Axiom ?

[Eraserheads]

I think engines that have a niche can still sell. Take for example Delfi Trainer. It is weaker than Toga 1.4 beta 5c and it does not have a GUI, yet it would still sell because it offers a special feature: it emulates an amateur human player. Some buyers would find this feature useful enough to warrant a sell.

A new chess engine-without GUI- weaker than Toga II 1.4 beta5c cannot be commercial !
Theoretically nobody wants to buy a such engine !
A new standard in commercial computer chess appeared !



Sylwy

[swami]

I disagree for several obvious reasons.

-Elo is not everything, and people should consider playing style into account, I absolutely like Chess System Tal's playing style, I don't think any chess engine has come close to such aggressive attacking playing style from Chess System Tal. CSTal is rated 2450 something, good enough for a 2000 rated players or beginners to learn from it and opt its style until he garners 2500 something...

-strongest programs do not always make the best move, even some moves from a 2700 rated engines could be trusted in analysis.

- need to have more 2700 rated commercials in one's collection, to include them in tourneys/division types for fun or having_ complete_ released engines ratings list. etc

I agree with one point though, that if you want only the strongest freeware engine to play with, you could just as easily download strong freeware engine and not care about commercial engines...

authors shouldn't pressure others to release the engine commercially else it would spoil their sales. That's not a good way to do it, I see some of pressurising going on, from some group of authors telling others not to do that, not to do this etc....

it is entirely up to freeware authors like Tord, Fabien etc to release the engine freeware or open source free...

[Tony Thomas]

I have heard of Djordge talking about Axiom before. Is it available yet? I would buy it even if it is weaker than Toga.

[Ovyron]

It seems that Loop is powering Wii Chess, so it has a GUI now!

Ah! I think that Loop is a great choice for this, as it's an expert in getting to positions that are very complicated to defend if you're not stronger than Loop. Its aggressiveness and playing style are very fun, and maybe it will have more persons becoming chess players.

[Sylwy]

Hi Tony !


I heared in this world they are a lot of eccentric collectors !
By the way- they are only exception !
Other reasons:
1.chess engines emulating a like human style.
The King is the best in this matter - having a lot of options and a very good .....GUI. And a question : which kind of style ? 1000 elo player,1500.......2500, Tal,Dan, Fisher,Steinitz...Tony...Sylwy
A hard matter !
2.chess engines good for teaching & training!
No ,no,no ,no........... if you want to play a good chess use please the training & teaching CD/DVD coming from Convekta,ChessBase.....
A chess engine -itself- never be able to teach you strategy/tactics/endings.......only blitz for amusement. And if you achieved an expert status- at least- you will be able to play a decent chess with a weak free chess engine
OK ! Correspondence chess is another matter-a bit of chess and a lot of documentation.

Toga II 1.4 beta5c has now around 2900 ELO-for free. I'm a legal owner of a lot of engines well enough below 2900 ( examples : SmarThink,Ktulu.....). From this moment my interest in commercial chess engines is directed only under 2900 ELO.
The GUI is another matter.

Regards,
Sylwy

[rdan1987]

Unfortunately for many , Mr Sylwy is right...strenght of an engine IS almost everything...and the new Toga is better than many commercial engines....I've talked with many chess players (above 2000 FIDE) and most of them use in their analysis ONLY Rybka and Fritz....
Anyway, computerchess fans can have for their fun as many commercial engines as they want.....is their choice....and their money !