruit base with disassembled Rybka in it.

The person claiming to be Mr. Osipov also said that Rybka was based on Fruit

Did Fabien ask for the code or was it offered to him to check?

It came about as a result of an email chain between myself, Fabian, and Mr. Osipov.

Regardless of that surely Vas would be the person who would know if Rybka was in there.

I agree. If he is interested enough to ask for it, I will mediate between the three parties. If he is not interested enough to ask for it, then I am not going to pursue it.

I can't imagine that Vas would not want to help in the same way that Fabien has (but not yet of course).

Then he will make the request.

Vas said the following.....

"I will think a little bit about this. Maybe what I should do is get the Strelka 1.8 source code, claim it as my own, and release it under GPL."

Not an altogether bad solution but we will never know if he never gets to see it. I would have thought that the following statement might even make him out to be the obvious choice.

"At this point we don't know how Strelka was made. If I had to bet, I'd put my money on straight decompile with changes."

http://rybkaforum.net/cgi-bin/rybkaforu ... =1655;pg=3

You might get a GPL Strelka yet. What might happen instead is that every commercial engine get disassembled. I wonder if commercial authors would like that?

It isn't illegal.

I do find it strange that only Fabien is reviewing the code considering this concerns both Fruit and Rybka.

Christopher

Using Fabien's code without permission is probably a violation of the GPL (depending upon how it was used). I do not know if this is the case or not and Fabian will be well qualified to say.

To reverse engineer from code is an entirely different sort of issue. It is possible that copyright infringement may have occurred (though I am definitely not expert enough to say).

I don't care if you think Vas wants the code. If he wants it and he says so, then I will see what I can do.

[Dann Corbit]

Hi

How is the Strelka engine? Have you found anything worth sharing yet?



Best


Chris

My opinion is that Strelka is too fat.
I changed strelka to have a smaller source that produce the same output.

I deleted some thousands lines from part of the tables that strelka use and wrote few hundreds of lines to calculate the tables in order to make strelka significantly smaller.

Uri

Hi Uri,

If you can, can you please share the executable?

I do not think that those who received the source code have been given permission to make and distribute modified versions (at least I was not granted that right).

[Christopher Conkie]

The person claiming to be Mr. Osipov also said that Rybka was based on Fruit

So you believe him about that? Is this your criteria for no inclustion of Vas?

The guy says it is Fruit and Rybka but because Rybka is based on Fruit according to him, you give it to Fabien only.

It came about as a result of an email chain between myself, Fabian, and Mr. Osipov.

No email exchange with Vas then?



You are becoming quite amusing....sorry, but at least i'm telling you the truth.

If he is interested enough to ask for it, I will mediate between the three parties. If he is not interested enough to ask for it, then I am not going to pursue it.

So Fabien does not ask but Vas must...right? How interested was Fabien? Not much it seems as you still have no answer.

Then he will make the request.

I just want to get this straight. No email exchange from you then...right?

Using Fabien's code without permission is probably a violation of the GPL (depending upon how it was used). I do not know if this is the case or not and Fabian will be well qualified to say.

Will he be qualified to comment on Rybka? As you have said (and of course we believe him) Osipov said Rybka is based on Fruit.

To reverse engineer from code is an entirely different sort of issue. It is possible that copyright infringement may have occurred (though I am definitely not expert enough to say).

Right......now I get it.....

It's not illegal.

But there might be copyright infringement.......

I don't care if you think Vas wants the code. If he wants it and he says so, then I will see what I can do.

Of course you don't care. And now we know why.......

Email exchanges don't happen with Vas but they do with Fabien. Rybka is based on Fruit. Fruit is GPL. So Rybka is GPL. Vas does not need to know as really....Fabien wrote Rybka. Disassembly is not illegal although there may be some copyright infringement.

Now I understand..............



Christopher

[Dann Corbit]

The person claiming to be Mr. Osipov also said that Rybka was based on Fruit

So you believe that believe him about that? Is this your criteria?

No. Not at all, but it brings into question everything else, including who it was who was making the post.

The guy says it is Fruit and Rybka but because Rybka based on Fruit according to him you give it to Fabien only. Give is the correct word.

It came about as a result of an email chain between myself, Fabian, and Mr. Osipov.

No email exchange with Vas then?



You are becoming quite amusing....sorry, but at least i'm telling you the truth.

If he is interested enough to ask for it, I will mediate between the three parties. If he is not interested enough to ask for it, then I am not going to pursue it.

So Fabien does not ask but Vas must...right?

Then he will make the request.

I just want to get this straight. No email exchange from you then...right?

Using Fabien's code without permission is probably a violation of the GPL (depending upon how it was used). I do not know if this is the case or not and Fabian will be well qualified to say.

Will he be qualified to comment on Rybka? As you have said (and of course we believe him) Osipov said Rybka is based on Fruit.

To reverse engineer from code is an entirely different sort of issue. It is possible that copyright infringement may have occurred (though I am definitely not expert enough to say).

Right......now I get it.....

It's not illegal.

But there might be copyright infringement.......

I don't care if you think Vas wants the code. If he wants it and he says so, then I will see what I can do.

Of course you don't care. And now we know why.......

Email exchanges don't happen with Vas but they do with Fabien. Rybka is based on Fruit. Fruit is GPL. So Rybka is GPL. Vas does not need to know as really....Fabien wrote Rybka. Disassembly is not illegal although there may be some copyright infringement.

Now I understand..............



Christopher

I have nothing further to say in exchange with you.

[Christopher Conkie]

The person claiming to be Mr. Osipov also said that Rybka was based on Fruit

So you believe that believe him about that? Is this your criteria?

No. Not at all, but it brings into question everything else, including who it was who was making the post.

Tremendous. We believe him.......sometimes.......when it suits us......if it even is him......which we don't know........unless he says something we like........then it IS him......

The guy says it is Fruit and Rybka but because Rybka based on Fruit according to him you give it to Fabien only. Give is the correct word.

It came about as a result of an email chain between myself, Fabian, and Mr. Osipov.

No email exchange with Vas then?

Email exchanges don't happen with Vas but they do with Fabien. Rybka is based on Fruit. Fruit is GPL. So Rybka is GPL. Vas does not need to know as really....Fabien wrote Rybka. Disassembly is not illegal although there may be some copyright infringement.

Now I understand.......or did I......maybe there is more....

I have nothing further to say in exchange with you.

Oh dear....am I on your blacklist as well?



Very funny Dann. You should be on the stage......

Christopher

[Ryan Benitez]

Oh dear....am I on your blacklist as well?

I am surprised he argued with you this long Chris. I think I am on the same blacklist too and have no idea why, either that or my emails are very spam box prone.

[Christopher Conkie]

Oh dear....am I on your blacklist as well?

I am surprised he argued with you this long Chris. I think I am on the same blacklist too and have no idea why, either that or my emails are very spam box prone.

We could disassemble your email client, fix the bug and repackage it if you like? If it's Thunderbird I think we should ask Bill Gates to review any modifications. It probably belongs to him after all......he would know if it was ok.....



Christopher

[Dann Corbit]

I have not put you on any blacklist.