Cheating in Chess

Discussion of anything and everything relating to chess playing software and machines.

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Uri Blass
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by Uri Blass »

Rolf wrote:
In real life any good master can tell after a couple of experiences with an amateur if he has the potential of becomning a master or if he will remain a patzer. A patzer isnt a bad player, but he isnt a master either.
I disagree about it.
I do not think that a good master can tell the potential of a player based on experience and I do not think that we know the potential of chess players.

I believe that the potential(assuming that the player is ready to train some hours per day) is practically higher than what most people believe and many players fail because they do not have the right trainers to help them or fail because they do not like to spend a lot of time on chess.

Uri
mjlef
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by mjlef »

lmader wrote:Here's a nifty article that gives some history of the topic, and includes the story about Allwermann:

http://www.chessbase.com/columns/column.asp?pid=190
How come if the article is about something ugly, like cheating, I somehow always get mentioned in it! :-)
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AdminX
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by AdminX »

mjlef wrote:
lmader wrote:Here's a nifty article that gives some history of the topic, and includes the story about Allwermann:

http://www.chessbase.com/columns/column.asp?pid=190
How come if the article is about something ugly, like cheating, I somehow always get mentioned in it! :-)
By that comment, of course you mean this: :wink:

"Finally I got some invaluable information from Mark Lefler, chess programmer and US government employee who is an expert on security at US embassies abroad. Apart from describing advanced electronic methods Mark opened a whole new can of worms by describing to me all the non-electronic ways in which information can be passed on – especially in the miniscule amounts needed for cheating in chess."
"Good decisions come from experience, and experience comes from bad decisions."
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Ted Summers
Fguy64
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by Fguy64 »

As a slightly different type of experience, on another forum, not chess related, I hooked up with a guy for some online games at Yahoo Chess. He aroused my suspicions before hand when he asked me to be patient because he was experiencing a 15 second lag on his internet connection. uh huh. He then proceeded to go 12 moves deep into a very topical line against my King's Indian, and blew my doors off with a thematic queenside attack. To make maters worse, he then went back onto the forum and bragged about how he whupped my ass. But he tripped over his own explanations, so we all knew what he was up to. The joy of chess.
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AdminX
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by AdminX »

Fguy64 wrote:As a slightly different type of experience, on another forum, not chess related, I hooked up with a guy for some online games at Yahoo Chess. He aroused my suspicions before hand when he asked me to be patient because he was experiencing a 15 second lag on his internet connection. uh huh. He then proceeded to go 12 moves deep into a very topical line against my King's Indian, and blew my doors off with a thematic queenside attack. To make maters worse, he then went back onto the forum and bragged about how he whupped my ass. But he tripped over his own explanations, so we all knew what he was up to. The joy of chess.
Challenge him to a rematch on Chesscube, I bet you beat his ass there at a fast time control. :lol: Or will the bot tricks work well there too!?
"Good decisions come from experience, and experience comes from bad decisions."
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Dr.Wael Deeb
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by Dr.Wael Deeb »

AdminX wrote:
Fguy64 wrote:As a slightly different type of experience, on another forum, not chess related, I hooked up with a guy for some online games at Yahoo Chess. He aroused my suspicions before hand when he asked me to be patient because he was experiencing a 15 second lag on his internet connection. uh huh. He then proceeded to go 12 moves deep into a very topical line against my King's Indian, and blew my doors off with a thematic queenside attack. To make maters worse, he then went back onto the forum and bragged about how he whupped my ass. But he tripped over his own explanations, so we all knew what he was up to. The joy of chess.
Challenge him to a rematch on Chesscube, I bet you beat his ass there at a fast time control. :lol: Or will the bot tricks work well there too!?
Yahoo Chess=shame for the whole chess community....
Dr.D
_No one can hit as hard as life.But it ain’t about how hard you can hit.It’s about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward.How much you can take and keep moving forward….
Fguy64
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by Fguy64 »

You may be right Dr. Deeb, but that isn't Yahoo's fault. I think they have a very good system, it's the people that abuse it. Usually I don't go for random pickup games, unless I'm really bored. I just connect with people I know.

Ted, as for ChessCube and fast chess, I really don't like to go under 15 min, I'll do 5 if I'm asked, but my reflexes are nowhere near fast enough for bullet.

Regards.
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AdminX
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by AdminX »

Fguy64 wrote:You may be right Dr. Deeb, but that isn't Yahoo's fault. I think they have a very good system, it's the people that abuse it. Usually I don't go for random pickup games, unless I'm really bored. I just connect with people I know.

Ted, as for ChessCube and fast chess, I really don't like to go under 15 min, I'll do 5 if I'm asked, but my reflexes are nowhere near fast enough for bullet.

Regards.
Well I can understand that I like 15 3 R myself! 8-) I also try to stick with Playchess, FICS, and Chess Assistant Club as my main playing locations.
"Good decisions come from experience, and experience comes from bad decisions."
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by james uselton »

What about ethics in chess? It may not be cheating but it is in the same ballpark. And even the very best do it---Take Botvinnik and his famous chess thermos swindle against Tal for example. Or, the incident where he advises Geller "to rock about on your chair several times, as many players do in a vain attempt to fine a plan."
The guy had a million of them!

What about the guy who is stretching his legs, checking out other boards in the tournament hall. He looks over at his board and sees his opponent bent over the board, his hands cupped over his eyes, he is intense in his concentration. The guy, who is strolling, says---What the hell is this guy looking at---he is dead in the water---this game is over!!!

But his opponent continues to study the board and he continues to stroll. Eventually his strolling takes him into the vicinity of his board---And he sees his clock is running! He hurries over to the board and punches his clock and his opponent extends his arm in congratulations.

Hey!---Its in the ballpark! What about Tal's stare, or rocking the table, or Mecking! In the quarterfinals of the candidates he complained to the arbiter the Korchnoi was breathing to loudly. If the arbiter approached you and said---would you please breath more quietly---would that put you off your game. :wink: :wink:
Fguy64
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Re: Cheating in Chess

Post by Fguy64 »

yeah, wrt the ethics stuff, it's wrong but there is not much you can do.

The touch move rule can cause problems. I had a game once where it was pretty much a losing position, but my opponent's hand was hovering above a piece that would have given me good draw chances. Anyways, I could not tell if he was touching the piece, but his fingertips could not have been more than 1/4 - 1/2 inch from the piece. I claimed touch move and called the td. I lost that appeal, and the game. I was not happy. As far as I am concerned, there is no difference between hovering very close and actually touching the piece.