Online Cheaters

[swami]

Impossible for people to cheat when time control is either 3+0 or 1+0 (these are the most popular time controls as far I know)

So, I'd estimate probability of 5 out of 1000 in blitz 3+0, and 0 out of 1000 in bullet 1+0

i have had a Sysop watch me play 4 minute blitz games and he confirmed the opponent was using an engine
one tell tale sign is when i get mated
the move comes in instantaneously almost the second i release the mouse

Steve

Which server? It must be an engine vs human match. It's impossible to let human use engine to play against human in ICC or playchess and improve the human rating. The software doesn't allow that.

what rating??
i said i play UNRATED games
Steve

You said that a post later, or after I asked this question.

[Steve B]

there is an announcment almost evert 30 seconds that someones rating has been deleted due to using software

Can't be 30 seconds else we'd be seeing red bold fonts messages every once in a while.

I believe there is an announcement of this kind in red font at the probability of every one and half hours in playchess, or sometimes once every two hours, or maybe never in few hours time you logged in.

huh??
every 30 seconds perhaps one per minute
i play in the Cafe so i dont know if that makes a difference??
Steve

[swami]

there is an announcment almost evert 30 seconds that someones rating has been deleted due to using software

Can't be 30 seconds else we'd be seeing red bold fonts messages every once in a while.

I believe there is an announcement of this kind in red font at the probability of every one and half hours in playchess, or sometimes once every two hours, or maybe never in few hours time you logged in.

huh??
every 30 seconds perhaps one per minute
i play in the Cafe so i dont know if that makes a difference??
Steve

I haven't been much around in the cafe but I don't think it was that often else it would have irritated me to see this annoying messages in bold red fonts every 1 minute. But in main playing hall it was once in a long while.

[Steve B]

Impossible for people to cheat when time control is either 3+0 or 1+0 (these are the most popular time controls as far I know)

So, I'd estimate probability of 5 out of 1000 in blitz 3+0, and 0 out of 1000 in bullet 1+0

i have had a Sysop watch me play 4 minute blitz games and he confirmed the opponent was using an engine
one tell tale sign is when i get mated
the move comes in instantaneously almost the second i release the mouse

Steve

Which server? It must be an engine vs human match. It's impossible to let human use engine to play against human in ICC or playchess and improve the human rating. The software doesn't allow that.

what rating??
i said i play UNRATED games
Steve

You said that a post later, or after I asked this question.

no i said that in my INITIAL POST
read it again

Steve

[swami]

Impossible for people to cheat when time control is either 3+0 or 1+0 (these are the most popular time controls as far I know)

So, I'd estimate probability of 5 out of 1000 in blitz 3+0, and 0 out of 1000 in bullet 1+0

i have had a Sysop watch me play 4 minute blitz games and he confirmed the opponent was using an engine
one tell tale sign is when i get mated
the move comes in instantaneously almost the second i release the mouse

Steve

Which server? It must be an engine vs human match. It's impossible to let human use engine to play against human in ICC or playchess and improve the human rating. The software doesn't allow that.

what rating??
i said i play UNRATED games
Steve

You said that a post later, or after I asked this question.

no i said that in my INITIAL POST
read it again

Steve

No. It was a post later.

In initial post you wrote this:

i have had a Sysop watch me play 4 minute blitz games and he confirmed the opponent was using an engine
one tell tale sign is when i get mated
the move comes in instantaneously almost the second i release the mouse

Nowhere is the mention of "unrated games"...

[Steve B]

Impossible for people to cheat when time control is either 3+0 or 1+0 (these are the most popular time controls as far I know)

So, I'd estimate probability of 5 out of 1000 in blitz 3+0, and 0 out of 1000 in bullet 1+0

i have had a Sysop watch me play 4 minute blitz games and he confirmed the opponent was using an engine
one tell tale sign is when i get mated
the move comes in instantaneously almost the second i release the mouse

Steve

Which server? It must be an engine vs human match. It's impossible to let human use engine to play against human in ICC or playchess and improve the human rating. The software doesn't allow that.

what rating??
i said i play UNRATED games
Steve

You said that a post later, or after I asked this question.

no i said that in my INITIAL POST
read it again

Steve

No. It was a post later.

In initial post you wrote this:

i have had a Sysop watch me play 4 minute blitz games and he confirmed the opponent was using an engine
one tell tale sign is when i get mated
the move comes in instantaneously almost the second i release the mouse

Nowhere is the mention of "unrated games"...

my initial post in this thread
i mention unrated Blitz games twice
in the first sentence and in the sixth sentence
http://www.talkchess.com/forum/viewtopi ... 72&t=30420

[Uri Blass]

What percentage of online chess players do you think cheat?

Good Question
i occasionally play unrated blitz games on Playchess and over the years i have played on Fics and ICC
i think cheating is rampant on all of the various Chess Servers and no one server is worse then the other
i remember a thread here years ago where Dr. Robert Pawlak(author of "The Chess Software Book" and noted computer chess authority) discussed an article he wrote for Chess Life mag ..where he estimated that the cheating incidence rate for "Standard" games was about 30% across all servers
from my experience of the latest few years in unrated blitz games i would say about 65% are cheating with computers(using computers to generate the move without declaring themselves as a computer account)
amazingly this includes those playing as unregistered guests

Steve

My experience is clearly different.
I play correspondence games for rating when computers are not allowed accept database and it is very clear that most players do not cheat(I also play in the ICCF when computers are allowed but I talk only about games when computers are not allowed).

My guess is that only 1-2% of the people who play chess in the internet cheat by using chess engines to generate their moves even in time control that it is easier to cheat(correspondence games and not blitz).

I think that even when chess engines are allowed significant part of the players do not use them(I do not play in ICCF against players who do not use chess engines but it is only because I play only against players with an high rating)

Edit:I do not play recently in the chessbase server but I remember that when I played there for rating points I could easily get better rating than most players without cheating both in blitz and in standard

My experience was that the weak players tend to play standard because they cannot play blitz without big mistakes so the level of 1600 standard players was even lower than the level of 1600 blitz players(I had rating that is significantly higher than 1600 both in blitz and in standard but I was better than the majority so the level of most of my opponents in standard and blitz is not relevant for the discussion)

Edit 2:Note that I did not vote in the poll.
My opinion is clearly less than 5% and there is no option that is smaller than 5% so I could not vote.

Uri

[M ANSARI]

I think there is software that allows move generation without the servers knowing about it. I know for a fact that I have played against a human using computer generated moves even at 1 0 without the server catching them. I can check it out later when analyzing the games. You can usually tell the games, they usually take all material given to them and are totally not worried about getting mated because the computer knows there is no mate. When a 1800 manages to find 12 "only" moves to mate you in a position that seems like he is losing chances are that he is cheating. Having said that you can avoid cheaters as you end up blocking them, and after a while you end up playing some of the same guys and you know who they are and what openings they play. I don't play rated anymore because I am tired of getting cursed because my internet connection is not too fast. But I think that cheating is not too much these days on the faster time controls. I usually stick to d2 f4 with white which I can easily win on time against a human using computer assistance at these fast time controls, but ofcourse not computer generated moves.

[playjunior]

I play blitz on playchess and have never really "felt an engine" opposite; I sometimes analyze tactical games afterwards and never encountered anything like M ANSARI said, i.e. someone doing a dozen of only moves.

[bnemias]

one tell tale sign is when i get mated
the move comes in instantaneously almost the second i release the mouse

I don't necessarily consider that a clear sign of being a computer. In many situations it's possible to premove these mates, and thus defend against guests who decide to let their time expire because they are sore losers.