My two cents on Rybka's disqualification

[garybelton]

you have proof that Fire/Ippolit are clones of Rybka?

Yes. Search for and read the post by Larry Kaufman on this forum where he says that recognizes his eval from Rybka 3 in Ippolit, If you are unable to do this then I can provide you the link

I don't mind cloners but please do not get above your station.

[kranium]

you have proof that Fire/Ippolit are clones of Rybka?

Yes. Search for and read the post by Larry Kaufman on this forum where he says that recognizes his eval from Rybka 3 in Ippolit, If you are unable to do this then I can provide you the link

I don't mind cloners but please do not get above your station.

my 'station'?
you mean like a 'slave' or 2nd class citizen, or something?

sorry i forgot a very important extremist Christian fundamental...i.e
everyone has a station in life from which you should never rise above!
oops...my bad!

i speak my mind..if you don't like don't read it.

i see your point now: 100s of lines of identical code is not good enough to convince you of wrongdoing in Rybka,
but some weak and never followed up vague statement by LK constitutes absolute proof?

it's getting more and more ridiculous by the minute.
yes, by all means provide a link to his proof. let's discuss it further...

[poisonedpawn]

i really don't see what the issue is, or why anybody is still defending this man. in the early days he was an active poster here and on his own forum, yet for a few years now, certainly the last couple of years he has been virtually silent, a myth! the fanboys defended him by saying he was sooooo busy due to being a father now. well i am also a father, as i suspect are most posters here and to be so busy to not even find time to make the odd post, or to communicate with his loyal followers and customers seems a pretty lame excuse and basically pathetic to my mind. then it was 'but hes so busy developing his engines/cloud rubbish' etc etc. yes, just like many other engine authors who are not too aloof and godlike to communicate with their bread and butter.
then, after the claims against him surfaced more concretely how did he decide to defend himself? well, in short, he didnt. he had every opportunity, yet he chose not to. we all know a criminal has a right to silence, but by the same token common sense tells us that an innocent man would do all in his power to defend himself and 'prove' his innocence, i know i certainly would anyway, especially if my reputation and livelyhood depended on it. otherwise people are bound to draw a negative inference. when it came to travelling thousands of miles to enter the tournaments organised by these very same people (when it guaranteed great promotion and boosted the sales of his engine that is) he could always find the time, or when it came to making accusations against other engine/clone authors he seemed to find the time, yet to make a defence of himself seemed oh so much time and trouble.
well i for one don't buy it and anybody with any common sense will also not buy it. luckily it seems the powers that be also didn't buy it. but now, instead of that beign an end to it we are still getting the 'aw, poor vas, people are down on poor vas' nonsence. the man is a crook pure and simple, a swindler, a cheapskate, a plagiarist and a very sneeky snake indeed. that certain people are still defending this man, in the light of all the evidence against him, and despite the fact that he made no effort at all to defend himself and has since remained silent beggers belief.

[garybelton]

i have no 'station' in life, who the hell are you to judge me?

I am judging you by your contribution to engine elo. If Fire was +300 over Rybka or Houdini then I would be telling you how great you were. As it is, thanks for the UCI parms.

[garybelton]

I think it's really simple why people are defending this man. they think he will provide another +100-200 Elo over Houdini. His innovations in Search make this a real possibility given his track record with Rybka 3 (+300 Elo). So all the chess junkies are hoping, they are wondering whether Vasik will do it, or if Robert will do it.

[kranium]

i have no 'station' in life, who the hell are you to judge me?

I am judging you by your contribution to engine elo. If Fire was +300 over Rybka or Houdini then I would be telling you how great you were. As it is, thanks for the UCI parms.

*Luke 6:37
"Do not judge others (especially by contribution to engine elo), and you will not be judged"

*my apologies to any non-christian readers

[garybelton]

Luke 6:37

I am certainly not judging your fitness for the afterlife but as a chess engine author. Your programming skills are far in advance of mine for sure. But I am looking for an increase in Elo (Junkie, if you will).

[Dann Corbit]

Luke 6:37

I am certainly not judging your fitness for the afterlife but as a chess engine author. Your programming skills are far in advance of mine for sure. But I am looking for an increase in Elo (Junkie, if you will).

By this measure, almost every chess engine is useless, since the Elo is hundreds below Houdini.

I guess that withing a few months you will see significant Elo increase in Fire. Bug removal does wonders for correctness in operation.

[kranium]

Well done on releasing Fire source btw, but it's just a Rybka 3 ripoff. Good luck with gaining +300 Elo on it (I suspect no chance).

well, i've really just begun...please give me 5 years, like Vas had.

6 Fire 1.5 xTreme x64 2936 17 17 1375 73% 2759 35% NEW + 32
31 Rybka 3 w32 2858 16 16 1520 74% 2687 31%

sorry, almost forgot...
please also give me:

tons of financial support, world-wide recognition and praise, high-end servers to test on, support of a big international corporation, a bevy of top-notch beta testers, Larry Kaufman, a top-quality opening book writer, and of course a flock of deranged devotees...

better yet...give it to Robert Houdart if ELO is the sole criteria!

[michiguel]

I think that it's important to separate two things:

1) Person being guilty/not-guilty
2) Right for the fair trial

1) Going through the evidence, it looks very likely for me that Vasik Rajlich has copied fragments of code and load of contants from other programs and put them into Rybka. This violates GPL and rules of the ICGA.

2) However no matter how overwhelming the evidence looks like even mass-murderers deserve the right for fair trial (instead of direct hanging). Based on the documents I've seen, my opinion is that Vas didn't get an honest chance to defend himself. In Western trials there are three parties: prosecutor(s) (Party A), defendant(s) (Party B) and neutral judge(s) (Party C). For me it really looks like that in this cases same people have been prosecutors (A) and judges (C). I'm pretty sure that many people who have been writing/collecting so called "report" are far from neutral. In history the legal system where prosecutor = judge is known as inquisition. Who would one try to defend himself in front of such a system?

P.S. For example this sarcastic sentence from the report shows how far from the neutrality report really is: "Opinions on the criteria for what constitutes improper cloning or copying vary. We think using Rajlich’s own definition is good, which he wrote during the Strelka cloning postings:". Come on guys, let's hang the man with his own rope!!!

P.P.S. I don't have any kind of personal relationship to Vasik Rajlich and my attitude towards him is very close to neutral.

+1

Not to mention flaws such as leaking information to the public while the panel was gathering information, misrepresentation of who was submitting the report.. etc. (looked like the panel and its members, but not everybody approved it) The language of the report is completely biased. Who wrote it? How many voted to approve it? who signed it? this is not clear, but anyone who registered is listed even if they did not participate (A. Silver, for instance).

One thing is to be guilty, and another is to be demonized.

As I said before, I cannot care less about VR, but procedures of this kind are extremely important.

Miguel